Forum - View topicNEWS: On-Demand Printer Refuses to Print Yaoi Press Book
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vashfanatic
 Posts: 3492 Location: Back stateside |
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Except it's clear that what they didn't like was the nudity, not the kissing (never mentioned). If the same publisher also does coloring books (again, it's PR more than anything, even if it isn't sold to children) of heterosexual pornography, then it's hypocritical. Otherwise, it's a legitimate complaint to bring against it. And while I don't agree with all of what Lonecow says, I have to say, I do think a lot of yaoi is more or less exploitative on the same level as lesbian porn aimed at men. Just plain BL, on the other hand, with plots and character development with a little sex thrown in, is another matter altogether. |
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evilnekohilda
 Posts: 166 Location: Wichita, KS |
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I got a different impression from the post on the Yaoi Press site where they showed one of the images (the one I described) that was cited in the rejection. I guess there's nudity in that one too, but not what I would consider offensive. My decency meter may be a little skewed though... haha.
Agreed. Although my personal opinion is still in the vein of "what's wrong with that?" lol XD |
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Expias
Posts: 176 |
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Heh. I'm one of the minorties in the Yaoi/Yuri fandom being a lesbian. Anyways, I think they have a right to this. I did find the Amazon thing a debacle but there are so many things at issue here.
It's a coloring book. You can see all the things that can go wrong here. I mean I still remember the news article where either Borders or B&N had Absolute Boyfriend and there was an outcry. Parents will think oh a coloring book, give to child, and then bam issues. Not to mention the workers who would have to work and see what they're publishing (essentially being forced to "see porn"). About Handley, I wouldn't say it's the reason but it may have played a part. Also, about Handley, Neil Gaiman, author of The Graveyard Book and Coraline has tweeted and blogged about this case. Not sure if he could be considered anime/manga comm as I think he's been in comics comm but yes. He's tweeted about it. |
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sashaisme
 Posts: 75 |
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*sniffs sarcastically*
I can see why they would not publish it... I mean, really... My sis (8 years, and violent) would see one of the pictures, go to mom, and say "What's that?". The cover looks funny, though. 
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poonk
 Posts: 1490 Location: In the Library with Philip |
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I understand the argument about the publisher not wanting to expose employees to nudity or sexually explicit pictures, as long as it's applied consistently to all types of visual erotica (otherwise as vashfanatic pointed out that would be hypocritical and then, in my opinion, worthy of scorn). However, the argument that "since it's a coloring book it could somehow be given to children" I find pretty unconvincing. It's not like the cover features teddy bears riding unicorns through flowery fields, only to switch to-- surprise!-- full frontal nudity inside. Any parent with half a brain could tell from the cover that it's not for kids. Not to mention, this item is probably something buyers would have to special order, in which case they know exactly what they're getting because they want it and sought it out. Especially considering I'm pretty sure it's going to cost quite a bit more than the average kids' coloring book (which is what, like 99 cents?). It would require a rather unlikely series of events (and/or blatant stupidity) to "accidentally" get this into the hands of a child.
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poisondusk
 Posts: 67 Location: Brighton, UK |
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Why are people getting so worked up over the fact that it's a colouring book? I know that the specific term is usually associated with children, but it's really common for amateur artists to practice colouring using lineart from professional or popular artists. This isn't even a BL thing - loads of popular artists on deviantART put up their lineart for people to colour. YP would probably have been better off providing it as a download pack or something.
As for the printer refusing, it's their choice and they have every right to refuse if they want to. I think the annoyance on the part of YP comes from the fact that they had already used the same printer before with no difficulties, and the use of the word 'disturbing' to describe the images (which were really pretty tame). The printer could at least have used some tact/professionalism and refused it using a less provocative term. |
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mangaka-chan
 Posts: 283 |
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I have actually been looking for a place to print my doujinshi cheaply. This is a surprisingly useful bit of news for me.
