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Lord Kefka
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 96
Location: California..for now
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 2:56 pm
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I wasn't trying to flame anyone or make a horrible general statement about people who don't watch Anime. I was posting according to what the topic creator was saying, that being how his friends WOULDN'T give Anime a chance. That is so obviously avoiding what someone lays in front of you and choose to stick with your own convictions.
Now someone who misunderstood (which is most likely the case) should be able to clarify what I have said rather than making a idiot of himself by making an incredibly offensive statement against me. That act is a sign of an elitist in denial and calling someone else an elitist to make himself feel better.
Hell, look at the topic title. " Why do SOME people criticize anime?". That "some" is the group of people (ie his "friends") the topic creator is talking about. Anyone who missed this fact and ranted on and on about whatever needs to stop for a second and just think about what to say,
Notice why my FIRST post was a very simple comment on what the topic creator said.
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KAtchan15
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 460
Location: NYC
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 3:30 pm
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Quote: | I wasn't trying to flame anyone or make a horrible general statement about people who don't watch Anime. I was posting according to what the topic creator was saying, that being how his friends WOULDN'T give Anime a chance. That is so obviously avoiding what someone lays in front of you and choose to stick with your own convictions. |
Lord Kefta wrote: | Notice why my FIRST post was a very simple comment on what the topic creator said. |
yeah i know , it was simple and yet it made sense to me after all the title did say "Why do SOME people criticize anime.Plus ,That SOME was reffering to the FRIENDS which wouldn't give anime a chance[ thread creator's friend's]
Quote: | Now someone who misunderstood (which is most likely the case) should be able to clarify what I have said rather than making a idiot of himself by making an incredibly offensive statement against me. That act is a sign of an elitist in denial and calling someone else an elitist to make himself feel better. |
YEah...he/she DEFINITELY mistunderstood what you were saying. Like I said he/she jumped into conclusions. You were just stating your opinion and this SOMEONE came out of nowhere with these offensive terms, trying to prove you wrong. The way i see it Azathrael is the "anime elitist", Because it just doesn't make sense. The things he said [example] wasn't even related to the 1 you said. Did he/she even read the fist post? [Thread creator]
Well, whatever since he/she misunderstood things, we should just cut him/her off some slack. After all, after the things he/she said, they couldn't possible back down even if they realized their own mistake. He tried to sound so smart and yet in the end, if you really read what everyone has said about the topic, Him attacking you , it just doesn't make sense.
well..whatever my advice is to the tread creator is just ignore those "people that criticize anime". you're better off.[seriously]
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Lord Kefka
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 96
Location: California..for now
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 3:37 pm
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Yeah I don't care anymore. Past is past I guess.
On a good note, I have been able to get many people into Anime who are ignorant of it. I run the Anime club at my University and it's my duty to see it that people get their share of what is out there, whether they are new to Anime or not. I don't want anyone to misunderstand me as some cynical ***hole who looks down on non-Anime fans or people who don't like Anime in case I sounded like that.
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KAtchan15
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 460
Location: NYC
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 3:51 pm
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Lord Kefka wrote: |
On a good note, I have been able to get many people into Anime who are ignorant of it. I run the Anime club at my University and it's my duty to see it that people get their share of what is out there, whether they are new to Anime or not. |
Nice... and you run it too. Nice call, because some people know nothing at all about it. Why not show them right ?and then later on they can decide if they like it or not. You're doing a really good deed.
Quote: | I don't want anyone to misunderstand me as some cynical ***hole who looks down on non-Anime fans or people who don't like Anime. |
Hahahahahaha yeah. Don't worry we know you're not.
By the way this is out of the topic but ,damn...how is it that we joined ANN at the same date and yet you have like 50+ posts, i was like Wow! thats amazing.I'm impressed.
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Lord Kefka
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 96
Location: California..for now
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 3:58 pm
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KAtchan15 wrote: |
Lord Kefka wrote: |
On a good note, I have been able to get many people into Anime who are ignorant of it. I run the Anime club at my University and it's my duty to see it that people get their share of what is out there, whether they are new to Anime or not. |
Nice... and you run it too. Nice call, because some people know nothing at all about it. Why not show them right ?and then later on they can decide if they like it or not. You're doing a really good deed.
Quote: | I don't want anyone to misunderstand me as some cynical ***hole who looks down on non-Anime fans or people who don't like Anime. |
Hahahahahaha yeah. Don't worry we know you're not.
