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NEWS: Video Site with Unauthorized Anime Gets US$4M Capital


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BlaqNumbr9



Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 155
Location: Bowing before the Master...
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:05 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
One way or another, this is going to force the issue on online distribution of anime. There's no way either the R1 companies or original Japanese companies can possibly overlook this.



I think Key's observation is the real issue here.

Fansubbing has been a problem for companies. This will be another step, among many, many more to come, that companies must take to gain control over their product.

Crunchyroll may succeed or they may fail miserably, but I'm sure we all know this is just the beginning.
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SeinenAi



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 79
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:07 pm Reply with quote
Goodpenguin wrote:
Quote:
My problem with this is that the fansubbers who do the work fansubbing it don't get any revenue, so it seems to me that Crunchyroll is messing up both the people who own the rights and the people who take time to fansub which always has a disclaimer that you shouldn't be paying to view it!


Actually, I think that has the making of an extraordinarily hilarious ruckus, re: fansubbers arguing their work has been taken for use without their consent.


My issue isn't whether I think fansubbing is right or wrong, but rather that Crunchyroll will be capitalizing on something that they did nothing but host. Of course, ultimately the right to complain belongs only with those who own the rights. But I'm just saying in the free anime pecking order, Crunchyroll is and should be last because they do absolutely nothing but take from others. At least fansubbers to not expect/want payment!
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v1cious



Joined: 31 Dec 2002
Posts: 6216
Location: Houston, TX
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:08 pm Reply with quote
the thing is the fanubs they host aren't even theirs, they just upload stuff from random groups and stream it on their site. this whole's thing's gonna fall apart, once the actual companies are informed of what they've been doing. hell they still host Naruto.
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SeinenAi



Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 79
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:13 pm Reply with quote
v1cious wrote:
the thing is the fanubs they host aren't even theirs, they just upload stuff from random groups and stream it on their site. this whole's thing's gonna fall apart, once the actual companies are informed of what they've been doing. hell they still host Naruto.


This is exactly what I was referring to. Nobody is going to end up happy, the way I see it.
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crilix



Joined: 16 Nov 2005
Posts: 208
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:13 pm Reply with quote
Goodpenguin wrote:
Actually, I think that has the making of an extraordinarily hilarious ruckus, re: fansubbers arguing their work has been taken for use without their consent.
Maybe you're not fully aware of the current state of streaming websites: They make money off illegally uploaded content. The vast majority of fansubbers, even the so called "unethical" groups, do this without generating any kind of revenue for personal gain. Most of the time they themselves end up paying albeit smaller fees for distribution of their translations.
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Mohawk52



Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:15 pm Reply with quote
And who said crime doesn't pay? This just beggers belief, however we all know what happened to all the fansub output on Youtube when Google made it legit. The same could happen with this one too.
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Unknown Memory



Joined: 15 Jan 2007
Posts: 155
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:40 pm Reply with quote
-_-; I knew it! I knew that something like this was bound to happen. CR asks people to pay so they can watch more than what was limited to them. That's why, I refuse to pay CR beyond my free account over there (and I still dislike CR for all I care).

They get money off of illegal obtained stuff and fansubs that they themselves, never worked on. I look forward to seeing CR get in trouble one day.
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Goodpenguin



Joined: 02 Jul 2007
Posts: 457
Location: Hunt Valley, MD
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:42 pm Reply with quote
SeinenAi wrote:
Quote:
My issue isn't whether I think fansubbing is right or wrong, but rather that Crunchyroll will be capitalizing on something that they did nothing but host. Of course, ultimately the right to complain belongs only with those who own the rights. But I'm just saying in the free anime pecking order, Crunchyroll is and should be last because they do absolutely nothing but take from others. At least fansubbers to not expect/want payment!


To be clear, I don't at all disagree that fansubbers 'social competition' aims are easily a rung or two up the ladder from Crunchyroll's 'Get Rich Quick with the Internet Scheme Ver.987,768,345'. There's just something almost tragic/comic about talk involving the Industry moving closer to fansubbers, and instead finding fansubbers themselves usurped by an even more duplicitous model.

Key wrote:
Quote:
And for those saying that the Japanese companies should step up to support this: consider that Crunchyroll is going to make money off of this primarily because they have minimal overhead costs. They aren't paying for the subbing, production, or licensing rights, so naturally it's going to be lucrative until lawsuits shut it down. Companies that actually have to worry about such things would be much harder-pressed to make this model work.