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vashfanatic
Posts: 3492 Location: Back stateside |
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You clearly don't know how stupid some parents can be. I watched parents bring a three-year old into a PG-13 rated anime movie on the grounds that because it was animated it had to be for childre (said child then had to be carried from theater crying in terror later). I could easily see an idiot parent shrugging and not realizing what they were getting. That said, I doubt this would ever have been on the shelf anywhere. But it's so niche marketed (people over eighteen who are interested in yaoi and want a coloring book) that an actual printed version (versus a downloadable digital version) seems like a giant waste of money. |
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gynocrat_rex
 Posts: 57 Location: Texas |
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Boy, these yaoi articles bring all the loons to the yard. >.>
On topic - The Handley case had nothing to do with this. Many of us making self-produced BL knew that Docucopies didn't produce erotic material - I had them in my sidebar for ages with a warning 'NO Gay! No Adult'. Many POD printers are like this - ComixPress, KaBLAM, and others. It's not about "gay'; it's about 'ero'. When Yaoi Press produced a doujinshi with them I was shocked because I knew from past experiences with Docucopies that they weren't into producing erotic material - but she did it and I assumed that they simply changed their policy. It seems, however, that someone ran the print job without really checking the contents. 
Some companies, like LuLu, don't check close enough - but other companies do. It happens. It happens to larger niche publishers like ALC [Yuri publisher], and others. When we produced RUSH through Dramaqueen, we were lucky to have a printer like Brenner, they didn't judge the content - but eventually even Brenner stopped producing adult material also.  This has been going on long before Handley. It's the nature of the beast and most ero publishers know this before going into it.
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gynocrat_rex
Posts: 57 Location: Texas |
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They are pretty good in terms of pricing, but make sure you read the tutorial before proceeding - also, make sure you don't have any sex or eroticism in it. |
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RadicaLElly
 Posts: 194 Location: Coral Springs, FL |
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For all the people who've been talking about parents possibly buying this for kids thinking its a normal coloring book:
Was this something YP was planning on selling in retail stores? I've never seen YP stuff carried in any of the stores near me outside of dealer rooms. I'm not sure how many parents go through the effort of going online to search out coloring books to buy their kids. I know when I was a kid it was more of an impulse buy if I saw one I liked while out shopping with my mom. I agree the printer has the right not to print it if they don't want to, I'm just curious how likely it is that scenario would happen. |
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poonk
Posts: 1490 Location: In the Library with Philip |
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CCSYueh
 Posts: 2707 Location: San Diego, CA |
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You obviously don't see very many of those "natural male enhancement" ads talking about "this chubby santa". How much smut do we see connected to "kid stuff?" I seem to recall some European Disney employees getting in trouble over simulating sex while in recognizable costumes of beloved cartoon characters. Hell, your argument wears thin at this entire site considering cartoons ARE for kids, aren't they? Why would ANYONE make cartoons of adult concepts? And the sleaze goes from innocent (I saw mommy kissing Santa Claus) to downright adult, doesn't it? I swear I've seen adult themes portrayed in simple form (Dick & Jane type stuff) so one can't really scream about an adult coloring book.
The mom I watched at Comic-con international didn't bat an eye when her 8 yr old grabbed one of each of the postcards netcomics had laid out for their yaoi. The girl showed mommy & commented on how pretty it was & the mommy agreed. However, this is most likely only going to be sold on the net, at comic shops or comic conventions.
I'm not bothering you You can have all the smut you want. I'll take my smut. There. We're all happy |
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britannicamoore
 Posts: 2618 Location: Out. |
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I disagree with them not printing it. But why didn't they just print the other pages and then have someone else do them?
I don't know the state of printed books and such- considering that trend is dying slowly I would think the printers need the money. I guess not. |
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vashfanatic
Posts: 3492 Location: Back stateside |
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....wha...? I'm not sure what any of this has to do with what I'm saying. All I meant was that there are very few people who would both 1) want to buy a coloring book and 2) be of an age that they could legally buy something with nudity and sex scenes. Hence, it might not be worth their money to print out copies since they wouldn't necessarily sell that many. A digital version would make more sense, especially since a lot of coloring of manga takes place on computers at this point. While it is true that the idea that "cartoons" (really animation) is for children persists among many Americans and other non-Japanese, clearly there is a large enough demographic who realizes this is not the case that allows for adult-themed anime to be profitable. If you have evidence that large numbers of yaoi fans also like coloring books, feel free to offer it. There's nothing necessarily incompatible between pornographic material and coloring books, just that the number of people who would be interested in buying them would be very, very small - hence not worth a publisher's time and money. And are you saying it's good that we have smut tied in with kids' stuff??? All the stuff on Disney and chubby santas (???) has me completely confused. It makes no sense. |
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