Forum - View topicBuried Treasure - Genocyber
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blind_assassin
Posts: 755 |
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So as long as the person having their intestines ripped out their throat has a beard and a penis it's better? I don't advocate violence against kids or women but acting like violence against men is less of a travesty or to pretend that kids and women don't get killed just as brutally in the situations that cause brutal violence (usually war or psychotic revenge warpaths by superbeings) is just retardedly hypocritical. If anything, I think it should be shown more often but more tastefully. It's easy to exploit the shock value of it in things like Genocyber when everyone thinks like you do but it can be used dramatically as well. And no, I'm not calling you out and being a dick to you intentionally. It's just that that mindset of "Only grown men deal in realistic violence" bothers the hell out of me. Genocyber does seem disgusting though. I don't care about excessive violence (Eden and Vagabond are my two favourite manga) but if it's just a mid 90's gore-fest then I'll pass. |
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jsevakis
Former ANN Editor in Chief
Posts: 1684 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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Wow, you will absolutely not find any support from me on that one. I consider NTHT one of the best anime ever made. It was inspired by the child soldiers of Rwanda, and calling Abelia one dimensional is a clear indication you really haven't thought much about her motivations. She's one of the most complicated characters I can remember. You may find watching violence distasteful, especially when children are involved, but that doesn't mean there isn't meaning behind it. |
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HitokiriShadow
Posts: 6251 |
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Well, this seems like my kind of show. I'll have to get this the next time that Mecha Masters collection is on sale at RightStuf. I guess I can find out how bad M.D. Geist really is while I'm at it...
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Goodpenguin
Posts: 457 Location: Hunt Valley, MD |
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It's not that I find the use of violence (in general) distasteful, it's that I didn't find much of substance in the story's framework/background to give weight to the violence beyond it's initial impact, and most of the time the acts shown felt much more emotionally manipulative then born of something of a higher storytelling caliber. The story of the children soldiers of Rwanda (or in any conflict) are tales of complex geo-political backgrounds woven into a greater story of conflict and loss. In NTHT most all adult characters are simplistically evil/crude, often showing greater emotional traits only when the script calls for it, rather than a constant part of the story. The world pictured is so simplistically cruel, and it's leaders so over-the-top insane it's hard to pick many believable threads out of it. While watching NTHT it wasn't the violence itself that was disturbing to me, it's the fact that no particular growth was coming out of it. Show evil society, show kids being beaten/raped, rinse, repeat. NTHT conveyed emotional weight, but for me it was a manipulative weight, and I left the series feeling no particular great insight was offered on the realities on children caught in conflict other than 'Boy, it stinks to be a kid caught in conflict.' In a way it was almost like 'tragedy porn.' As I said I didn't expect much support on it, as NTHT has always been that 'one proverbial show that most everyone liked but you' for me. I can see the merits which people respect it for, but it always felt too heavy-handed and manipulative to me. |
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lord-darkseid
Posts: 62 |
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Have to weigh in with Justin as well. I didn't know the atrocities in Rwanda were the specific inspiration for NT/HT but it doesn't surprise me. One of the things I liked about that show was that, in an age of anime with morally ambiguous, pretty villains, this show had one I wanted to see dead. Period. It may have been a bit manipulative but the emotions I felt watching it were no less real. NT/HT stays on my top 15 for the foreseeable future.
Buried treasure recommendations... hmmm... any chance for a review of Future War 198X? :p |
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Jadress
Posts: 807 Location: Seattle. It purdy and nerdy! |
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[quote="Goodpenguin"]
Oh my god, I just had to quote that because I've never heard anyone come up with such a perfect name for a certain genre of stories/media. |
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sunflower
Posts: 1080 |
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I could have sworn I saw this (or rather the first part of this) on some obscure cable channel a while back. I stopped watching partway through because I couldn't stand it any more.
