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REVIEW: Serial Experiments Lain BD+DVD


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eyeresist



Joined: 02 Apr 2007
Posts: 995
Location: a 320x240 resolution igloo (Sydney)
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:32 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
So why the special treatment? Simple. It's an acknowledged masterwork. One of the few series to legitimately lay claim to the tricky label of classic; a rare pinnacle of the anime art, as close to perfection as something so deliberately strange and messy can be.

That's just, like, your opinion, man.

Lain: terrific style; stupid, stupid story. But obscurantism flatters the egos of some self-styled intellectuals.

[/snark]
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amagee



Joined: 08 Nov 2010
Posts: 333
Location: Orlando, FL
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:33 pm Reply with quote
Animegomaniac wrote:
LainCowboyEvangelion


Spike piloting an Evangelion embedded with the consciousness of Lain! I'd watch that in a heart beat!
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amagee



Joined: 08 Nov 2010
Posts: 333
Location: Orlando, FL
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:48 pm Reply with quote
eyeresist wrote:
Lain: terrific style; stupid, stupid story. But obscurantism flatters the egos of some self-styled intellectuals.


The use of obscure words apparently flatters others.

But Serial Experiments Lain doesn't merely flatter those of us here discussing it in the casual environment of an internet forum. Lain is considered a masterpiece - or at least close to one - by people who write professionally in regards to the field of anime. Carl Kimlinger, for example, writes for one of the most respected English anime websites; he is certainly no "self-styled intellectual."

This is no way, shape, or form means that everyone has to agree though (heck, I know people that can't sit through Citizen Kane). It's about doing so with civility.
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ikillchicken



Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 7272
Location: Vancouver
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:33 pm Reply with quote
eyeresist wrote:
But obscurantism flatters the egos of some self-styled intellectuals.


See, once again, this is where I think all the people whining are full of it. If you don't like Lain then that is just fine. You're free to go ahead and state your opinion to that effect. But don't be dick man. You don't need to piss on everyone who does like the show by accusing them of being "self styled intellectuals" just looking for an ego boost. Why don't you just have some confidence in your own appraisal of the show and let it stand on its own without these sad little attacks on the people that disagree with you.
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dewlwieldthedarpachief



Joined: 04 Jan 2007
Posts: 751
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:48 pm Reply with quote
amagee wrote:
But Serial Experiments Lain doesn't merely flatter those of us here discussing it in the casual environment of an internet forum. Lain is considered a masterpiece - or at least close to one - by people who write professionally in regards to the field of anime. Carl Kimlinger, for example, writes for one of the most respected English anime websites; he is certainly no "self-styled intellectual."

This is no way, shape, or form means that everyone has to agree though (heck, I know people that can't sit through Citizen Kane). It's about doing so with civility.


Given the choice, I'd probably watch Lain again, but comparing the two it's clear to see how one is masterful and the other isn't. Citizen Kane is like a finely tuned clockwork of film-making, and you don't have to like it to appreciate that. Lain is like a beer bottle shaped in the likeness of a laughing Buddha; curious, even compelling, but ultimately what does it contain that is truly remarkable?
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supercreep



Joined: 11 Dec 2011
Posts: 526
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:18 pm Reply with quote
I'm going to be honest. On some level, I simply cannot understand people that dismiss Lain. You can not like it (I guess,) it can not be your cup of tea...but I cannot wrap my mind around dismissing it. Hype is, unfortunately, capable of destroying a good work. But a series like Lain, to me, is a masterpiece. It struck something in me, and I feel sorry for those that have some bitterness toward it, and other such "masterpiece" shows.
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor


Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 7912
Location: Anime News Network Technodrome
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:30 pm Reply with quote
eyeresist wrote:
Quote:
So why the special treatment? Simple. It's an acknowledged masterwork. One of the few series to legitimately lay claim to the tricky label of classic; a rare pinnacle of the anime art, as close to perfection as something so deliberately strange and messy can be.

That's just, like, your opinion, man.

Lain: terrific style; stupid, stupid story. But obscurantism flatters the egos of some self-styled intellectuals.

[/snark]


God this is an obnoxious thing to say. Listen to yourself.
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Gewürtztraminer



Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 1028
Location: Texas - Its like whole other country.
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:41 pm Reply with quote
supercreep wrote:
I'm going to be honest. On some level, I simply cannot understand people that dismiss Lain. You can not like it (I guess,) it can not be your cup of tea...but I cannot wrap my mind around dismissing it. Hype is, unfortunately, capable of destroying a good work. But a series like Lain, to me, is a masterpiece. It struck something in me, and I feel sorry for those that have some bitterness toward it, and other such "masterpiece" shows.