By the way this is out of the topic but ,damn...how is it that we joined ANN at the same date and yet you have like 50+ posts, i was like Wow! thats amazing.I'm impressed. |
Yeah. Three hours a week every week during the school year. I love it. It's always good to see a new face or a new person who gets into Anime. I really don't care what they like nor do I make people come. If you are interested or are an Anime fan, you yourself should be the only motivator. That is what me and my officers have come to agree on. Not trying to be the biggest club. Just trying to be one with Anime fans in it.
And yeah, I packed my bags from the Gamefaqs Anime board and came here. All people did there was talk about random stupid crap and make some of the worst generalized arguements and statements. On top of that, there was an immature 25 year old mod who I'm always dancing in the fire with so I got fed up with him.
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aya_honda
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 920
Location: Around here
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 6:09 pm
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*a really big sigh*
I think I started this post about a zillion times before I write the following... I reject the accusations of the other posters of people that criticize anime being stupid... (though some of their commentaries - of the ones that criticise the anime - sound sometimes rather stupid). People don't criticise anime because they are stupid; they do it most of the times because they are ignorants of it, and like some have already mentioned, ignorance and stupidity are not one and the same thing. Most of the times they don't know what anime means other times they just don't care about what anime means... they have seen one series and they consider that it is representattive for the entire current. If they have seen Sailor Moon or Naruto, they think they are all the same. If they see The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya or Ergo Proxy, they will think that they are all the same. Good or bad, anime are judged through the first series that come at hand for many people. Some of them choose to see beyond the first series and they discover the multitude of offers that exist on the anime fandom. Others don't choose this path: they think that they have seen enough and that they now know what anime means. Is it wrong? Perhaps... But lets be clear about one thing: not all the people must like anime. What is wrong about this thing is the fact that they criticise without knowing much about anime. True...
Now studying into two very different places I can say this.... At the serious university that I attend they tend to criticise overwhelmingly anime and manga as well... Though they recognise some of the merits that anime might have, most of the times they reject the anime as something made with a commercial purpose, with no true cultural value etc. It got to the point that some of my colleagues refused to admit that they like anime and manga for the fear of getting into some of these discussions (pointless in the end cause it will never come to a satisfying conclusion for any of the parties envolved). On the other hand there's the art institute that I also attend at the same time. They are much more opened about it. There's definetly some sort of openness towards manga and anime. But... cause there's a but in every situation... sometimes they have this obsession with some of the anime they saw and if you asked them why they like that series or this series they can't give you a legitimate reason... (besides the fact that it is the best series ever - why it is that good I could never figure out since I still don't have a good reason) So some of the people that criticise anime get to see people being very much into anime but incapable of having real arguments into defending their likes and their dislikes...
Though it should never get to this... I don't think we are open to absolutely everything in this world... Haven't we judged just once in our lives the likes and dislikes of other people? Should all people like anime? Absolutely not! Should they criticise anime? The human being was born to have opinions about everything and I don't think we will ever be able of accepting everything in this world so open heartedly... I mean, let's be ourselves honest here: are we absolutely sure that we never, in our entire lives, judged something starting from some misconceptions? I'm sorry to say this but I'll never believe one person whose answer would be yes.
Like Keonyn said: we shouldn't have a persecution complex. I have seen people who actually had nothing against anime, but they had something with Harry Potter or computer games or whatever... the world is full of them. So perhaps the Romans were right after all: De gustibus non disputandum... (I'm not sure if I spelled that right) - which could be resumed to the fact that it's impossible to talk about tastes - it's a vicious circle and it will never come to an appropriate conclusion.
And I do apologise for this long post. I don't know how much relevance is to it.
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Subaru19
Joined: 24 Dec 2006
Posts: 118
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 6:47 pm
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Hmm. Well I can say that this is something I've given some thought to over the years, and I guess I have a few things I can add. I really think that its the fanculture that's grown up around anime that can turn people away from it.
As someone who used to watch anime a great deal and doesn't anymore I think that sometimes its the fanbase that turns people away from anime. There is certainly, as others have mentioned in this thread the "anime otaku" stereotype. My problem is that a lot of people I used to know who enjoyed anime did in fact fit the "anime otaku" stereotype. I frequent many forums that are populated with "rabid fangirls," and its those people who I find very frustrating to deal with and turn me off of anime fandom.
