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MFrontier
Joined: 13 Apr 2014
Posts: 15136
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 12:25 pm
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After the ending of the novel series, I'm curious how people will respond to it.
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Fluwm
Joined: 28 Jul 2009
Posts: 1127
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 2:49 pm
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It'll be... interesting to see, I suspect.
I used to enjoy the novels, but after hearing spoilers for how everything ended... abandoned 'em completely.
Really amazing how many series seem to just completely flub their landings. I mean, hell, the Spider LNs wound up being pretty good, but then just nosedived with that final volume last month.
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Pedram
Joined: 31 Mar 2012
Posts: 83
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 3:04 pm
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A new volume just too feed on the copium of all the annoyed ex-fan of the series
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nobahn
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 5196
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 4:01 pm
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It is quite true that if you carefully reread the LN series that it becomes self-evident that by the middle of it that Satoshi Wagahara did not know how he was going to end it. That makes the last LN of the series all the more remarkable because he scrambles all of your expectations.
Seriously.
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18605
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 4:13 pm
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Fluwm wrote: | It'll be... interesting to see, I suspect.
I used to enjoy the novels, but after hearing spoilers for how everything ended... abandoned 'em completely.
Really amazing how many series seem to just completely flub their landings. I mean, hell, the Spider LNs wound up being pretty good, but then just nosedived with that final volume last month. |
Finished both novel series and can't agree that either flubbed their landings.
For Devil, there was definitely an ending that many in fandom wanted to see, but that ending didn't make much sense given established character personalities and developments. Frankly, I'm glad author Wagahara didn't try to force it. (I could more sympathize with an argument for being upset about how a couple of side characters turned out, though.) I'll also disagree that Wagahara wasn't always heading towards that ending.
For Spider, I'm not sure what kind of ending people were expecting if they were unsatisfied with how that turned out. While I did feel a little like the series was taking the easy way out, what happened was still perfectly in line with long-standing characterizations and story set-up.
EDIT: As for the new novel, sounds like at least part of it is going to be a prequel. Curious to see what the rest of it will focus on, though; will it take the Spice and Wolf route?
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nargun
Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 931
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 6:07 pm
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It's not the ending in Devil is a part-timer that's the problem, it's that the middle half of the series -- what we're heading into now -- needed severe pruning. Too much stuff happening, not enough of it mattering. Like a backstory info dump in real time. The last quarter of the series is fine.
(Spider's problem is somewhat different: too many surviving classmates, so half of them are very thinly written, clogging up the back quarter of the story. Too *little* not too much)
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18605
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 7:58 pm
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nargun wrote: | It's not the ending in Devil is a part-timer that's the problem, it's that the middle half of the series -- what we're heading into now -- needed severe pruning. Too much stuff happening, not enough of it mattering. Like a backstory info dump in real time. The last quarter of the series is fine.
(Spider's problem is somewhat different: too many surviving classmates, so half of them are very thinly written, clogging up the back quarter of the story. Too *little* not too much) |
Both of these points I do fully agree with, although I see the former as more of an issue.
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ThrowMeOut
Joined: 10 Oct 2018
Posts: 269
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2023 8:50 pm
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IDK, I think if your story's ending manages to peeve off the vast majority of your readers, especially if you're writing a silly little fluff series, then you did something wrong.
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BadNewsBlues
Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 6469
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 1:40 am
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ThrowMeOut wrote: | IDK, I think if your story's ending manages to peeve off the vast majority of your readers, especially if you're writing a silly little fluff series, then you did something wrong. |
People are very rarely ever going to be satisfied with the ending of a story for one reason or the next.
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ThrowMeOut
Joined: 10 Oct 2018
Posts: 269
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 5:28 am
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No, most story's endings don't turn a huge portion of its fanbase against it. If the plan was this ending all along, he should've written the series in a way that foreshadowed it better and made his audience more open to it.
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Spike Terra
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Joined: 21 Mar 2016
Posts: 362
Location: Maryland
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 7:41 am
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ThrowMeOut wrote: | No, most story's endings don't turn a huge portion of its fanbase against it. If the plan was this ending all along, he should've written the series in a way that foreshadowed it better and made his audience more open to it. |
So this is coming from me, who is still on volume 16 but spoiled the ending for myself. But all of the people who were angry about the ending, just seem to be mad about Emi not winning the relationship. Like Chiho establishes herself in volume 1 as someone who is head over heels for Maou. She spends the series getting to know him and putting in the work to win him over. I'll agree that one can make the argument that Emi should have won but most criticisms seem to disregard Chiho as a character entirely despite her being the most important point of view character on the earth side of the story.
Also, while there a good handful of people who were angry about the ending, I haven't seen data that suggests that the majority of readers hated it. I feel like the shippers are just being hyperbolic.
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18605
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 10:53 am
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Spike Terra wrote: | So this is coming from me, who is still on volume 16 but spoiled the ending for myself. But all of the people who were angry about the ending, just seem to be mad about Emi not winning the relationship. Like Chiho establishes herself in volume 1 as someone who is head over heels for Maou. She spends the series getting to know him and putting in the work to win him over. I'll agree that one can make the argument that Emi should have won but most criticisms seem to disregard Chiho as a character entirely despite her being the most important point of view character on the earth side of the story.
Also, while there a good handful of people who were angry about the ending, I haven't seen data that suggests that the majority of readers hated it. I feel like the shippers are just being hyperbolic. |
Whole-heartedly agree with every bit of this. (And if you're coming to this opinion based only on spoilers and reading through v16, I don't think you'll see anything in the final few volumes which will change your opinion.)
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flamemasterelan
Joined: 17 Apr 2022
Posts: 505
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 11:23 am
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Key wrote: | Whole-heartedly agree with every bit of this. (And if you're coming to this opinion based only on spoilers and reading through v16, I don't think you'll see anything in the final few volumes which will change your opinion.) |
Honestly, I haven't followed the series past the first season (though I bought the first couple novels and they're sitting on my tbr pile), and knew absolutely nothing about the series other than people not liking S2 very much and that fans didn't like the ending. And those spoilers...line up pretty much exactly with my expectations for the series from the first season. If that's really what people had problems with....
It was pretty obvious.
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nobahn
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 5196
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2023 9:45 pm
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Okay, so everyone has their own views/opinions on what floats their boats. What one person finds entertaining, another person will not. But I will argue until I am blue in the face that the last volume sticks the landing.
Period.
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