Forum - View topicREVIEW: Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha DVD
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Shockz0rz
Posts: 10 |
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I can see what you're worried about. But I can assure you the fanservice in Nanoha is not the main course. It's the weird-tasting toppings that you have to pick off the delicious pizza of F**K YEAH MAGIC LASERS and D'AWWW SO CUTE! |
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rankothefiremage
 Posts: 521 Location: Michigan |
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Best way i can sum this up, some of us think the reviewer saw loli-undertones that we didn't see on our first, second or third viewings.
If you enjoy magical girl, you might find Nanoha good, if you like mecha you'll likely find it a bit funny. If you like both you might enjoy it like i did. Henshin doesn't bother me, and rather honestly i didn't pick up on the loli stuff until well after the show entered my top 10. And to the guy who said we aren't the target for this review, the target for this review is ANN readers, and as someone who uses ANN as their homepage that includes me. Among some (many) fans of anime there is a bit to much focus on MOE as a sex thing, i don't see it that way myself. Among other fans of anime, there is a overly strong push back against MOE content, to the point where if a character smiles cutely the reaction isn't "AAWWWWWW CUTE" but rather ''I"M HAVING PEDO THOUGHTS MUST STAB EYES OUT". So to anyone who read all of this, Nanoha isn't as evil as the review makes it out to be, sure it isn't perfect (that comes with the later seasons), but is isn't the second coming of <insert>. -Gabe |
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Brians9824
Posts: 281 |
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While I will agree with a few points the rating seems odd and much lower then it should be. I will admit that I enjot the series and I can't wair for A's.
As far as the transformation scenes they are nothing different then any other magical girl style transformation scene like cardcaptors, sailor moon, etc. Series which ANN has ranked highly and never found fault with them. I mean you don't see anything at all. You might as well claim a silhouette is perverted. Secondly since when is a show designed for anime fans a negative thing? He goes on and on about how this is a show designed for Otaku and fans of the Magical Girl Genre but never once says WHY that is a bad thing. I mean shows like Genshiken and Excel Saga are designed for Anime Fans with massive amounts of trivia and jokes only Otaku would get but those get good ratings? Bad-mouthing the show for having a talking animal mascot is kinda stupid as well. I mean every genre has its own little elements that stay the same. I mean when was the last time you saw a sports anime where the random person didn't hold an amazing natural talent that surprised everyone? I don't even see how the scene where Fate recieves a whipping can even be considered lolicon. The pieces of clothing ripped off are mainly on her back and you don't even come close to seeing anything. I mean marking a show down because you felt it had S&M fantasies for one scene is kinda silly. In the entire series their is a single one minute clip that someone could find that might be considered S&M and its used as a main point for why the show was marked down? Like others have said the music was also marked down with no reasoning? About the only point i agree on is Nanoha does sound much older then she actually is but this is anime. If i want to nitpick everything and say how in real life people wouldn't act this way I can find a fault with every series in the world. In the end this feels like a biased review from someone who doesn't like the series and was looking for reasons to mark it down. Very unusual for ANN as I normally consider their reviews to be some of the most unbiased ones out there. To sum it up it just seems like all the negative points are elements of the genre in general in which other shows with the same elements have recieved high marks from different reviewers without mentioning them at all. Hell if they can review Utena (which i also like) without detracting points for the lesbianism and twisted stuff in that it really seems out of place to do it here. |
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icepick314
 Posts: 486 Location: Back in the Good Ol' US of A |
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damm this was such a harsh review during Holiday season...
as a fan of magical girl series, i rather loved this series...i thought the storyline was great, absolutely loved the character and mechanical design, and voice was great... but coming from non-magical girl fan, i can see the faults from the review...the storyline IS rather generic and doesn't have too much originality as it does borrow from many other series... however i can overlook negatives and just enjoy the series as is...i can't wait for the second season release since it's absolutely kickass with lot more action than first... |
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Labbes
 Posts: 890 |
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I'll compare it for you. Sailor Moon: 6 seconds: Focus on her hand/arm. 3 seconds: Focus on eyes/head 5 seconds: Camera moving around her. Note that while Sailor Moon is technically naked, she is a glancing silhouette. Then the clothing appears etc. etc. Nanoha: 15 seconds: Camera moving about, blabla, until Nanoha is in underwear. 5 seconds: Underwear disappears. Nanoha is now naked. Note that she is NOT, like Sailor Moon, only a silhouette. 13 seconds: Focus on the Lyrical or whatever the stone was called. Nanoha can be seen naked, but for a short period of time. Weapon appears. 3 seconds: Nanoha grabs the weapon while still being naked. Then the rest appears etc. etc. Note the difference? Also, Sailor Moon does not look like a 9-year old. Huge difference.