I actually had some difficulty in Japan when people asked me to explain why I wanted to learn Japanese in the first place. It was because of anime, but I always felt I had to qualify it with a "but I'm really not into that anymore" or "but now I'm more into translating lyrics." I guess I didn't want to be associated with what I thought "mainstream anime otakuism" was at that time.
As to the anime itself. Other people have mentioned this too, the whole anime is cartoons thing, but so are South Park and the Simpsons and it's "cool" to watch those. I think that people outside the anime fanculture see anime as childish because there are so many fans out there that give anime a bad reputation. As in the "omgz I so <3 shesshymaru" fans. Which goes back to why I don't really watch anime that much anymore. (Plus the fact that I haven't the cash to go buying DVDs of anime I'm only partially interested in).
In fear of rehashing a lot of what's already been said, there are plenty of people out there who are comfortable enough with being a fan of anime, or certain anime, or whatever, and that's totally cool. I'm fine with letting the anime speak for itself.
Last edited by Subaru19 on Wed Dec 27, 2006 11:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Viga_of_stars
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Posts: 1240
Location: Washington D.C. in the Anime Atelier
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 6:58 pm
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Major Max wrote: | When I started watching anime my friends made fun of me, I wondered why. I don't even talk about anime so much and the still criticize it. They keep saying that it is wierd and that it has no plot and it is very boring. When I read a manga, without even knowing what it is about or even what it is, they start to think of a lot of things to critcize by looking at the front cover. They don't even give it a chance. Is it because of the mechs (Gundum and Neon Genesis Evangelion), the character transformations (S-Cry-Ed and Sailor Moon), or the odd plots (Excel Saga and Fooly Cooly). Sometimes it leads to racism about the Japanese for no reason at all.
If anybody knows a reason as to why people criticize anime please post your answer. |
ignorance mostly. like at my old job i said i like anime and all i got was its porn porn porn! I tried to explain it to them but wtih no avail. so i just chalked it up to ignorant dee dee dee close minded assholery.
you "friends" shouldnt get away with pushing your buttons. if you hate it tell your friends,. if they are you friends they would stop and understand. especially if they never even tried it and knocked it. you dont criticize unless you known it yourself. i hate mindless a-holery
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KAtchan15
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 460
Location: NYC
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 7:12 pm
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Lord Kefta wrote: | I really don't care what they like nor do I make people come. If you are interested or are an Anime fan, you yourself should be the only motivator. That is what me and my officers have come to agree on. Not trying to be the biggest club. Just trying to be one with Anime fans in it.
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This is the right attitude! I'm really glad to know that there are clubs like this one which helps out anime publicity. Hey..The More the better right!
Lord Kefta wrote: | All people did there was talk about random stupid crap and make some of the worst generalized arguements and statements |
Seems to me like you made the right decision to leave those forums.I mean most of the time is fire here in ANN as well,but it really isn't that bad,not to me atleast.
About the topic though i feel bad quoting my self but this is what I think,
KAtchan15 wrote: | Its simple, It's either you like it or you don't or maybe you just don't care and frankly that's about it. Why should we care if they criticize it [anime] or not? Does it really matter? A person has the right to like and dislike whatever it is they want. Don't think that I'm justifying "people who criticize anime" in fact it really depends on the way they criticize it, If another person is harmed physically or mentally by being criticized, due to watching anime then this topic is actually worth while to discuss. If not then it doesn't really matter if your friends like anime or not, why should you care? just do whatever it is that makes you happy.
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im just too lazy to explain myself in a different way. I hope its ok.
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Major Max
Joined: 24 Dec 2006
Posts: 17
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 8:27 pm
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Thank you everbody who posted something on this topic. Looking through this I agree with most of you. It seems that you shouldn't hate people who don't like anime. They may have seen a couple of series but still hate it, at least they tried. The people who are ignorrant are the ones who hate anime but only saw about three or four episodes. The people who are stupid are the ones who make fun of others but barely even know anything about anime. I agree with the people who said that I should ignore their comments and just go on, if I like it then I like it. Although It is a bit hard to concentrate on reading a manga while others keep saying anime is stupid. Thank you everybody.
(are they even my friends if they keep making fun of me day after day after day after day? I even told them the joke is getting old but they still don't stop.)
Thanks again for everbody who posted.
