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NEWS: Hollywood Wants BitTorrent Dead


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Mohawk52



Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 4:05 am Reply with quote
Laughing Laughing And the beat goes on! And the beat goes on. Drums keep pounding rhythm to the brain. La-dee-da-dee-dee! La-dee-da-dee-da.....

Here what the UK Film Council is trying to do to battle the problem.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/film/4085353.stm
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Guilhem



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 181
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 5:04 am Reply with quote
Sword of Whedon wrote:
Quote:
Then, instead of attacking Bittorrent -which is open-source anyway, so their problem is not here in the sense that they can't attack it- instead of requesting anti-BT laws, they should request laws which allow them that their license provide that. If video-game compagnies have the right to do this, why not Hollywood and anime producers? Aren't they into the entertainment bizness aswell?


Because these are licensing deals, and law has nothing to do with it. You keep forgetting that unlike Hollywood and the video game companies. Anime companies DO NOT OWN 99% of the product they distribute. They are under licensing agreements.

Then, they should reconsider their licensing deals to get more freedom: no need to be a rocket scientist to understand that this would probably be the best compromise on the long term because sooner or later another way of hacking will appear anyway, and it will appear because -amongst other reasons- people are not informed enough to make their choice according to the quality of the product

What you seem to keep forgetting is that fansubs exist also because companies abuse of people ignorance or credulity: that is a form of bad bizness

Cool
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the_soultaker



Joined: 25 Mar 2004
Posts: 685
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 8:42 am Reply with quote
All i can say is that alot of my fellow co-workers are pissed off,now that all the major Bittorent sites have been shut down.
It was only a matter of time before these actions would take effect,including the fact that this s&*^ has gotten way out of hand, especially when there are those who have download(ed) the Incredibles pre-DVD release. I wouldn't be surprised if most Anime torrents sites would follow suit.
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Mohawk52



Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 9:03 am Reply with quote
the_soultaker wrote:
All i can say is that alot of my fellow co-workers are pissed off,now that all the major Bittorent sites have been shut down.
I prescribe group hugging sessions in a darkened room to help with their disappointment. Wink Getting caught downloading any unauthorised material at my company is a sackable offense.
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Sword of Whedon



Joined: 17 Sep 2003
Posts: 683
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 11:23 am Reply with quote
Quote:
Then, they should reconsider their licensing deals to get more freedom: no need to be a rocket scientist to understand that this would probably be the best compromise on the long term because sooner or later another way of hacking will appear anyway, and it will appear because -amongst other reasons- people are not informed enough to make their choice according to the quality of the product


You seem to believe that they're required to give you that right, and the Japanese companies won't give more freedom most of the time, they're so paranoid about reverse importation. Why should they care that people are not informed? Considering that 90% of the shows coming out are utter crap, where is their advantage in telling you that in advance?

They are not required to play fair, especially when it's completely to their disadvantage. You can't watch a Hollywood movie before you decide to pay for it in the theater can you? No. The game demo won't let you play through the whole game so you can see beyond just the part they might have gotten right, nope. Deal with it, get a job, and grow up. If you think it's so unfair, raise yourself a million bucks or so, start your own anime company and treat your customers according to your own standards.
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Darkener



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 33
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:20 pm Reply with quote
the_soultaker wrote:
All i can say is that alot of my fellow co-workers are pissed off,now that all the major Bittorent sites have been shut down.


really?... I haven't seen any major bt site shutdown yet, or maybe the IT guys finally got sick of people at work of wasting company's bandwidth... (which is a bad side to using torrents)

to another point, if an american anime company want more freedom in the anime they want to license they could always buy the anime studio so they could do want they wanted... Of course the japanese aren't that big into the idea of americans buying japanese companies...
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Sword of Whedon



Joined: 17 Sep 2003
Posts: 683
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:24 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
to another point, if an american anime company want more freedom in the anime they want to license they could always buy the anime studio so they could do want they wanted... Of course the japanese aren't that big into the idea of americans buying japanese companies...


Even if that happened, you don't seem to realize how it works, Most anime is owned by a conglomerate of different companies, many of them large corporations, and it changes with every show.
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Darkener



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 33
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:27 pm Reply with quote
Sword of Whedon wrote:
They are not required to play fair, especially when it's completely to their disadvantage. You can't watch a Hollywood movie before you decide to pay for it in the theater can you? No. The game demo won't let you play through the whole game so you can see beyond just the part they might have gotten right, nope. Deal with it, get a job, and grow up. If you think it's so unfair, raise yourself a million bucks or so, start your own anime company and treat your customers according to your own standards.


