Forum - View topicDour &/or depressing anime.
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Mister V
 Posts: 1000 |
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Personally, I was very entertained, in a way. I mean, entertainment doesn't always have to be sunshine and flowers, right? I think it's the best tragedy I've seen. I'll certainly watch it again when I'm in the mood, because as a tragedy, it was hugely entertaining. Wouldn't this new Musashi film also conform to Key's definition? |
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ailblentyn
 Posts: 1688 Location: body in Ohio, heart in Sydney |
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What about Alien Nine, a show (and manga) whose whole thrust seems to be to present in as upsetting a way possible a horrifying truth about puberty --- viz. that its changes are so great that they put in question the nature of identity. [Man, I love I when I get to use viz.] 
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Tony K.
 SubscriberModerator  Posts: 11352 Location: Frisco, TX |
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I agree. If tragedy is what you're looking for, then this definitely has it. From what I remember, it wasn't so much about the actual relationship between the two, but the fact that any kind of relation could exist between any one of those characters, even throughout that hellacious setting. It's just a shame so many of those "links" were short-lived because they'd all pretty much die at some point. |
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hipnox
 Posts: 143 |
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i dont know if it meets the criteria, because i havnt watched it yet, but im told Casshern sins is actually quite tragic and depressing
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lesterf1020
 Subscriber Posts: 292 Location: Trinidad and Tobago |
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It is quite slow, sad and depressing but very pretty. If you take the main plot seriously then Gilgamesh is a never ending pot of bleak hopeless despair topped off with a healthy dose of futility. A clear case of the light at the end of the tunnel being an incoming train. |
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poilk92
 Posts: 433 Location: Long Beach California |
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I think I understand what you are driving at a little better now but I have to stick to my point that tragedy and purely informative stories are entertainment in their own respect. Though I think the issue isn't whether something lacks entertainment value. Instead it is whether the creators prioritized a message or information more than entertaining the audience which is certainly a respectable goal but i cannot say with confidence i have seen a single anime that lives up to that standard. However I do not believe this is in anyway a fault, to embed information or a message inside an entertaining show is the best way to deliver it (much like coating a pill in sugar if we stick with the medicine metaphor). If you finish watching a series feeling as if you have learned something or understand something better but cannot point out at which point that series made its point that is a greater success than simply preaching
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Haruhi Season 2. That wasn't entertainment, that was an experiment that doubled as a giant F U to fans. As in "we can rerun virtually the same episode for eight times and you will still buy it". I don't know about any of you but I certainly got depressed, mostly at the state of the Anime industry.
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hipnox
Posts: 143 |
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im not sure that counts |
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Zin5ki
 Posts: 6680 Location: London, UK |
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Allow me to focus upon two of the criteria you quote, namely:
I do not consider the proposed titles, viz. Elfen Lied and Now and Then, Here and There, to meet these conditions. Firstly, we have an intuitive conception of what it means to be informed. Those who wish to be informed intend to learn of certain facts. Whilst both Elfen Lied and Now and Then, Here and There depict activities vaguely similar to certain real events, it is nevertheless the case that they only depict purely fictional actions. They do not reliably inform the viewer of any facts pertaining to the activities of specific real people, since real people are not the "objects" of their depiction. Presumably, the only way by which one can claim that these anime may be watched as a means of being informed is by arguing that their content is still representative of real events or event sorts, and that it is these real events of which a person wishes to be informed whilst watching the anime. This is presumably the argument the original poster intends to make. (One can alternatively argue that fictional events are indeed the things of which people wish to be informed, though this seems unwise: surely we watch fictions not because we wish to learn of their "fictionally informative" content, but instead because we wish to engage in the various responses and contemplation that this content may provide.) Secondly, it is intuitively false to say that Elfen Lied and Now and Then, Here and There are not watched as a means of being entertained, presuming that one considers certain experiences of excitement and sorrow — namely those caused by fictions — to be instances of entertainment. Fans of such titles have much to say of the thrilling and moving experiences they provide, and these fans' accounts are often so vivid as to suggest that said experiences are the most valuable things to gain from viewing. I must ask the original poster two questions, each pertaining to one of the above two paragraphs.
