Forum - View topicNEWS: Tokyopop CEO Cites Borders' Bankruptcy for Layoffs
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enurtsol
Posts: 14872 |
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If B&M stores have prices comparable to online stores, they wouldn't be B&M stores. You'd go drive to their store and order off their website. |
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jsevakis
Former ANN Editor in Chief
Posts: 1684 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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Almost certainly not. This sort of debt is "unsecured debt" (as opposed to bank loans, which are "secured"). In a bankruptcy situation almost all unsecured debt gets dismissed outright, and even if Borders goes into liquidation the secured debt gets paid back first, and there would likely not be enough in assets to cover all of that. |
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evaunit01berserk
Posts: 22 |
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Suuuuuure tokyopop, blame everyone but yourself for the layoffs.
That crap you put on G4 such as shows with a ghetto hyperactice guy named "big c" regarding cars and female asses didn't make the situation any worse huh? |
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Mr. sickVisionz
Posts: 2175 |
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I don't understand this statement at all. You are aware that most corporations in the US work purchase and sell things on debt/credit system. It's a little thing called accounts payable and accounts receivable that you see on nearly 100% of SEC financial filings for publicly traded companies. It's not as foreign or crazy a concept as you make it out to be. Even on a consumer level most people have credit cards that provide similar functionality. But ignoring all of that and the reality of how businesses actually work, how is Borders having debt not a Borders issue? |
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Almaz
Posts: 134 |
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The biggest problem is Borders paying the debt with another "credit card." Borders have been getting loans for a while now to pay the bills. There is a point when enough is enough. Otherwise, I believe Borders has been paying the publishers until a few months ago. Borders could not get another loan without a bankruptcy proceeding. I personally think Borders is in the same boat as Blockbuster. |
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The Xenos
Posts: 1519 Location: Boston |
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Of course whether this makes the movie bomb or not is irrelevant. Though turds like the Michael Bay Transformers movies do well at th BO, so who knows what's going to work. Quality doesn't mean sales and vice versa. |
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MrHatandClogs
Posts: 283 Location: Between two ferns! |
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Wrong, for one, that show was produced from 2009-2010. Borders hasn't been airing out their dirty laundry for that long. I'm sure TP didn't even know about this until they were nearly if not completely finished with AGO. Second, why does everyone seem to forget, that 5-6 yrs ago, Borders was the only retail store you could buy manga in? Ofc, borders going bankrupt is going to have a huge affect on the American manga publishers. As for Viz and others. You have to look at their properties. Do you think Viz will ever be in trouble while "The big three" are still publishing? Yen's got Black Butler, Haruhi, etc. Dark Horse has still got their hands on huge sellers...i.e. Blade of the Immortal, Berserk, Oh! My Goddess, etc. All old but still huge sellers. Not to mention the NGE spinoffs, etc. Kodansha is self explanitory. And, DMP took over the BL market. What have TP pick up lately? Neko Ramen? Yea, they have Maid sama, Maria Holic, Hetalia, Alice, etc. but none of these are big like the above mentioned. That my friends, on top of the Borders fiasco, is why TP is having problems. Edit: And, I have no idea why Seven Seas stays "afloat". I'm sure grabbing Toradara! will help, but I can't imagine all those self-published OEL's are doing that great. I guess they did announce a sequel to Amazing Agent Luna, so it must sell well enough? |
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Charred Knight
Posts: 3085 |
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Hetalia is a lot more popular than anything Dark Horse publishes. Also Dark Horse rarely gets huge popular manga, Oh My Goddess peaked 10 years ago. It's just that Dark Horse knows it's limits and doesn't try to do too much. |
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Tamaria
Posts: 1512 Location: De Achterhoek |
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Exactly. Manga series don't have to do great, they just have to do well enough to stay profitable as long as they are in print. Dark Horse has found a comfortable little niche, made a name for itself and is now reaping the benefits. It's the same with Vertical. Tokyopop went with a whole different business strategy for way too long. They gambled on big hits even though they (and the industry as a whole) weren't in the position to do so anymore. |
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asimpson2006
Posts: 3151 Location: USA |
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Dance in the Vampire Bund ring a bell. I'm pretty sure that series is doing well for for them. If I had to guess I would say that is most likely one of their top selling if not their top selling series than have right now. |
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PetrifiedJello
Posts: 3782 |
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I'm surprised by this, given how much detail you put into your post. You seem to understand the issue pretty well. Justin's comments about the industry were true once, but they're no longer valid in a shrinking market. It's rather foolish to apply those same business rules of 15 years ago to retailers today. The market is shrinking, and Tokyopop has the nerve to blame Borders for its financial issues? There was a "sustainable" monopoly 15 years ago. The internet has proven the monopoly is no longer sustainable. |
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jsevakis
Former ANN Editor in Chief
Posts: 1684 Location: Los Angeles, CA |
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The completely misinformed armchair quarterbacking in this thread is giving me a migraine.
Let me try one more time: All distribution to retailers, especially big powerful ones, are done on credit or consignment. ALL of it. Everything you see at Rite Aid, Walmart, Best Buy and Borders is shipped first and invoiced later. If you don't play ball, your product doesn't get stocked. Simple as that. Does it suck for small companies? Does it lead to large retail chains, regardless of how they're doing, abusing small companies because they can? Yes, yes and yes. It's why so many distribute through middlemen distributors just to get a little more muscle in getting paid. But a publisher as small as Tokyopop does not get a say in changing the system with a big retail chain. They just stop getting stocked if they don't like it. So there was no other way than to continue taking Borders' "credit card" unless they were willing to throw away 50% of their business forever. Period. |
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Mr. sickVisionz
Posts: 2175 |
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Selling things on credit is how business works in the US. The concepts of credit and debt aren't foolish and archaic business rules that shouldn't be applied today. I'm not talking about anything other than that and the person who said that a customer who's responsible for 50% of Tokyopop's sales not paying them money owed can't be pointed to as a cause for Tokyopop's financial burdens. |
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bayoab
Posts: 831 |
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I think the big three don't sell as well as you think they do. (They aren't Viz's 3 biggest series per vol.)
At least in B&M, none of those are huge sellers. Hellsing is their huge seller.
Hetalia and Alice are bigger than almost every property you named through traditional chains. |
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PetrifiedJello
Posts: 3782 |
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Okay, let me spill this out for everyone, because it seems the obvious is being missed out: When a business sells only one thing, and the market demand for this one thing shrinks, it's inevitable businesses will be affected when they refuse to find something else to sell. This isn't "armchair quarterbacking". It's Business 101 and Economics 101. Tell me I'm wrong and I'll point you to Blockbuster, GM, newspapers, and Suncoast, just to name a few who also failed because of a shrinking market. |
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