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LeoKnight25
Posts: 319 Location: Puyallup, WA |
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Well, I'm not gonna get all hyper about your opinion of my previous post. I said what I said and I also said it was hypocritical of me but, I still stand by what I said. Argue about it all you want, you won't change my stance. Violence against women and children to me is a lot worse than violence against men. Also, I never said it doesn't happen I just don't have to like it in the anime that I watch...no more, no less. Automatically, if I see a kid getting killed in an anime in any kind of shitty, sick, twisted ass way ala Violence Jack or Ninja Resurrection than it gets an "F" in my book. Children are innocents and should never be involved in anything, but that's not the ways of the world as I well know. But again, I don't have to like that they show things like this in anime and I can sure as hell choose not to watch it. It's not sexist of me to think that women are precious and shouldn't be killed either. I saw one episode of Elfen Lied, the first I believe, and the scene where that poor girl gets her head torn off turned me off of it and I haven't watched it since. That's how strongly I believe in this. So, even though you say you meant no disrespect, I kinda do take offense to your comment. But as I said, I'm not gonna get hyper about it. I don't know you, so you can think what you want. |
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rezerekted
Posts: 1 |
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I want to hug you. This has always been the one show I believed no else but me disliked. You are the first person I have ever seen speak negatively about NTHT. I was never able to explain to people why I didn't like this show, but you have taken the words right out of my mouth. And violence in anime is misused 9 time out of 10 anyway, regardless of whether it is towards men, woman or children. Elfen Lied is a good example because it is a harem, and as we all know harems are aimed squarely at males. So Elfen Lied, to me, was an attempt at a couple blatent marketing ploys in which they probably asked "what else will get guys to watch this? I know, gore and nudity!" And obviously it worked because everywhere you go it is never far from one of the most highly regarded anime out there. Which is sad because beneath the gore and breasts was actually a decent story and an unconventional execution of plot. But the violence really makes it have less merit, to me anyway. However, I don't believe the issue of violence against women and children is a black and white one. It is usually used with the worst of intentions or taste, but sometimes it can be used effectively to create disdain for a character where violence against a full grown male would be far less effective. It can be used on younger characters to further develop and strengthen them through the course of a show. Shock and exploitation violence are extrememly distasteful though and you have every right now to want to see them in anime. I don't care as much, I don't believe children to be innocent, but that is my personal outlook and I understand it is a flawed one. But one should still acknowledge that it has a reason for existence in pretty much every medium of entertainment out there in some way or another. |
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doc-watson42
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 1709 |
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I, personally, know that most, but not all, harem anime are aimed at males. Counter examples: Ouran Host Club, Boys Before Flowers, and possibly Weiss Kreuz. (The examples may not be perfect, but my point is that there are harem anime aimed at girls and women.) Edit: See also Robert A. Heinlein's opinion of "everybody knows" in The Notebooks of Lazarus Long. Edit 2: Spelling. :-P Last edited by doc-watson42 on Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:12 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Keats
Posts: 1 |
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I also watched this series when I was pretty young. It did numb me a bit, but so did movies like Platoon, Hamburger Hill, Gremlins, etc etc.. . I read alot of books about the World Wars, when I finally realized the sheer number of casualties, that numbed me more than anything else. One of the most gruesome things I have watched is a discovery channel episode about Stalingrad...
Anyway, There's a certain kind of sadness in Elaine, which is really well done. I watched all the episodes recently and yes, amongst all the flaws, it does have something special to make it worthwhile for me. Besides that, the ED (Fairydreaming) is really awesome. It gave me goosebumps when I first heard it and I still listen to it at least every week. Back in the pre-Internet days I even ripped the sound out of the VHS tape which I'd bought. I'm actually surprised that it didn't get mentionned in the article |
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DuelLadyS
Posts: 1705 Location: WA state |
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I still have an old box of casette tapes containing songs from various VHS anime, recorded right from the tapes (it was such a pain, moving my stereo across the room once a week to plug it into the TV...) And yes, 'Fairy Dreaming' is in there somewhere. I wonder what else is on those old tapes? I don't remember it all anymore... |
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Treetastic
Posts: 164 Location: Canada |
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I have to say, Genocyber is another in the line of "things I would never watch and probably spit on that Justin Sevakis could make sound interesting". How do you do it?
Oh yes, that's quite a good point. It would be naieve to say that women and children are completely innocent. At the same time, though, men are historically the ones who fight, while a woman's job was to protect children which may entail some fighting too). Violence against women and children certainly has a shock factor, even now. The stereotype is that women and children cannot protect themselves, which maes violence against them that much more shocking. That said, I myself do have major problems with watching or reading about violence. (I admit that I can be quite strident about it as well.) Especially random violence. It just feels like, since we've all only got one life to live (wherever you believe you're going afterwards), making someone suffer, and especially ending someone else's life for no reason other than that they are there seems like the most abhorrent thing you can do. That's just my opinion; I understand that not everyone will agree with it. Finally, there are some really good quotes in this thread. "Koichi Kohata Kills Everyone: the Collection," "Elfen Laid (both a typo and a terrible hentai)," "tragedy porn"... this is great. Must save witty comments on computer. |
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belvadeer
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I have to be honest, I only saw Genocyber in one of those preview montages, but for some reason I thought that monster being was male. Didn't know it was female.
After having read the review, I don't know if I want to see it, even if I could get it. |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar Posts: 16961 |
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Maybe in your job title under your name you should change it to Director of Noob Media and embrace your noob status.
Actually the "friend" who got me into anime showed me that title. He actually gave me his VHS tape of it too. I think it's still laying around somewhere. I got 15 minutes into it before wondering wtf had just happened and where was I. And as for Genocyber....could be worse. Couldve been Sin or Kimera. I still got that on my vhs bootleg that I copied off of another firned's vhs tape. Same with MD Geist. We rented them and Project A-Ko back in the day from Tower Records. I even got the bloody soundtracks for all 3. Got them the same day along with the original Gunbuster soundtrack. Guess that makes me an ultra noob. Oh well heh. Last edited by Redbeard 101 on Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:29 am; edited 1 time in total |
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