Forum - View topicAnswerman - Are Old American TV Dubs Of Anime Lost Forever?
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Kadmos1
 Posts: 13590 Location: In Phoenix but has an 85308 ZIP |
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All the points in this post are dependent on either Japan or the USA would keep the master copies of an pre-2000 original Eng. dub* 75 years from now. In additions, they are are dependent on current Japanese and American copyright laws stay the same for that same period.
From Chapter 2 of the Japanese Copyright Law text (bold is mine) (Cinematographic works) Article 54. (1) Copyright in a cinematographic work shall continue to subsist until the end of a period of seventy years following the making public of the work or the creation of the work if it has not been made public within a period of seventy years following its creation. (2) When copyright in a cinematographic work has expired at the end of its duration, copyright subsisting in the original work adapted cinematographically shall also expire but only with respect to the exploitation of the cinematographic work. (3) The provisions of the preceding two Articles shall not apply to copyright in cinematographic works. In the USA, foreign corporate-authored works published after 3/1/1989 have a 95-year copyright coverage. So, the Japanese-language Sailor Moon anime lapses its copyright here on 12/31/2087. The original Eng. dub would lapse its copyright here on 12/31/2090. If one was to time travel to 1/1/2091 USA, good luck on finding any company that has masters to a then nearly 100-year-old TV show. I doubt they would, even if one willing for someone to pay top dollar to do a public domain viewing for said version. *original Eng. dub TV version. This also applies to the original Japanese-language TV version. |
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NJ_
 Posts: 3082 Location: Wallington, NJ |
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Same here with Ultimate Muscle. |
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KabaKabaFruit
 Posts: 1883 Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba |
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As someone who had followed the anime scene in the 90s, the screwing with the material back then was something that had to be seen to be believed. Localization companies just didn't care about the material so much as how much money it was going to make them and how many toys they were going to sell.
This plus premium priced tapes and DVDs shows how much of a struggle the sub-medium had to deal with and what the fans had to deal with. |
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Terrible90sDub
 Posts: 168 |
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Hey, they'll always live on in mockery in my heart... and in my name!
I have nothing against dubs, but alternations and censorship like what happened to CCS and Sailor Moon are... lol, no thanks. They are entertaining to laugh about in retrospect, but I'm glad that no longer happens. I did find some of the music choices fun in old dubs at least, especially in Digimon. |
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Puniyo
 Posts: 271 |
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That's quite amusing, considering I'd say that CCS's dub version is probably more intact than Sailor Moon's. Which is saying something. Sailor Moon often lost whole episodes and they were all in weird orders, while, outside of the US atleast, CCS mostly avoided the scissors. I've rewatched CCS in Japanese recently and honestly, not much is missing from the dub at all (the version that aired on UK TV, at least...). The dubs themselves really aren't as bad as everyone makes out. You could take a cheap shot at the actual acting, but it was the 90's. The casting wasn't hideous (everyone in CCS sounds fine and fits their role pretty well, with the exception of Sakura.. and man, was Usagi's second VA really bad). Some name changes even make sense ('Usagi' just wouldn't work in an adaption for English audiences. Calling her Serena is rather fitting, and generally in Sailor Moon the dub names at least have the same meanings as their Japanese counterparts). The big bugbear with 90's dubs is of course, the cutting and censorship... in other words, the TV networks. If something's been changed, there's a 90% chance it's the TV network's fault. For example, the Nelvana CCS dub was completed, with ALL episodes in order - and when it aired in the US, the TV network said, "No, we need boys to watch this, lose half the episodes and reorder them to make it more about Li." There's no need for this anymore because TV is so irrelevant for anime in the west nowadays. Let's be honest, without these bad TV dubs though, many of us wouldn't even know what anime is.
Oh man, say what you want about Yu-Gi-Oh!'s dub, but the dub's OST (BGM, not including OPs) is SO much better than the original version. |
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ARC-1300
 Posts: 364 |
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They are no doubt terrible , but I kinda feel they ought to be archived. Kind of like a museum of shit. To look and laugh at the terrible practices we had in the day. |
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StarFan13
 Posts: 346 |
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Yes and i say "When it comes to Card Captor Sakura, almost everything is fan speculation." Last edited by StarFan13 on Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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littlegreenwolf
 Posts: 4796 Location: Seattle, WA |
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I'd say the Sailor Moon dub is more loved because it's sort of like a little time capsule of the 90s that we grew up with. Edits aside, the dub really brought a lot of personality to the characters we grew attached to, and as different as the music was from the original JP, it had it's own thing going for it. I would never say it was better than the original JP, but it made things extremely easy to access for me as a kid. I've got the Sailor Moon blu rays, but I also have the whole DIC dub files saved on an external hard drive. When I have to babysit someone's kid who can't read yet, it's fun to sit down with them and watch a couple. If I ever have kids of my own they're more than likely going to start off with that dub.