I'm quoting this because it's an accurate and extraordinarily important thing to keep in mind. Crunchyroll can (theoretically) make things work only because all they have to worry about financing is keeping their website moving/up, they have almost none of the usual, legal 'overhead' a normal business must deal with. Even then, they still seem to be floating several minutes of commercials before a stream, as well as advertising on the website, on top of subscription fees. Either they envision making a killing, or that shows even with actual illegally minimal overhead the format takes a lot to make it fiscally productive.

In general, I wonder if this wasn't funded on a low-risk whim to simply get into the growing 'user-generated content' trend, and what that actual content is at present was largely irrelevant. The site owners may not even care if the big attraction (anime) gets legally challenged away, if it served the purpose of elevating the value of their holding initially.
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kazana144



Joined: 01 Feb 2008
Posts: 30
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:47 pm Reply with quote
Unknown Memory wrote:
-_-; I knew it! I knew that something like this was bound to happen. CR asks people to pay so they can watch more than what was limited to them. That's why, I refuse to pay CR beyond my free account over there (and I still dislike CR for all I care).

They get money off of illegal obtained stuff and fansubs that they themselves, never worked on. I look forward to seeing CR get in trouble one day.


Then don't watch, you're giving the ad guys reason to pay them money.
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GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 15464
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:53 pm Reply with quote
hamster:
Quote:
How CAN it possibly to legal to invest in an illegal file sharing service? And how can such a service be allowed to make ad deals and have a board of directors?


Ask Ebaum. Rolling Eyes
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MokonaModoki



Joined: 30 Oct 2005
Posts: 437
Location: Austin, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:55 pm Reply with quote
Crunchyroll.com's copyright policy wrote:
Crunchyroll.com respects all copyright and license owners and adheres to the Digital Millenium Copyright Act.


kokoromedia.com's crunchyroll interview wrote:
"We’re here to prove the model on a windfall of content."


Windfall of content?

Me am scared Bizarro World. Us can go home now?
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marcyu



Joined: 01 Jan 2004
Posts: 28
Location: Destin, Florida
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:04 pm Reply with quote
JFK's father was a bootlegger. In today's age, you don't have to wait a generation (or even 3 years) to become legit.
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dizzywulf



Joined: 16 Aug 2005
Posts: 102
Location: Wakayama, Japan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:07 pm Reply with quote
I only use crunchyroll to watch Asian dramas, that have probably no chance whatsoever of being licenced here. I buy the boxsets of dramas that I really really like though.
Still this makes me a little sad, I don't think they should have put any anime on it at all and should have been kept to just Asian dramas. I think this might be serious trouble for them.
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twingomatic



Joined: 11 Mar 2008
Posts: 2
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:16 pm Reply with quote
The concept of having lots of fansubbed material in one place is admirable, but this website is abusing fansub etiquette. Herein lies my big issue. Fansubs are created for fans by fans. NO ONE is supposed to make money off them. Furthermore, once an anime becomes available in English, the idea is to STOP sharing the fansubbed version. Yes, anime is expensive, but there are ways around the cost (it's called Netflix). Most fansubs come equipped with a disclaimer asking viewers not to sell it and to purchase the real thing once it's available. Crunchyroll is giving nothing back to the community. They're just fattening their own pockets.

I also take a big offense to the fact that the site streams licensed anime (though they claim not to). I'm not one to support the "anti-piracy" squad, but I remember growing up with almost no access to anime whatsoever (this would be the early 90s), so I try to support the American anime industry if for no other reason than I want them to do well, so that they'll keep importing more, better, and cheaper anime. See here for an essay I actually wrote on Crunchyroll just this morning: http://animeintro.net/blog/fansnubs-for-profit (and thanks for looking)
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Vortextk



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 892
Location: Orlando, Fl
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:19 pm Reply with quote
I really don't understand how this works. Apparently, I'm not fit to ever be in business in America.

"I take in questionably illegal materials, and give them out. My only cost is the storing and handing off of said materials to consumers. I do not have to make the materials nor "localize" it for my consumers. Consumers PAY ME even though the same materials can be located elsewhere, most likely in better quality, for free. I'm now going to get an investment to try and turn this into a true capital producing business."

This is basically what is going on? I don't understand how this is feasible at all. And also,
Quote:
The company stated that it intends to begin inserting video ads into full-length episodes, and intends to work directly with "a select number of Japanese firms" to acquire content legally.
WHAT? So you're telling me, in what they believe, a japanese studio would want to work with them more than someone like ADV even though the entire build up to this so called company was profiteering on freely taken anime without any consent from the japanese producers?

Isn't that like giving the Hong Kong bootleggers the rights to distribute your next anime on dvds?
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