Forum - View topicGetting Girls into Comic Shops
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studioplugnplay
 Posts: 52 Location: Texas |
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Apprently some people who have viewed this thread felt the need to troll this person via email. Thanks. Not only have you shown me the fandom is diverse, it's also immature. I do thank those of you who gave sensible feedback here in this thread.
-Gynocrat Last edited by studioplugnplay on Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:50 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Kagemusha
 Posts: 2783 Location: Boston |
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I think it depends on the store. The more typical/mainstream comicbook stores I've been to do present somewhat of a male aura. The one I typically shop at (which has a very diverse range of titles, from mainstream to indie to porno) tends to present itself better, and I've seen quite a few girls there. Heck, the other day I had to literally step over a couple of fangirls who were sprawled on the floor, gawking at yaoi.
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Cloe
Moderator
 Posts: 2728 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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I don't know... I feel a little bit uncomfortable reading that list. It seems to just divide men and women comic fans more than it does to unite them.
It may be just me, but I don't know if I like the fact that people will now think I demand carpet because I'm a woman. And I happen to LOVE the tight, intimate spaces of comic shops. And as far as cutting the fantasy card and role-playing games, who said that those appeal only to men? It's true that mostly men play them, but I don't think the games themselves block out girls in any way. What this author is saying is "Women don't want to learn these games at all, so instead of inviting them or explaining it to them, do something that will cater to their specific gender-oriented needs." And having "special events that appeal to women" would just be making the gender barrier more solid, wouldn't it? Once again, the implication is that women don't want to be involved with events normally associated with comic fans, which isn't always true. Why do women need special events aimed just at them all of a sudden? Why not something fun that has appeal to both genders? So she's telling the comic store owners to take away all posters of big-chested women, but encouraging them to hang up yaoi and hire hot men to pose for sketches?? That's quite possibly the largest double standard I've seen in the past 6 months. And there's no way that this will happen. Ever. Why would a comic store owner suddenly disregard his/her largest source of income just to please a small portion of customers? All in all, I thought a few of the ideas in the article were good, but if I ever saw a store that actually did ALL of those things, I wouldn't go within 100 miles of it. Maybe I'm strange that way, but I like my comic shops exactly the way they are. Also, I think there's a large difference between comic fans, who typically seek out these kinds of stores, and female manga readers. I happen to be both, but I sense that I'm in a very small minority. |
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Michi
Encyclopedia Editor
 Posts: 741 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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I totally agree with your entire post and I think you should go post it to that entry. I was gonna write something, but you covered it really well. Everything in that, even though it said it was written by a woman, makes women sound like these stereotyped picky, feminist, yaoi fans and it's creepy. ...Not to mention it was totally littered with grammatical errors. *cough* |
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Cloe
Moderator
Posts: 2728 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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Ha ha, not a chance. The last thing I want is to begin a debate (which will be inevitable) with some random person who will probably peg me right away with "You know what? You may be a girl but you're still a chauvinist!" Bleh. It's not even worth my time to argue with her, because there's no way any sane comic store owner would take half of that advice. Tell you what. Feel free to copy everything I wrote and and have fun in the lion's den! 
I'm really glad you feel the same way, though. I'm beginning to feel like I'm a little more normal now. |
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Michi
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 741 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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You could post anonymously (if it allows) and run away.
 But I agree on that too. A lot of the advice was silly. Take down the posters of hot comic chicks and replace them with hot dudes kissing! Uhm, are they trying to attract female customers and turn away all of the guys? It's not necessary to alienate one base to get the other.
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Haru to Ashura
 Posts: 617 Location: Termina |
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Being a women comic shop frequenter and after reading that list, I agree with about half of it. My local comic shop chain - an excellent business, they are
 - employs most of these strategies, and reaps the benefits. Hiring female employees is a good idea, but not really nessessary. What I'm saying is this: Hire them if they apply, but don't desprately seek women out. And of course, carrying girl's comics is a must. The mass boobage pinned all over the walls seems very immature to most women, so tone it down. Plus, another good reason to tone it down is to make a more kid-friendly enviorment for Yu-Gi-whatever fanboys.
But I cannot agree more with the idea of keeping shops spacious and clean. I've been to comic shops of the smaller, cluttered, dusty and disgusting variety, and I do have to say that I do not like basking the funk. That doesn't just scare women away - that scares most normal people away. Cleaniness is next to godliness! And selling snacks is just a given, really. Comic shop goers aren't the most health-concerned individuals, so sodas and candy are a good idea. Lots of the things mentioned on that women's list seem to apply to general people, not just women. Comic shops just need to cater more towards the average consumer and not harcore fans. Although I disagree with the yaoi advice. While there are plenty of girls who are into it, there are just as many who don't enjoy two guys macking on each other. It's a bit creepy, and will scare away your other customers. (edit) Is it just me, or is that list missing a number three?