The Cardcaptor Sakura Dub though I'd say butchered itself move than Sailor Moon with adjusting whole themes and situations, such as the dynamic between Sakura and Syaoran (this is the Nelvana dub I'm talking about). Things started off bad when they decided to name it Cardcaptors because "boys would never watch something about a girl". It could of course be more disliked though on the sole fact that a lot of people who grew up with these dubs was too young to have access to the JP release, and to know about the changes. I was about 13 when the Cardcaptor Sakura dub came out (and about 8 with Sailor Moon when I discovered it) and knew exactly what was changed as it aired thanks to the internet. When Sailor Moon came out I was in elementary school. |
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Lynx Amali
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I remember the Canadian airing of CC on Teletoon being relatively uncut, name changes and some of the odd decisions to episode order aside (although all of them were aired at one point or another in the proper order). It was the US airing that had all the even stupid decisions like the promotion refocused on Syaron, cut episodes and general edits. The Nelvena dub was still better than the trashfire that was the SEA English Animax dub though. A lot like the Precure dubs amusingly enough. Canada and I believe Europe got a fairly good dub with relatively unknown actors who did a really good job with it, plus it was uncut in terms of violence and subject matter (which, for Futari Wa, is funny considering how hyper violent it is) and yet the recent dubs, which had amazing casts, were edited to hell and back. Seriously, Toei. When can I get a release of that OG dub? Last edited by Lynx Amali on Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:20 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Lord Oink
Posts: 876 |
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So was Pokemon, Digimon, Yu-Gi-Oh, Dragonball Z, Sailor Moon, One Piece, and pretty much every edited for TV dub. Doesn't stop them from having fans. Some more vocal and diehard than others.
We do. It's just in the age of the internet no one notices or cares. Anyone into Danball Senki, Yokai Watch, and other modern dubs were already watching the fansubs for years before their heavily censored dubs aired They're just as shite as Pokemon and everything else from the 90s. It's just you're not a kid nkw so chances are unless you actively watch Disney  or Nicktoons you'll never see them, and the original is widely available online
Please tell me you're joking. YGODM has one of the greatest anime soundtracks of all time. Nothing in that synthesized mess of a dub comes close to Passionate Duelist. |
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lemurs
Posts: 104 |
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Surely the dub of Cardcaptors was imposed by the licensor's wishes and not something Geneon went with because of lax oversight. None of the other shows Geneon was releasing at the time got hacked up like that, or got a whole separate sub-only DVD release on the side. That's just a ton of extra work for a release strategy that was already an anachronism by that point.
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Spawn29
Posts: 554 |
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I care about the dubs for anime that are not for kids like the dubs for Black Magic MM6 and New Dominion Tank Police. I have a soft spot for those type of dubs than the garbage that would air on CN, KidsWB! or Fox Kids. I had to buy the old NDTP DVD because the new one didn't have the English dub on it and I grew up with a lot of old anime voice actors that don't really do voice work anymore. Same with the Streamline dub of My Neighbor Totoro which is only on the old Fox VHS release from the early 90's.
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NJ_
Posts: 3082 Location: Wallington, NJ |
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I take it you're referring to CWi's S & SuperS dub? If so then that was her third VA.
Probably never sadly enough which sucks because I liked what I saw of Blue Water's Pretty Cure dub myself.
The Cardcaptors series and first movie dub were produced by Nelvana while Geneon only did distribution on both the dub & sub releases. The second movie on the other hand was all Geneon which was why there's a different voice cast since they went with a LA union dub at Bang Zoom instead of sending it to Ocean again like Nelvana did previously. |
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Triltaison
 Posts: 778 |
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Fox put that release on a pan-and-scan DVD in the early 2000's, so it's not only on VHS. I know because I own both it and Disney's version. That Fox DVD is pricey nowadays, though. |
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MarshalBanana
 Posts: 5470 |
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