Because it's not original? Because it sexualizes 9-year old children?
He doesn't exactly badmouth it. It's just totally cliche and unoriginal.
Come on, the music was generic, the OP, the BGM and the ED as well. That's why it gets a C.
If you wanted to nitpick everything, you wouldn't find a good review, you know?
Isn't it ironic?
Well if Utena was a 9-year old I don't think the reviews would be good. Edit: @2D Otaku: Thanks for ignoring my arguments and trying to offend me because of an avatar I chose. Might be easier than discussing. Editedit: @2D Otaku: 9-year old children are not sexualized in Elfen Lied. There is spoiler[abuse] implied, and that sure as hell is not a laughing matter, much less a sexualization. So, could you explain where there should be a hypocrisy in my arguments? Last edited by Labbes on Mon Dec 15, 2008 8:52 am; edited 2 times in total |
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2DOtaku
Posts: 122 |
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Quoth the person with an Elfen Lied avatar. EDIT: @Labbes: I'm simply pointing out the slight hypocrisy in your arguments. Last edited by 2DOtaku on Mon Dec 15, 2008 8:46 am; edited 2 times in total |
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LuScr
Posts: 142 |
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It took me a bit to figure out what it was about this review that aggravated me so much. I'm not opposed to negative reviews, nor necessarily negative reviews of shows I like. I do, however, expect such reviews to take the show on its own terms, and within those terms to give it a good-faith scrutiny--especially when it comes to the matter of storyline--and this review singularly fails in that regard.
First, most obvious, and most glaringly: Fate. There is a great deal that could be said about Nanoha's schizophrenic switch in tone, focus, and plot when Fate shows up and pretty much takes over the show, reducing the Jewel Seeds to little more than a MacGuffin. The synopsis actually said more than the review in this regard, which says quite a bit in and of itself. More, given Fate's central role to the plot from that point on--in particular, her unique role as not merely a sympathetic villain, but spoiler[a victim of ongoing child abuse (one who makes excuses for her abuser, at that)]--there should have been considerably more analysis from this review than a throwaway line about "shades of alienation and loneliness" and a snarky reference to "skin-crawling lolicon fan-service" and "thinly-disguised S&M fantasies." The complaints about pacing lack much of anything in the way of corroborating details--and spoiler[the sudden late-season appearance, literally out of nowhere, of the Time-Space Administration Bureau, reframing everything from scratch] isn't mentioned at all, even indirectly--but ultimately, they don't matter all that much in comparison. For all its emphasis on loli fanservice and otaku trivia, this review failed to address the driving plotline of the show in any meaningful fashion. As a guide for prospective viewers, it is thus, for all intents and purposes, worthless. |
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Charred Knight
 Posts: 3085 |
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Thanks, after seeing that post I will not be picking up this series, its clearly not aimed at me, if I wanted to pick up something like Super Robot Wars I will just play Original Generation 2. I am not a lolicon and this is clearly a show aimed at them. |
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angel_lover
 Posts: 645 Location: UK |
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I don't think you can compare Elfen Lied and Nanoha, though. For example, although Elfen Lied contains a scene of straight-up child sex abuse, it's there because it needs to be in order to establish Mayu's background. Just having her tell another character about it simply wouldn't work. The scene makes uncomfortable viewing, even sickening for some, but it serves a dramatic purpose. I don't really think that could be said about the sexual undertones in Nanoha. |
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Case
Posts: 1016 |
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Hey Charred Knight, would you mind humoring me for a second? Have a look over this random blog post I Googled and let me know if you still feel the same way that you did when you posted. I'm just curious here: http://hirvine.com/blog/745/magical-girl-lyrical-nanoha-episode-1/ Fair warnings: Link contains episode 1 spoilers and pictures of the transformation sequence. |
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2DOtaku
Posts: 122 |