unlike game companies... you can rent a game when it is released.. you can't do the same thing with movies for the most part are released in theaters first and on to dvd three or more months later (depending how well it does in theaters.) If they were able to show new movies released in theaters on the web (at or near the same time of release) torrents and p2p programs wouldn't be much of a problem for them today... but it will never change for them until they can realize tech can be their friend not their enemy...
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Sword of Whedon



Joined: 17 Sep 2003
Posts: 683
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:44 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
If they were able to show new movies released in theaters on the web (at or near the same time of release) torrents and p2p programs wouldn't be much of a problem for them today


Try as you might, you can never compete with Free
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beelzebozo



Joined: 11 Jun 2004
Posts: 308
Location: Aurora, Colorado
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 6:14 pm Reply with quote
Darkener wrote:
unlike game companies... you can rent a game when it is released.. you can't do the same thing with movies for the most part are released in theaters first and on to dvd three or more months later (depending how well it does in theaters.) If they were able to show new movies released in theaters on the web (at or near the same time of release) torrents and p2p programs wouldn't be much of a problem for them today... but it will never change for them until they can realize tech can be their friend not their enemy...


Um, you can rent anime when it comes out. Just drop by an anime shop that has that service (like mine). Or get in from an on-line rental shop.

I do foresee the day that movies will be made available off the web ala iTunes. It's just going to take a Steve Jobs' (or whomever came up with the idea at Apple) level visionary to come up with it in a way that "sells" to the suits at the movie studios and anime companies. (Though there is that anime download service that is being advertised here. Anyone used it yet?)

There will always be some level of piracy, but if the anime companies are smart about it, they may be able to minimize it.
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Darkener



Joined: 04 Jul 2003
Posts: 33
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 6:51 pm Reply with quote
beelzebozo wrote:
Um, you can rent anime when it comes out. Just drop by an anime shop that has that service (like mine). Or get in from an on-line rental shop.

There will always be some level of piracy, but if the anime companies are smart about it, they may be able to minimize it.

I'm just playing the otherside of things, but you can't buy or rent shows like Naruto or Prince of Tennis in the US... You can import the dvds from Japan, but a lot of times the show won't come with english subs included on the dvd. Of course you can always download dvd script (soft dub) to be able to understand the anime you bought, but even that is illegal... There isn't a quick fix to the problem but with better planning japanese anime companies could offer an alternative until it is picked up here. ex. to have english subs standard for dvds released in japan and to make the dvd region zero so more people outside of japan can be able to watch (without a dvd player that can play region two dvds.) Sort of like what they do with music cds in Japan by releasing a second version of a cd intended to be sold outside Japan (usually labeled as "overseas" online sites.) Which in turns is eight to ten bucks cheaper compared the cd that is made just for the japanese market.
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beelzebozo



Joined: 11 Jun 2004
Posts: 308
Location: Aurora, Colorado
PostPosted: Fri Dec 17, 2004 7:07 pm Reply with quote
The Region 0 coding would get the American companies mad at them by taking away some of their potential sales(and what downloader is going to spend $40 for 2-3 episodes anyway). The same reason Japanese companies get mad at American companies who put their disks at Region 0 because they suffer from the reverse importing. Same with the CDs. The Japanese people will buy the "Overseas version" because it is cheaper. That's the big reason for Region coding: Market control.

There is no real easy answer outside of better co-operation between the different companies.
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Guilhem



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 181
PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2004 5:59 am Reply with quote
Sword of Whedon wrote:
Quote:
Then, they should reconsider their licensing deals to get more freedom: no need to be a rocket scientist to understand that this would probably be the best compromise on the long term because sooner or later another way of hacking will appear anyway, and it will appear because -amongst other reasons- people are not informed enough to make their choice according to the quality of the product


You seem to believe that they're required to give you that right, and the Japanese companies won't give more freedom most of the time, they're so paranoid about reverse importation. Why should they care that people are not informed?

Huh? To fight hacking and improve their sales maybe?

Sword of Whedon wrote:
Considering that 90% of the shows coming out are utter crap, where is their advantage in telling you that in advance?

Actually, they don't need to tell us this in advance, we all know, hence the fansubs and the BTs, hence their need to find a solution which will please everyone: it's called a compromise and it is something perfectly honorable as long as these companies are not interested into profits only which, unfortunately, is far too much often the case...

Sword of Whedon wrote:
They are not required to play fair, especially when it's completely to their disadvantage.

Then the fansub community is not required to play fair either, duh...

Sword of Whedon wrote:
You can't watch a Hollywood movie before you decide to pay for it in the theater can you? No.

