Forum - View topicThis Week in Anime - Caught Up in this Season's Whirlwind of Romance Anime
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FilthyCasual
Posts: 2397 |
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*reeks |
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NovaDreamer
Posts: 5 |
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It's sad to see judgements like this one presented so confidently. When people discuss this show, it's clear who has and hasn't read the manga. The development of the male lead in the source material does the opposite of validating his perspective. It's a shame these reviewers likely won't stick around long enough to see his growth play out, and that they won't see the payoff when the lead's gross behaviors are challenged. It's also funny they mention that they'd prefer the focus on other characters of certain demographics. If they stick around, this show might surprise them in more ways than one. |
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Eilavel
Posts: 136 |
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I'm glad to take your word for it, but nothing in the opening of the series communicates that. The onus is on the show to do so, not on reviewers to have already read the plot. |
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bassgs435
 Posts: 373 |
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He already starts changing a little on episode 1. His entire development should also not be rushed in a single episode when the manga's planned for a long run. I think the reviewers should simply not be so cynical and prejudiced. Nothing says a reviewer needs to assume the worst of a show and is the job of a first episode to prove these people wrong i'm sure many beloved shows by these critics can have similar bad faith readings of their first episodes |
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NovaDreamer
Posts: 5 |
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That's true! But I'm also allowed to be dismayed, and express that dismay, in moments like these. Maybe someone will read my comment and give the show another chance. In general, I find the snap judgments necessary for early reviews of longformat shows to be largely unhelpful. This is an example of why. But that's a discussion for another thread, I think. |
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Nigel Planter
Posts: 110 Location: London, UK |
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Personally one of the main appeals of anime to me is it doesn't go for the 'general audience'. So I'm fine with 2.5 being a harem fanservice show that props up Masamune or Twilight being specifically for BL fans. That's what makes these shows and others interesting in the first place.
I also hope the reviewers are not intentionally misgendering Makoto and refusing to use his preferred pronouns. |
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ktarf
Posts: 36 |
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Yeah, it's quite bizarre to see people referring to Masamune as if he's a serial killer or something, when he's a totally harmless otaku who's just never found anyone to share his passion with. I think he's quite funny, but you can find him obnoxious or unlikable without being so preachy about it. And yes, using the argument that he doesn't "change" in a grand total of one episode is definetly bad faith.
By the way, I don't really get what the point of these columns is when the two talking have pretty much always the same opinions. It results in an uninteresting back and forth of "yes" and "exactly". |
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NovaDreamer
Posts: 5 |
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Thank you for expressing this! I agree: I clocked development in episode 1. Maybe that's my affection for the manga talking, but I saw the beginnings of growth. That's why the review bothered me, I think. It feels like they stopped paying attention and judged the show within the first few scenes, content to write it off before the credits rolled. But shows can and often do surprise us, and I wish they'd keep a more open mind about this one. You can't appreciate an "after" without seeing the "before," first. And we're getting the "before" of this progatonist in all his awful otaku glory. I just hope word spreads that the "after" is worth waiting for. |
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AverageAnimeFan
 Posts: 66 |
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How is it bad faith to have not read the source material?
They're talking about the show, not the manga. As an adaptation, who knows how accurate it'll be to the source material? Familiarity with the source being a prerequisite is usually a sign of a bad adaptation though (in my opinion). |
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TsarPlatinum
Posts: 41 |
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I don't know about "bad faith" or whatever but it's obvious the reviewers are not big fans of otaku-focused stuff so disliking 2.5 Dimensional Seduction is explained by it being a male wish fulfillment show. I also get the feeling anything not LGBT related gets dismissed easier, especially if they think the same otaku show would be better if it focused on a LGBT girl character rather than a straight otaku or the comment on a BL anime being aimed at BL fans rather than an LGBT audience.