By addressing these questions, the original poster might perhaps be able to clarify their position and thereby counter my criticisms. (I should note that upon reflection, there exist relatively straightforward responses to at least one of my questions.) |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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I think it largely does, at least on a personal level. As I said before, I certainly didn't see Endless Eight as supposed to be entertaining. But I did find it informative as to how mindless the typical Otaku is, and how cynical the companies that exploit these mindless consumers are. |
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A Mystery
 Posts: 1887 Location: Netherlands |
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I believe most of the titles mentioned do try to dramatize events (like Rumbling Hearts), it's not an anime that you just watch to be informed, like Key said. Grave of the fireflies is indeed a good example.
However, if there's one title I think is depressing - it's Bokura ga ita. First it was indeed entertaining. spoiler[Maybe it's just me, but after ten episodes or so, it gets harder and harder to watch!] And then spoiler[in the end, that train scene... ] |
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poilk92
Posts: 433 Location: Long Beach California |
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@Zin5ki
Maybe we should look at it differently. Rather than an anime that was not intended as entertainment the original poster is looking for something that was not entertaining to watch BUT you feel like after seeing it you are better informed. That is what the original thread seemed to focus on and I am fairly certain every anime was designed to be enjoyed to some degree or it wouldn't be made so that argument is simply DOA |
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Zin5ki
Posts: 6680 Location: London, UK |
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Do you mean to suggest an anime that is somehow successful as an educational resource of sorts, in spite of its failure as an entertaining one? There may be titles fitting this criterion, though I am disinclined to consider Elfen Lied one of them. Whilst I learned very little from watching it, I still gained substantially. Last edited by Zin5ki on Wed Oct 13, 2010 6:12 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Tony K.
Subscriber Moderator Posts: 11352 Location: Frisco, TX |
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"Better informed?" Yeah, that sounds like an accurate assessment. Most of the melancholy or bittersweet titles I've seen often feel darker and more cumbersome in atmosphere, but in exchange can depict some poignant allegories, symbolism, and whatnot in the form of character drama, plot twists, or visual representation. Those were some of the qualities I liked so much about Satoshi Kon's work and also enjoyed in Monster, Mushi-shi, Jin-roh, and probably a bunch of other titles that escape my mind at the moment.
I suppose it comes down to the nature of the genre, though. As much as I'd like to praise a few select shounen series for their equally enlightening stories, I think most of the dour and depressing stuff tend to do this better than most because there aren't any superpowered fighters, giant robots, or big bouncing tits to distract and tarnish the more serious points of the writing. |
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Kruszer
 Posts: 7987 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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Many of the ones I've seen have probabally already been mentioned but I put forth a couple:
Hell Girl- All three series are incredibly depressing and hopeless. As it's about a group of demons sending people to Hell on the behest of people who have grudges against them with the price being the sender's own soul. spoiler[Often the person that gets sent hell doesn't really deserve it, and even if the sender was a good person they still go to Hell when they die.] Kurozuka- Basically the whole affair was spoiler[a giant endlessly repeating cycle where the vampire lady plays a game with her lover by manipulating both sides of a conflict so that he will find her. In the process millions die, and when he finds her she cuts his head off and plops it on another body to do it all over again. ] Tokyo Magnitude 8.0- Well, it's an earthquake disaster series so naturally you have lots of death and destruction. These series were actually good though, which is more than I can say for some other series mentioned up thread. Personally, I don't mind a bit of depression I just don't like it in large fatalistic doses like Gantz, Gilgamesh, or Texhnolyze. I will also usually hate most romantic tragedy pieces. Last edited by Kruszer on Wed Oct 13, 2010 6:29 pm; edited 5 times in total |
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