I do not go into theaters any more anyway, except for 'Art et Essai' movies which are almost never disappointing but maybe it's just me... I suppose you understand how much inappropriate your example is but I'll act as if you don't: the place for a movie is about 8$, right? (I don't live in the USA, so I dont know the precise amount of money...) That's not exactly cheap but it's not huge either, then it's not a real problem, all the more as there's plenty of trailers, reviews, rumors, etc,... to keep you informed as well as your own experience (mine brings me into 'Art et Essai' theaters...) but in the case of a 30 or 40, if not frankly 50 episodes TV serie, it's obviously radically different and far more costly, all the more as some series take quite some time before really 'beginning' and of course there's always less and less episodes on each disc...

Sword of Whedon wrote:
The game demo won't let you play through the whole game so you can see beyond just the part they might have gotten right, nope.

I can at least play enough to know if I accept to take the 'risk' to buy the whole game or not: I have a possibility to evaluate the overall potential of the product. With animes, not...

Sword of Whedon wrote:
Deal with it, get a job, and grow up. If you think it's so unfair, raise yourself a million bucks or so, start your own anime company and treat your customers according to your own standards.

This part of your post was not necessary, to not say it was rather idiot... Rolling Eyes
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the_soultaker



Joined: 25 Mar 2004
Posts: 685
PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 9:26 am Reply with quote
Darkener wrote:
the_soultaker wrote:
All i can say is that alot of my fellow co-workers are pissed off,now that all the major Bittorent sites have been shut down.


really?... I haven't seen any major bt site shutdown yet, or maybe the IT guys finally got sick of people at work of wasting company's bandwidth... (which is a bad side to using torrents)

to another point, if an american anime company want more freedom in the anime they want to license they could always buy the anime studio so they could do want they wanted... Of course the japanese aren't that big into the idea of americans buying japanese companies...


By now dear boy, i'm sure that you may be well aware that major torrent sites have been closed for good, and there are more in the works. as a matter of fact a fellow co worker/associate of mine had sent me this interesting letter from ADV to a certain torrent site. ROLL 'EM!;



Quote:
Dear Fredrick Neij,



This office represents A.D. Vision, Inc. (ADV) and its affiliated
companies that own and/or are exclusively licensed to use the following
protected work (the "Protected Work"):



Neon Genesis Evangelion



Through our Internet monitoring program, we recently discovered
unauthorized use of our Protected Work in connection with your website
(This is a Known Bootleg Site" target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow ugc">www.">This is a Known Bootleg Site) (the "Site"). Specifically, the Protected Works
are being offered for Internet download, copying and distribution through
Bit Torrent technology.



Our intellectual property rights are our most valuable assets. In order
to promote a cooperative and beneficial relationship with fans, ADV
prefers to send out written requests such as this first, rather than
institute litigation or request that your ISP disable your Site.
Notwithstanding the foregoing, unauthorized copying and distribution of
ADV's protected works (including images) constitutes an infringement of
one or more of ADV's rights under the copyright laws the United States,
Canada and many other jurisdictions throughout the world, including
States that are members to the European Union. Applicable law provides
for substantial penalties for such infringement, including injunctive
relief, attorney's fees, and damages. ADV has instituted litigation in
the past, and in every such litigation, ADV prevailed. If necessary, ADV
will not hesitate to take such action again to insure that its rights are
fully protected.



Therefore, without limiting any right, remedy or defense available to us,
ADV MUST ASK THAT YOU IMMEDIATELY:



1) Delete and cease all further use of the Protected Work, and any
other unauthorized ADV works, from the Site.



2) Remove and delete all copies of the Protected Work, and any
other unauthorized ADV titles, from any other distribution channel
owned, operated or otherwise controlled or accessible by you or those to
whom you grant access including other web sites, FTP servers, web-based
storage services, peer-to-peer systems and the like (each of the
foregoing being a "Channel").



3) Remove and delete all references, pointers and hypertext links
pertaining to infringing copies of the Protected Work from all such
Channels.



We also ask that you please advise us in writing within five (5) days
from the date of this notice as to whether you will comply with our
request so that we can determine whether any additional action will be
required beyond this point. I trust this will receive your prompt
attention, and if there is anything I can help you with in future, please
let me know.



Sincerely,



Aaron Guerrero

Enforcement Team

Anti-Piracy Division

A.D. Vision, Inc.

[email protected]
And the never ending battle rages on..

as for the Japanese not big on Americans buying their companies, i would find it a bit hypocritical, after all wasn't it the Japanese who bought SEGA (An American comnpany founded by David Rosen back in 1950) and made a huge sucess out of the company. Well i'm not surprised,it's all about nationalism,hence the reason why the PS2 outsells Microsoft's X-BOX (a superior console) on a 5-1 ratio,and of course there's not enough software support coming from the 'rising sun. Mad
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Proman



Joined: 19 Nov 2003
Posts: 947
Location: USA
PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:05 pm Reply with quote
Suprnova.org is gone... This is the worst news I've heard in a long time Mad .
RIP.
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