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MetalHeavyMetal
Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Posts: 38
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Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 2:32 am
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Keonyn wrote: | Another question is, why do anime fans have a persecution complex? If you want to start generalizing there's no sense looking only one way. Not to mention sometimes there's a sense of hypocrisy, look at MetalHeavyMetal and his comments not only here but in the thread about the effect on anime in culture where he criticizes other shows that reflects the tastes of others that don't agree with his own. It's not like anime is the only fandom in the world that gets criticized by those outside of it, same can be said for many fanbases out there. It's also not as though anime fans themselves are innocent of similar behavior towards other fanbases or even amongst groups that exist internally such as fans of dubs.
Could it be stupidity? Sure. Could it be ignorance? Sure. Could it be something else? Most likely. Fact is, like it or not, some people just don't like anime or have no interest in it, while that doesn't mean they should criticize I highly doubt there's a person in this thread who hasn't criticized someone else for something they didn't like or understand at some point. And to be honest, I've encountered many a situation where an anime fan was criticized for anime because they were pushing anime on the other individual in some way, either making them watch some or talking about it constantly when that person has no interest in it.
I think the primary demonstration of ignorance is on the part of the fans in many of these cases. Some people just don't like anime or have no interest in anime, doesn't make them ignorant or stupid, and criticizing someone else just makes them human as it's something we all do, I've even seen it to no small degree on this board so let's not even try to play innocent.
Azathrael wrote: | Thank you for your kind backseat moderation, sir. |
Seriously, cut the crap, this is the second thread this morning you've made this comment, which is ironic since this comment itself is just as bad. Maybe if you weren't always creating the need for moderation people wouldn't be making the comments and you wouldn't have to snap back with your little one liner. psycho wasn't moderating, he was expressing a concern that another decent thread might be derailed and locked as a result, which is a valid concern. Your response however was simply pointless and unnecessary.
Besides, by assuming others are ignorant rather than just uninterested, you yourself are only demonstrating your ignorance. |
Well unlike Japan were anime no doubt plays a major part in there pop culture it just is not mainstream enough to really put a dent in pop culture in America now a American Idol type of show or a big ratings graber on MTV Like Real World has a bigger impact then anime which is still a sub culture and will remain one in america I dont agree with it but its true
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P€|\||§_|\/|ast@
Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 3498
Location: IN your nightmares
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Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 3:51 am
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Major Max wrote: | are they even my friends if they keep making fun of me day after day after day after day? I even told them the joke is getting old but they still don't stop. |
Were they your "friends" before they found out you liked anime? Or another question is were they your friends first and then you got into anime?
If both those questions are yes then they were probably not your friends in the first place, or not good friends but maybe acquaintances. It sounds like your hobby wasn't interfering with your relationships like with some people who become so involved with their hobbies that they begin to alienate themselves from people. If they had enough respect for you then they might still kid and joke when telling them you like anime and them not accepting it as something enjoyable, but I don't think it's right to continue to pester you. It sounds like they are a bunch of blowtards that have made a hobby out of making fun of your interests. Oh well just find friends who also like anime.
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grafikdon
Joined: 25 Dec 2006
Posts: 8
Location: Jamaica, NY.
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Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 7:04 am
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Why bother with people who can't stand anime? It is worse than making an elephant lay an egg. None of my friends think poorly of anime, heck some don't even know what the heck animation in general is all about, even if they did, I will simply flush their opinions down the toilet. Don't sweat the small things, we all have individual differences but if they show indifference to your taste... just flush their inflammatory retorts down the crapper. Such outrageous display of ignorance do not bother me at all.
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Subaru19
Joined: 24 Dec 2006
Posts: 118
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Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 9:10 am
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grafikdon wrote: | we all have individual differences but if they show indifference to your taste... just flush their inflammatory retorts down the crapper. Such outrageous display of ignorance do not bother me at all. |
I think that's a bit extreme don't you think? I mean if these are the OP's real friends and they just don't understand where he's coming from then I think a little tolerance is in order. But I too wouldn't stand for being made fun of by a "friend" for something I liked. Even if they did say they didn't like anime, I'd be more the kind of person to say something like "that's painting with a really broad brush. What don't you like about anime?" and then show them Gankutsuou and convert them to the dark side. ^__^
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Lombardo
Joined: 29 Dec 2006
Posts: 2
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Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 11:31 am
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Last edited by Lombardo on Sat Jan 06, 2007 4:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
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