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NovaDreamer
Posts: 5 |
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Generally I agree! The good news is that this one is sticking pretty close to the source so far. My general uneasiness with this review is a symptom of my uneasiness about review culture in general, which depends on being first-to-market to gain traction with audiences. It's just really unfortunate that slow-burn series (and 2.5DS definitely is one!) benefit from being given time to find their stride, rather than being judged based on their first eps. Seeing it happen to a story I'm fond of stings a bit. Full disclosure: I have a ton of empathy for these reviewers! I can absolutely see why they have the opinions they do. They're in a crunch to watch everything, and first impressions of Episode 1 are all they have. It's no wonder 2.5DS's first ep stood out the way it did. I definitely don't blame them for their opinions, but I do lament that they may sway people away from what turns into a wonderful, touching story. (I've cried over the manga at least four times, which likely sounds quite improbable if all you've seen is episode 1.  )
I maintain that I'm allowed to be dismayed that 2.5DS doesn't benefit from this kind of review culture, however. And again, hopefully commentary from fans of the IP can help the show find its audience. I think people who stick around will be glad they did. <3 |
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bassgs435
Posts: 373 |
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It's bad faith to assume he'll never change and act like a flawed MC who slowly changes means the show is pandering or validating the MC just because he doesn't go through rushed major developments in a single episode. I'm anime-only and I can see what the show's going for This isn't a "read the source material thing". This is a "try to be more open-minded and less hateful". |
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Andrew Cunningham
 Posts: 524 Location: Seattle |
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I really admire Stepsister's commitment to its tone. They've got the confidence that this is the pacing the material needs, and are sticking to their guns with it, even if it loses them some viewers.
(Alya and Losing Heroines have equally confident direction, but are far closer to what we expect from anime tonally.) My biggest concern is that after three episodes it still hasn't convinced me it has the substance to back up this approach. And it has a weird habit of jump cutting in a way that obscures key beats. Like I legit wasn't sure what to make of the scene in episode two where she's talking about selling herself; my best guess is that she was testing him to see if he believed the rumors about her, but I'm really not confident in that, and making that hard to follow doesn't really do the show any favors. |
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lossthief
ANN Reviewer
 Posts: 1440 |
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I don't doubt that he goes through some kind of character development, but nothing in the first episode suggests that said development will be interesting or satisfying. His reaction to Ririsa's introduction is to gatekeep her; making assumptions about her tastes based solely on being a girl, gloating in his head that his sexy figures will scare her off, more or less quizzing her about his favorite anime, and only agreeing to let her join once he's convinced she likes the same things as him for the same reasons. He hasn't really been challenged on his very familiar brand of nerd chauvinism by the end of the episode. He hasn't learned to compromise or share in even a small way. There's no impetus recognize that other people can like different things with the same interest and passion as him. The only thing that's changed is that he's found a real-life girl who has all the same appeal as his idealized 2D crush, right down to looking just like her in cosplay. Maybe he does get better. Maybe the show will eventually push back on his chauvinism in a way that actually challenges his misogyny. But it certainly doesn't in the first episode, nor does it hint any ways that it might in the future. Nothing about his dynamic with Ririsa shows any dramatic avenue for him to even have a chance to, since she's totally enamored with him as her senpai and shares his taste in everything. The main conflict that's left hanging at the end of the episode is whether or not the two are interested in eachother romantically. |
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kgw
 Posts: 1193 Location: Spain, EU |
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While I also agree that 2.5DS improves quite a lot (YMMV) from the first chapters/volume of the manga, it's also true that Okumura is a bit of a jerk in those episodes and the manga is a "two-hot-girls-for-every-otaku" wish-fulfilment one for a while.
It's impossible to skip over that in the first chapters or pretend that the original script failures aren't there. And there is this kind of law when watching an adaptation: "the book/manga doesn't matter". The anime should work by itself for everyone, even if they have not read the first 20 volumes. To be fair, the anime has somewhat toned down some of the fanservice and rushed up hints of Okumura's problems*, but holding on to the feeling that reviewers (or anyone else) should love a series for what has NOT yet been shown and that "it'll get better in 20 chapters" will only lead to you becoming an angry ghost and being exorcised by geek ghostbuster**. *spoiler[Mom/serious trust issues by retcon] ** Ghostbuster Osamu. Never forget |
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