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GATSU
Posts: 15559 |
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I pretty much agree, even though it is more of an informercial than an advisory. I'm a guy, and I'm getting tired of going to comic stores for my manga fix. (But if you're in the L.A. area, I recommend Meltdown. They're one of the few comic stores which has their shilznit together.)
Actually, I was back when I just hit puberty and was reading Crying Freeman, but that's TMI.
The ones near me hire women, but I'm not sure about elsewhere.
In Golden Apple's case, it's adult film stars...
I think that's a general problem nowadays, not just for women. If you're going to geek out, at least respect your brethren.
I think they just buy whatever is "popular", without considering how well it actually does in sales.
That actually makes sense, since they already have adult comics in back, so yaoi would have a place. |
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studioplugnplay
Posts: 52 Location: Texas |
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They are already divided, and not just by gender.
She was speaking of the market of young shoujo fans, which is the massive target audience du jour of Viz and the like-and I can say having it seen it for myself, no, a majority of these 'bookstore girls' do not want to hang out for gaming.  Again, this was rough draft I found written for vendors in mind from a publisher and not some ‘woman looking to change the comic book shop’. Again, I removed the link from here because it was sorely misplaced and it was wrong of me to bring up without her permission.
Because this is what store vendors are asking Diamond about-if they weren't asking, no one would bring it up. If you want to check up on that, contact Diamond and ask about some of the topics being addressed at their vendor/publisher hook up this year. ^_-
No one is saying that they have to do anything. These guides are not meant to force the vendor into implementing ideas; they are simply an outline of suggestions. ^__^ Again, I was wrong in linking this because it is obviously not in it's final form and not intended for consumer consumption. A poster of Fruits Basket in place of the Betty Page series is not going to kill your business now is it?
No you aren't in the minority, I am one as well. I read both comics and manga. However, playing demons advocate here for the publisher: when you have store owners lamenting 'ok we brought manga in but why aren't we getting the customers Walden Books is getting' more often than not they look to Diamond to help them out. That's what her handout will do- simply suggest ideas here and there these vendors can implement. There is something else I want to address here as well because since I saw it it’s bothered me. This thing here -
I don't want to tick anyone off here, that is not my intent, and I do respect your views, but try to be a bit more understanding; there are some of us in this business that aren't all 'OMG ITS YAOI SUPPORT IT AND NOTHING ELSE IS GOOD' and give us the same ounce of credit you give yourselves as consumers and fans of manga. -Tina Anderson http://gynocrat.org |
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Cloe
Moderator
Posts: 2728 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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That's really a shame. It's one thing to offer an honest opinion, but another to be deliberately nasty. I may disagree about the advice given in the link, but I would never imagine composing a beastly trolling e-mail. I apologize for being presumptuous in my second post. I would suggest, however, to possibly advise the person who wrote this to change the tone of her letter and replace a few words or phrases to make it sound a bit more professional and a bit less fangirl-y. I'm sorry that others gave her a hard time, though. |
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GATSU
Posts: 15559 |
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Tokyopop's "manga-ka" Rivkah throws in her two cents regarding the comic book industry. According to Anime-AICN, where I got the link from, her comments caused quite a stir.
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milcor1
 Posts: 337 |
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I didn't see anything worth stirring there. It's all pretty much true.
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Kagemusha
Posts: 2783 Location: Boston |
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Some interesting opinions, but some of her comments seem to be a bit bias. Wizardworld is hardly an accurate representation of the entire American comic industry. As for the comments about wanting to create your own series, many writers/artists have already done that (Vertigo/Wildstorm), and I'm assuming she was mostly talking to the newer artists who were just breaking in and weren't exacally in a possition to go to the big guys and say "I want my own series". She is right about Marvel for the most part though: they really don't encourage people to come up with new stuff. I'll wholeheartedly agree with her that mainstream comics need to produce more impressive superhero comics than the "It'll change comics FOREVER" mini-series that they pump out every couple of years that ends up being either a Watchmen knock-off or just kills a major character.
I'm really not suprised that Tokyopop is lenient on what they allow editors to publish. It can mean some good things, like she was saying, but it's also lead to alot of crap from Tokyopop. |
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