I saw it via Netflix around the 2007 time frame.
At the time, most anime I watched, I bought afterwards.
Never had the desire with this show, because I did not feel it worth watching (for me) ever again. Not bad, but not worth owning.

Now that it is available for a reasonable set price I may give it another shot, and have a copy to loan. Did the same thing with Ergo Proxy.

Out of all the Abe involved works, I think my most like is Technolyze. A first episode with I think one line of dialog? Interesting.
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noigeL



Joined: 14 Feb 2012
Posts: 149
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:53 pm Reply with quote
I don't think I'd quite give it the +, but Lain is A-material in my book. It's an ambitious show that was quite ahead of it's time. I'm about 2/3 of the way through re-watching it on BD and the themes and social commentary have aged surprisingly well for the most part. Think I'll go watch another episode now.
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Shippoyasha



Joined: 28 Aug 2007
Posts: 459
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:54 pm Reply with quote
There is no justification for A+ in animation score. This show is great but it is not a high level animation, visually. And frankly, the bluray transfer is very lazy. Basically every modern anime on Bluray blows Lain out of the water. Again, great show, but the animation score is absurdly biased.
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amagee



Joined: 08 Nov 2010
Posts: 333
Location: Orlando, FL
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:23 am Reply with quote
dewlwieldthedarpachief wrote:

Given the choice, I'd probably watch Lain again, but comparing the two it's clear to see how one is masterful and the other isn't. Citizen Kane is like a finely tuned clockwork of film-making, and you don't have to like it to appreciate that. Lain is like a beer bottle shaped in the likeness of a laughing Buddha; curious, even compelling, but ultimately what does it contain that is truly remarkable?


I want to make it abundantly clear that I wasn't attempting to compare the "masterpiece" status of Serial Experiments Lain with that of Citizen Kane.

When it comes to declaring something an "objective" masterpiece for everyone everywhere - as Citizen Kane is - it is merely a result of society as a whole accepting the majority subjective opinion of professional and amateur reviewers/viewers/whatever as canonical and true.

Given Serial Experiment Lain's mere existence as an anime - a fringe interest around the world - it can never be called a masterpiece in the same manner as Citizen Kane.

Consequently, comparing "masterpiece" moniker between the two items is ultimately pointless.
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Fronzel



Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 1906
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:05 am Reply with quote
aeris2001x2 wrote:
Serial Experiments Lain is like the Anime movie Angel's Egg, and movies 2001 and The Tree of Life. Good movies too be sure but they concentrate too much on the depth and forget to make them fun and about people to care about, they forget emotion and adventure.

That is why Evagelion, Ghost in the Shell and GITS SAC, Cowboy Bebop, Gunslinger Girl first series, 8cm per second and the like are better, because they fuse intellect with emotion and/or epic adventure. They are things you want to watch for the fun and the characters, not just to explore it's themes.

Are you really insisting that every show have adventure in it?
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xScar



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 288
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:13 am Reply with quote
Shippoyasha wrote:
There is no justification for A+ in animation score. This show is great but it is not a high level animation, visually. And frankly, the bluray transfer is very lazy. Basically every modern anime on Bluray blows Lain out of the water. Again, great show, but the animation score is absurdly biased.

Are you really calling a remastering where they actually went back and reanimated parts of the show lazy? Really?

Also, video quality and animation quality are two entirely different aspects. Of course most modern shows will look better than a late 90's show on Blu-ray... but I would totally beg to differ that most modern shows have better animation.
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Shippoyasha



Joined: 28 Aug 2007
Posts: 459
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:29 am Reply with quote
xScar wrote:
Shippoyasha wrote:
There is no justification for A+ in animation score. This show is great but it is not a high level animation, visually. And frankly, the bluray transfer is very lazy. Basically every modern anime on Bluray blows Lain out of the water. Again, great show, but the animation score is absurdly biased.

Are you really calling a remastering where they actually went back and reanimated parts of the show lazy? Really?

Also, video quality and animation quality are two entirely different aspects. Of course most modern shows will look better than a late 90's show on Blu-ray... but I would totally beg to differ that most modern shows have better animation.


I can agree with that there are modern anime that are not the most amazing in terms of animation. Lain obviously had some work put into it, but I feel it could have gone further. Which is why the A+ score sounds top heavy to me. The fidelity of how it actually looks on screen just is not wowing me. Of course, barring a few shows out there that are lazily or purposely using DVD transfer for Bluray.

My point is that it just is not a show I would rave about how it looks on Bluray or even on DVD.
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor


Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 7912
Location: Anime News Network Technodrome
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:33 am Reply with quote
"You liked this more than I did, which means you're wrong."
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