Forum - View topicAnime vs The Fandom
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indrik
 Posts: 365 Location: yonder |
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You know, there are compromises that are almost necessary for something- anything- to acheive widespread popularity. It's not that much of a stretch to realize that this is the case, decide you don't like the compromises on average, and avoid anything that reaches a certain level of popularity. Going one step further, it's not a stretch at all to think that if a series reaches a certain level of popularity with, say, 13-16 year old girls who like to squee giddily and "glomp" people, it's extremely likely that show's not for me. There are certainly examples (lots of examples) of shows (musical groups, books, movies, carbonated beverages, textile goods) that manage to make these compromises while maintaining some of the qualities that some individuals (ie, me) like. I avoided FMA because the people that I knew that liked it tend to like things I don't, but a friend talked me into watching it, and I ended up liking it. Fine. I still don't like Inu Yasha or Naruto. It's not that I dislike them because of the fan base (although I find Inu Yasha fangirls almost universally obnoxious, and Naruto fanboys to be almost universally deranged and moderately terrifying). I use their fanbases as a metric as to whether I am likely to enjoy the show. I almost always give in, watch an episode or two to see what all the fuss is about, and decide I was right to avoid it in the first place. Just because the show's not for me.
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GoodLuckSaturday
 Posts: 567 Location: Indiana |
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That's kind of my feeling on the whole issue. Fans won't keep me from watching or enjoying a show, but fans will make me overly critical on shows I otherwise highly enjoy because I simply don't feel it's to the standards of the fan's beliefs. I enjoy Haruhi Suzumiya and Death Note, but I'm annoyed at the unbelievable pedestal of quality that the shows are put on, simply because I believe they're only above average shows. |
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selenta
 Subscriber Posts: 1774 Location: Seattle, WA |
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Kind of a semantic, but YOU may not be talking about shows of equal fandom, but perhaps you should reread what I wrote, because I was. I was talking about two shows that were unknown to the public eye. The vast majority of the shows that didn't become popular didn't become popular... (and I know this is a shock)... are generally because they weren't as good as the ones that did. So if you pick one randomly (which you're essentially doing when you take just one person's opinion) out of the reject pile , you're probably not going to get a diamond, you're probably going to get a reject (surprise surprise). Here's the real meat of the argument though: You can use any method you like to find anime you think you'll like, but the anime should never be judged on anything but its own merits, at least ideally. The method of discovery has no completely logical method, nor does it matter, what matters is how the theory is tested i.e. "is the show any good?"(sound familiar philosophy majors?). If you think that avoiding popular stuff willl give you shows you like more often, that's fine; but assuming that it's bad because it's popular is an obvious logical fallacy. To quote abunai, as he said it very well:
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10円
Posts: 605 |
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I'm American simply because I was born here, but I don't fit the standard American mold and I don't follow the blind patriotism expected of weak-minded sheep by folks like McCarthy and Cheney. Who better to criticize Americans than a fellow American? Would the words of a Parisian be anywhere near as relevant? Besides, we're not talking about some deep psychological quandary here; we're talking about pop culture. You can follow the Neilson ratings or just turn on any television in the US or go to any mainstream movie. I've been surrounded by American media for the last three decades and the series and movies that get the most attention have almost always been utter crap in my view.
I cannot think of one single person who is anything like me, here or anywhere. Perhaps there are millions of people just like me, but I've never bumped into any of them. Even the occasional people who take it upon themselves to PM me with whatever connection they think we share are in reality nothing like me at all. Perhaps you think I'm gloating, but pure uniqueness isn't anything to be terribly proud of and it gives people an excuse to group me in with lowlife trash like Steroid and that guy who thought he was the soul of some DBZ character.
It's actually very simple. If a given title is very popular it's typically popular for reasons that do not match up well with what I find appealing. It doesn't matter if I know in advance that it's popular; the result is usually the same.
No, I still enjoy anime, but the most popular series tend to disappoint me, no matter how I come across them. I also think that most anime (90%) is crap. I'm a fan of many, many titles, but they're still a very small portion of all anime released.
It may indeed be silly, but unlike all these parasites that download anime for free, the only person I'm potentially hurting with this habit is me.
MTG was popular for what it was, but it wasn't the be-all, end-all card game. More people probably know how to play poker and blackjack than MTG, and yet you don’t see too many folks hating on poker players.
Then maybe you should have been responding to somebody else's post?
I'm not talking about the dregs here. The truly mainstream series, especially the ones that even fair weather fans and non-fans are willing to watch on CN et al, tend to leave a lot to be desired in my view.
I'm not picking randomly, I'm just avoiding the most popular series. Seems simple enough to me; I'm not sure what the hang up is here.
