Forum - View topicChrono Crusade and 9/11
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v1cious
 Posts: 6242 Location: Houston, TX |
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so i was rewatching episode 20 last night and i can't help but think this episode was supposed to be a direct reference to 9/11, from imagery right down to Aion's speech to Rosette at the end. at first i thought it was just a simple coincidence, but then i saw this:
http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chronocrusade205hs.jpg http://snopes.com/rumors/cross.htm what do you guys think? Last edited by v1cious on Sat Jul 01, 2006 6:37 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Dargonxtc
 Posts: 4463 Location: Nc5xd7+ スターダストの海洋 |
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well I haven't seen the series, so it is hard to put anything that is said into context. But finding crossbeam in the shape of a cross in a collapsed building is not all that unusual. From the description ANN gives, and the picture of one of them in a nuns outfit, they were probably looking for anyway to throw a religous symbol in the series.
Again it is hard to say of the intentions without knowing what was said. |
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selenta
 Subscriber Posts: 1774 Location: Seattle, WA |
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coincidence imo. A piece of wreckage from a big building like that that just happens to be in the shape of a cross? Not that unlikely really, thinking about the geometry involved in the I-beams I'm almost surprised it doesn't happen more often. Maybe it DOES happen more often, but workers would only think something of it in the debris of a catastrophe.
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one3rd
 Posts: 1819 Location: アメリカ |
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The show is full of pseudo-Christianity. Do you really need to find a link to something else to explain the random appearance of a cross?
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Deltakiral
 Posts: 3338 Location: Glendora, CA (Avatar Hei from Darker than BLACK) |
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Till next time, Delta Kiral |
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v1cious
Posts: 6242 Location: Houston, TX |
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see it's not just that, it's the whole scene. anyone who's seen the episode will know what i'm talking about. |
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selenta
Subscriber Posts: 1774 Location: Seattle, WA |
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I've seen the scene, but I don't remember thinking anything special; I don't think it's a specific reference to 9/11, just a reference to tragedy in general.
EDIT: forgot the word "don't" 
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biliano
Posts: 956 Location: Cleveland, OH |
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Daisuke Moriyama mentioned in an interview that the main reason why he chosed the 1920s as the setting for Chrono Crusade was because he wanted to place the series in some bygone era rather than the present. He felt that the 1920s was a colorful, glamorous time when the shadow of war had retreated. Because of this reasoning, and the fact that he didn't participate that much in the production of the anime, if there was an alledged reference to the 9/11 terrorist attacks, that probably was the by-product of Studio GONZO wanting to take the anime version at a more darker level rich with occult elements. Studio GONZO did address Moriyama-san about some of the plot points of the manga that they wanted to develop into the anime, and Moriyama-san thought that having the anime version be a reflection of the individuals who were there would result in amuch higher-quality work, which is why he left the final structure of the anime entirely up to the studio. I watched Episode 20 a couple of times and not once did the thought of 9/11 popped in my head. Mainly because I know that the anime is set in the 1920s, but mostly because I was focusing on the characters and the intensity of the storyline during that particular episode. My feeling is that there are no references to 9/11 contained in that or any episode of Chrono. |
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NeonGEvangelion
 Posts: 141 Location: El Paso TX |
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The thought that there might have been a reference did pop into my head. Some might think of it as a direct coincidence, but some tend to think more deeply on the subject matter (Like myself). I have to rewatch the episode to get Aions speech but atm I feel that the cross in the series and the one found at ground zero to have a slight connection. It might be an utter coincidence, but I tend to think differently. Ill get back with you when I get home a view Epi 20. NGE out.
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Azathrael
 Posts: 745 |
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Very funny read. So, assuming it's not a "direct" coincidence (Then what's an indirect coincidence?), what possible significance can there be for Chrno Crusade, an anime based on a time period before 9/11, to copy a scene from 9/11? Does 9/11 serve as some kind of epitome of tragedy for the Japanese anime industry? Does 9/11 have any kind of special meaning to pseudo-Christianity? There are a lot of very important and significant references to real life events in anime. But one must learn to look for them where they're appropriate and hold some meaning, not where they can and will be dismissed as a coincidence, or some personal whim of whoever made that scene. |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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There is no way to tell, maybe you should ask the creators, but I think that it's just a coincidence. Although a very tragic in our country, this is the 5th year AD 9/11.
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Deltakiral
Posts: 3338 Location: Glendora, CA (Avatar Hei from Darker than BLACK) |
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Ok I spent sometime last night watching that volume from start to finish just so I would have the feel of series at that point. Didn't get a chance to post now because of work, and after this I am going to bed, early day tomorrow (have to be up at 5) with work and then AX. From what I could tell it does look like a random happening. 9/11 was such a big event in the US that it would seem somewhat hard to not believe that there might be some sort of true in the cross out of the building. But as mention by Dargonxtc it would be odd not to find one just because of geometry, so it could be all chance. One thing that does point out some type of connection would be the people in the streets as they watch the town be destoryed.
I remember watching TV on 9/11 and seeing people come out with the same look, it was a very powerful day and very tragic day. It strange how major events shape a generation, everyone who witnessed 9/11 will be able to tell their grandkids where they were when it happened. My folks are always saying that how they can remember when JFK was killed, and my grandfather with Pearl harbor. Till next time, Delta Kiral |
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bahamut623
 Posts: 1463 |
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That was the first thing that popped in my head when I saw that too. I don't really think they might have been trying to make any kinda statement or anything, but someone on the staff was probably inspired by that image. Sure, beams in the form of a cross in wreckage seems like it could happen very easily and often, but really, how many times in your life have you actually seen it outside of the WTC wreckage?
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Keonyn
Subscriber Posts: 5567 Location: Coon Rapids, MN |
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Quite often actually, it's not a rare occurence in the least simply because the way buildings are constructed with short horizontal supports between long vertical supports. When we collapsed the shed at my parents cabin there was no shortage of wood beams that broke in much the same way, creating crosses. We were going to burn the wreckage, but our nieghbor that helped out thought it might be bad luck to burn cross shaped beams so we spent a good half hour prying them apart.
When you think about it, a cross really isn't a rare shape and if you look at wall plans of a building you could easily pick out hundreds of potential cross shapes, draw lines right in the plans and a lot of it could look like nothing more than a bunch of crosses attached to each other. It's not unlikely at all to think of a structure falling down that a decent number of those parts are going to break in such a manner to resemble crosses. It's possible that 911 might have been on their mind, but nothing in the imagery or the speech really singles it out and couldn't be used to also reflect other tragedies in recent times. I just think the standing cross is one of many religious and darker toned imagery that the series has in no short supply. |
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