Forum - View topicREVIEW: Sonic the Hedgehog 3 Film Review
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be_low
Posts: 11 |
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If there is a way to reveal that there is going to be a Sonic 4, and that Amy Rose and Rogue the Bat are going to be in it, without spoilers then please do. If anything, the lack of female characters their age and peers is what have helped make the games and cartoon and comic adaptations so enduring over the decades but these "live action" movies have been missing. Tails' girlfriend Cosmo in Sonic X was daring and amazing storytelling in kid's media. Even Elise in the Sonic 06 ... well she wasn't the reason why that game was such a debacle.
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Hal14
 Posts: 728 Location: Heart of africa |
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spoiler[I saw leaked clip of Amy rose in this movie (Sonic 3)] |
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Top Gun
 Posts: 4830 |
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I'm kind of surprised by statements like this, along with the general excitement over his character being included. At least from an outsider's perspective, I remember him being an object of pretty widespread ridicule back in the early and mid-2000s after he was introduced. He felt like the living embodiment of the angry edgelord stereotype from that time, and that was only multiplied by his stand-alone outing: "Hey, what if we gave him A GUN?" (For my part I played and loved the Genesis titles, but I have no personal experience with any of Sonic's 3D outings where plot became a big factor.) Granted this was half a lifetime ago, so maybe the discourse has changed since then, but my initial reaction to seeing Shadow announced for this movie was "Wait...people want to remember Shadow?" |
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BaronViolet
Posts: 254 |
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The only people who want to remember Shadow are the fans who remember the REAL SHADOW. Not the edge lord with guns, but a conflicted person who wanted to avenge his dear friend, lost his way and ultimately redeemed himself and vowed 2 protect the earth in her memory. The edge lord image exists because most modern "fans" do not bothere to look too deeply into Shadow's original backstory and just look at the awful Shadow video game where he became a cringe induced anti hero with guns. |
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db999
Posts: 347 |
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You're not remembering wrong at the time those games were being released in the late 2000s, early 2010s, that was the prevailing sentiment about Shadow. While fans at the time were pretty dissatisfied with Heroes, Shadow the Hedgehog, and Sonic 06, the fandom started to critically reappraise those games after the 2010s gave us nothing good other than Generations. There was the disappointing Sonic Episode 4, Lost Worlds, and the critically panned Boom games and Sonic Forces. Since those games were so awful fans started to see those mid late 2000s games as better in comparison, and now those games are nostalgic. So that’s probably why fans are now amenable to Shadow. Since the early 2010s him having a motorcycle and guns became a meme, so now it’s a funny nostalgic memory that everyone looks back on fondly even if the game wasn't all that great and people felt it was embarassingly edgy at the time |
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Juno016
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Alternatively, I don't think anyone disliked Shadow in Adventure 2, and his return in Heroes more or less sparked questions rather than criticism. Shadow the Hedgehog (the game) was easy to criticize with how overly edgy and confusing it was, and easy to meme because of the guns and swearing, but I also don't remember anyone disliking Shadow as a character over it. I think it existed because of Shadow being the center of so much excitement and speculation online. Sonic '06 was obviously disliked, but I remember most people at the time saying Shadow was potentially the best written character in the game's story.
Beyond that, I think some people who grew up with these games the way some of us did with the Genesis games enjoyed them a lot, regardless of their flaws. Sonic '06 also got fanfare because people enjoyed raging over it as a glitchy mess on stream, so that contributed to softening its image. And if nothing else, Shadow got to have a bunch of iconic vocal songs that people remember fondly, so that certainly helped his image. Personally, I think I'll enjoy the film, even if I don't find it a masterpiece among the Sonic franchise's best entries. I just like to have fun, and I like Sonic. I'll probably wait for a collection of the movies when they end... assuming they end. |
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Kicksville
 Posts: 1260 |
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Something can receive widespread derision and still be incredibly popular.
Not a surprising statement, but to go further, being a constant punching bag in certain corners can serve to obfuscate the voices of the people behind that popularity.