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In your opinion, perhaps, and I'm not disagreeing with you, but I'm sure there are people that would. I'm sure that there are people who would label Elfen Lied as 'loli-guro fanservice' if they knew what those terms meant. Not that I do, not necessarily. But one could, potentially, and between (potential) loli fanservice and (potential) loli-guro fanservice, I know which of the two I'm more comfortable with. I'm just arguing from a neutral standpoint. Notice how I emphasise that this is not my opinion of Elfen Lied I'm pedaling here. I'm just covering my bases incase anyone tries to flame me for knocking Elfen Lied. EDIT: And just to reitirate my point here, so that we're all very clear of what I'm getting at, I simply thought that for someone who can appreciate something as unnerving and disturbing as Elfen Lied, with its frequent depictions of bludgeoned and dismembered young girls, in spite of its otherwise artistic merit, getting bent out of shape over a somewhat suggestive transformation sequence seems a little bit..... odd. Last edited by 2DOtaku on Mon Dec 15, 2008 9:22 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Charred Knight
Posts: 3085 |
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yeah, that is REALLY not my type of anime then, that transformation sequence really tells me everything I need to know. 2DOtaku, their is nothing potential about Nanoha and loli fanservice, that transformation sequence is as bad as Moe-Tan's. Nanoha is clearly aimed at lolicons, and that transformation sequence that Case shows proves it. Elfen Lied was probably not aimed at guro fanservice while Nanoha was aimed at loli fetishest. |
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Labbes
Posts: 890 |
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Not to offend you, but did you watch Elfen Lied? Because while you are definitely right about the gore part, Elfen Lied definitely has no loli fanservice. It only has an implied spoiler[child abuse], as stated before. Edit: Ah, ok, I finally get where you are coming from:
I rated Nanoha 7/10, so in fact I liked it, but it's heavily flawed. I didn't find the transformation scene that much disturbing, simply overdone and to me unappealing. I simply defended a standpoint I can understand (I skipped the transformation scene every time) - that is not to say that it's my own one. Last edited by Labbes on Mon Dec 15, 2008 9:31 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Veers
 Posts: 1197 Location: Texas |
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Eh, having watched all three Nanoha series I fall into the crowd that says Nanoha was meh, A's was awesome, and StrikerS was crap.
I watched this series on the recommendation that A's was awesome but I needed to know the story from Nanoha first. I am glad that I watched this one before A's, but I'm not really glad I watched this one. If you follow. I generally like cutsey anime and I don't mind generic plots or characters so long as there are good relationships, humor, action, etc. to hold everything together. The problem is, Nanoha really didn't have any of that. Sure, there are a few smile-inducing scenes. Yes, there is some BEAMSPAM (though this series has got nothin' on A's in that department). But overall there just wasn't a lot holding it together to keep my interested. The first half or so of the series is boring monster-of-the-week formula and by the time the second half rolls around and something resembling an attempt at a real plot shows up, it's too late; there's not enough time to really develop everything. The villain of the show is awesome in one way (it is very easy to hate her) but fails in almost every other way, right down to being underutilized by the writers and then *poof* tossed away without a fight. Nanoha's otaku pandering was not much of a factor in my watching the show or in my overall disliking of it after finishing. I knew what I was getting into, more or less, when I watched it. My complaints about Nanoha are due to its poorly structured narrative, hard-to-believe character relationships, slow-paced action, and uninteresting plot (made bearable by a deliciously evil villain). So, all that said, I'll offer an amended recommendation: Watch Nanoha's episodes 1, 4, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, then bask in the glow of epic BEAMSPAM from Nanoha A's (which, by the way, also has a much more interesting cast) and stop there unless you're a glutton for punishment, because StrikerS was about five episodes of win and twenty-plus episodes of fail.
The transformations are as "bad" as it gets. They're naked, but with no detail. Could do what I did and just skip them (because, as noted, they're actually kinda long). However, I can't fault you for being turned away from the show by them. Had I known about them before hand, and had the show+A's not been recommended by some friends, it would have been enough to keep me away. Edit: Forgot a sentence in 2nd paragraph. Last edited by Veers on Mon Dec 15, 2008 9:35 am; edited 1 time in total |
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2DOtaku
Posts: 122 |
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No, you're right, it doesn't; the girls just happen to appear underage, and I know what goes through some (albeit few) people's minds when they see a helpless-looking girl with no arms or legs. It's all about how you interpret it. |
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