The only way I can judge every anime on its own merits is to watch every anime. I don't have enough money or free time for that so I have to make some sacrifices along the way to help keep me ahead of the curve. The only titles I can think of which I really, really enjoyed that were also extremely popular are the Miyazaki movies. |
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HitokiriShadow
 Posts: 6251 |
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Death Note (the manga) was really popular a year or two ago. But then the manga ended and, from what I hear, the second half of the series and the last volume or two in particular were quite a disappointment so the popularity went down. I'm really not seeing the comparison between Death Note and Jigoku Shoujo as they are fundamentally different. Yes, both involve somone killing people.... just like hundreds of other anime and millions of other titles in various forms of media. But the very basis of the series are very different. Jigoku Shoujo is episodic and focuses on the individuals seeking Jigoku Shoujo's power to get them out of their situation and probably more on JG and her team in later episodes. I suppose there is some philosophy and morality on various things in there as well (or at least the potential for it), but I can't say too much on that as I only saw the first ten episodes of the first season. I would say it is similar to Requiem from the Darkness more than anything else. Death Note on the other hand, focuses on a boy who gets the power to kill simply by writing down a persons name (and details if he desires) and develops a god complex and engages in a battle of wits (mental jousting, if you will) with people trying to figure out who he is and put him behind bars for mass murder. I'm at a loss for anything that it really compares to. My point is that they are fundamentally different to the point that they are no more comparable to each other than Rurouni Kenshin and Ninja Scroll. They both samurai, but that's about it. Last edited by HitokiriShadow on Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:38 am; edited 1 time in total |
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selenta
Subscriber Posts: 1774 Location: Seattle, WA |
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I didn't feel the need to address anyone else's posts. I only mentioned it because I was already going to say something. As such: you're really stretching it this time dax, how about actually reading what I write and address the things I bring up without putting words in my mouth.
Perhaps you should read what I write before you respond, or you're just going to be begging to get your posts deleted for trolling. They leave a lot to be desired? That's fine, but you're completely ignoring what I'm saying. I never even said they were the dregs, I simply said they're "not as good", you're twisting my words, again.
I just explained this... I'll do it one last time for you. Assuming that you're choosing shows because they're not popular, nearly all the shows are going to have a roughly equal (small) fanbase. If you choose one person, and get a recomendation from them, that is essentially random, as anyone is a fan of one of these cult shows for any of a number of reasons. As I said, it doesn't make it a bad way to go, but it is random, and to claim otherwise just shows how far you're going out of your way to disagree this time.
Uh... who said anything about having to watch every anime? Do you even read what people write? Or do you just always feel the need to disagree with popular opinion on everything just because it's the most popular or accepted opinion? Well, congratulations, you're a rebel. Now you can go shop at Hot Topic and wear your girls pants 
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10円
Posts: 605 |
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I'm not twisting your words and I don't really care what you think anyway. I'm bailing on our little conversation now as I see no point in discussing anything with somebody who's apparently willing to try and bait me into a ban.
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jetz
 Posts: 2148 Location: Manila, Philippines |
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I'm one of those people who watch animes because I WANT TO WATCH and not because of other people.
So I don't watch naruto, DBZ and many other popular animes. I don't watch them because I have my reasons, mostly because I don't like the drawing style of Naruto and DBZ because it's not for me.. Also, these animes are just too long.. |
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selenta
Subscriber Posts: 1774 Location: Seattle, WA |
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I'm only "threatening" to do my job as a moderator by disciplining people who don't follow the rules.
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ikillchicken
 Posts: 7272 Location: Vancouver |
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I dont see any reason to Aviod Anime just cause of the Fandom associated with it. Then again perhaps thats easy for me to say. i dont know any other fans IRL so im never really judged or have to justify my choice of Anime by RL people and really, who cares if some dude on a forum thinks Im a Narutard /=
Still though, If I like an Anime, I'll watch it. For instance, Naruto. I've been watching it and its not bad once you get past the filler episodes and onto some of the better arcs. I started watching it because it sounded mildly interesting. I dont care what fandom might be associated with it. |
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Kouji
 Posts: 978 |
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10円
Posts: 605 |
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1. The more popular mainstream anime out there (DBZ, Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, InuYasha, etc.) have been flat-out terrible in my view. 2. Being exceptionally unique is neither especially good nor especially bad in-and-of itself. 3. Asking people if they like to hear themselves talk is a pointless question, but considering the source... |
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Lord Dolmus
Posts: 97 |
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Lol. So Death Note is about a notebook that kills people? So none of the characters like Light, L, Misa, Ryukk, and Rem have anything to do with it, it's all the notebook? I'm not trying to flame you but Death Note is for people 16 and older so do some growin and try to watch it again in a few years, you'll love it. Also nobody quote me on the 16 and older comment, it's just an example so don't take it seriously. |
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Dardre
 Posts: 166 |
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Please tell me this was sarcastic. If not, then it's exactly the kind of thing that turns me away from a particular series. In my experience, I've found that when a large number of fans talk about how great a series is, and that I'll love that series if I'd just watch it, it usually turns out that I won't love it; might like it, but not love it. For me, I avoid many of those series that have the 'tard fans. It's not so much because the series might be bad, but because I have the vague worry that after I watch it, I'll start acting like that. After all, they watched it, and look at how they act now  I have seen Naruto and Bleach, and while I like them well enough, I've thankfully avoided 'tardism'. But even with that experience, I'm still cautious about series and genre that have such....loud...fans.
On a related note, I'm ambivalent about those shows fans, and others, hype. I've actually gotten odd looks at my local Suncoast when, after the employee rang me up and saw that I was an anime fan, he mentioned the Cowboy Bebop movie was coming out soon and I told him I had no interest in it. He looked like I had just killed his cat right in front of him. It just seems to me that all to many fans can't understand that not everyone likes what they do. I couldn't care less about FMA or Deathnote, or The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya. It's not that they are in genre that I dislike, it's just they don't appeal to me. So when I read about things like 'the long awaited release of such-and-such a series' I usually just shrug and think I'll check it out a few months after it comes out, maybe. |
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digitalkikka
 Posts: 462 Location: Chicago, Illinois |
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So if someone doesn't like Death Note, it's because they're just not old enough to understand it? And once they reach 16 it will instantly become a series they love?  Like Dardre, I too hope you're being sarcastic. If not, I suggest reading this thread again.
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