Admittedly, I find these sorts of narratives frustrating, because I bought into them for a time. I enjoyed what I played of Shadow the Hedgehog when it was new (despite being the bad PS2 port). I was on board from the first image of him on a motorcycle with a gun. But I took everyone's word for it that the game wasn't good and didn't revisit it. When I finally did on Xbox, I loved it so much I'd legit call it one of my favorite games (I think it's the best of the Adventure style games, believe it or not). And it wasn't driven just in reaction to the so-called "awful" games - Lost World feels like it got thrown in the "bad" bin by default simply because it was a Wii U exclusive for ages and Rise of Lyric overshadowed it. It's quite good! And I like Sonic Forces. I come back to it sometimes. But the way Sonic talk classically went on the internet, once the latest Sonic Bad narrative hooked in, you couldn't talk about that anywhere without 50 trolls popping out to make sure you never engage again. It's no wonder an outsider would think everyone hates Shadow. Me, I am enjoying Shadow the Hedgehog getting fully, unequivocally, widely recognized for being awesome. |
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Arxana
Posts: 43 |
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[quote="Top Gun•]I'm kind of surprised by statements like this, along with the general excitement over his character being included. At least from an outsider's perspective, I remember him being an object of pretty widespread ridicule back in the early and mid-2000s after he was introduced. He felt like the living embodiment of the angry edgelord stereotype from that time, and that was only multiplied by his stand-alone outing: "Hey, what if we gave him A GUN?" (For my part I played and loved the Genesis titles, but I have no personal experience with any of Sonic's 3D outings where plot became a big factor.) Granted this was half a lifetime ago, so maybe the discourse has changed since then, but my initial reaction to seeing Shadow announced for this movie was "Wait...people want to remember Shadow?"[/quote]
You weren’t in the demographic that Shadow appealed to at the time. When he was first introduced, yes, the Sonic fandom that had grown up with the original Genesis games found him too edgy to take seriously. But younger kids who got into the series through Shadow’s games loved him and thought he was cool. |
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MFrontier
Posts: 14216 |
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Can't wait to see the film!
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Firefly251
Posts: 381 |
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ironic because the actual fans know thats false. Ivo loved his grandfather Gerald and wanted to be like him. Shadow Generations (or was is sonic frontiers?) goes deeper and basically reveals that he loved his family so much, even Maria who he never met, and that he became "evil" due to GUN killing his family. |
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BadNewsBlues
Posts: 6358 |
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Which was a rather hypocritical complaint given the original appeal of Sonic was that he was a hedgehog with attitude. To the point that much of the American box art for the games always depicted Sonic with a scowl or some angry look instead of the happy somewhat neutral expression he had on the Japanese covers.
Aside from the segment of fans that only wanted to play as Sonic and no other characters never mind the fact that Sonic 2 introduced a 2nd playable character in Tails and 3 giving us Knuckles who would also become playable.
Gonna need a citation for this because other than Heroes many of those games you listed are still regarded as not good games. |
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be_low
Posts: 11 |
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These movies aren't aimed at people who played the Sonic games, the best sellers are 20-30 years old and probably only available for like $5 on Steam or mobile these days. They are aimed that the younger crowd that have watched the reruns of the Sonic cartoons on cable and streaming. It is why Sonic is younger and nicer and has a better relationship with Knuckles (also younger and nicer) in the movies than the "MTV rock video teen with attitude" in the games and also why things overall aren't as dark or violent: closer to the cartoons. So while Shadow didn't figure prominently in Sonic Boom plus the early 90s cartoons came along before he was created, Shadow was VERY popular in Sonic X, which was on Disney  and is now on Hulu and pretty much all the FAST services.
When the after-credits scene of Sonic 2 showed Shadow in his tube, the kids at the movie theater where I caught it absolutely exploded in gasps, cheers and applause. It was a bigger response than to anything in the movie itself. (Not saying that they didn't enjoy the movie: quite the contrary). It is just that those kids know Shadow and Maria from Sonic X, not Sonic Adventure 2 and especially not Shadow the Hedgehog or Sonic 06. The "he's got a gun!" thing that was trending on social media when they released the second trailer was from adults who remember Shadow the Hedgehog, and in retrospect do so more fondly, not the movie target audience. Except that said adults are going to see the movie too, and in at least some cases are going to use their kids as an excuse to do so. |
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BadNewsBlues
Posts: 6358 |
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Few kids of this generation were watching AM, Freedom Fighters, Underground or X. Maybe Sonic Boom & Prime the latter of which debuted months after the 2nd movie hit theaters but otherwise this isn’t entirely true given how many elements major & small are taken/referenced from the Genesis & Dreamcast games. It’s best to say these movies were made with Sonic fans of all ages in mind not just the younger ones.
Knuckles in the 2nd movie was portrayed as being adversarial to Sonic exactly how the character was initially portrayed in Sonic 3 when he debuted thanks in no short part to Eggman manipulating him for his own ends. Any standoffish behavior between the two in other canon is from writers/fans who think that’s how their relationship needs to be portrayed eventhough it makes no sense. Also while the characters are younger they’re not that far apart in age from their video game counterparts and the movie counterparts of course age unlike their video game counterparts who will unless Sega changes their mind will age much slower or be stuck at the same age.
Unless you were reading the comics Sonic has never been overly/consistently dark and most definitely not violent unless you’ve played something like Shadow The Hedgehog. Sure it’s flirted with some darker themes like Bad Futures And Sonic’s death in Sonic 06. But of course none of that stuff ever stuck. |
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Kicksville
Posts: 1260 |
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Meaning, they have been very accessible for years. I think it does help there have been cartoons and such (not that all of them are still out there), but I feel like people very severely underestimate that kids are capable of being interested in games that are older than 5 years. Sonic cool, want get Sonic, game have Sonic, game cool. |
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Haterater
 Posts: 1733 |
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My favorite of the movies. Like what they did with Shadow. Pacing could use some work, but overall, love these movies.
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