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Mohawk52



Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 4:25 pm Reply with quote
luffypirate85 wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
Zac wrote:
_V_ wrote:


Rather, they fumbled around debating how to pronounce it, then *turned to me* in the audience and I shouted out "Ay-vangelion as in Day!"


Just be happy you weren't a fan 10 years ago when people routinely referred to it as "Evanjelawn". Not that I really give a shit, but it used to be worse.
I feel the same about the whole franchise post series. It's always been nothing but a golden shower by Anno onto anime fans what dissed the original series to me. On the topic of pronunciations, I put that down to Japanese Engrish, like how they pronounced "eureka" in "Eureka 7"; "El-wreaka".


People that can't correctly pronounce the titles of anime really irritate me. The characters even say "Evangelion!" in the show. Really now? Have you actually seen it? This makes me think not.
Laughing If you're replying to me, this makes me think you're barking up the wrong tree, but if you are replying to Zac, I leave you to your fate. Wink
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jsevakis
Former ANN Editor in Chief


Joined: 28 Jul 2003
Posts: 1684
Location: Los Angeles, CA
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 4:34 pm Reply with quote
Zade wrote:
So... if Funimation can produce blue-rays at a low price because they do it in house... wouldn't that mean the price would rise when they get sold off?


No, because the authoring department is part of Funimation, not Navarre.
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Zade



Joined: 03 Mar 2008
Posts: 79
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 4:48 pm Reply with quote
jsevakis wrote:
Zade wrote:
So... if Funimation can produce blue-rays at a low price because they do it in house... wouldn't that mean the price would rise when they get sold off?


No, because the authoring department is part of Funimation, not Navarre.


Okay, thanks.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23907
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 5:05 pm Reply with quote
ikillchicken wrote:
Shenl742 wrote:
...I'm sure the whole thing is alot more complicated then you think. Be a little more patient


How exactly is it 'more complicated'? Please do enlighten me with your actual reason before you tell me what to do. Also don't talk to me about patience. I was patient when they offered me no decent streaming option. I was patient when they hedged on acquiring the DVD rights initially despite picking up shit like Vampire Bund the previous season while it was still airing. I was patient while they picked up a half dozen different garbage harem series for a dubbed DVD release since then. Now I'm out of [expletive] patience.


Aw, poor widdle baby. Damn Funi for releasing shows they think will make money as opposed to simply catering to your specific taste. Cry me a river, princess.
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agila61



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 3213
Location: NE Ohio
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 5:33 pm Reply with quote
hissatsu01 wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
On the topic of pronunciations, I put that down to Japanese Engrish, like how they pronounced "eureka" in "Eureka 7"; "El-wreaka".


Ask yourself how that word is pronounced in just about any other language but English. ...
How about Greek? Its originally a ancient Greek word ~ Εὕρηκα/Ηὕρηκα

I don't have the same access to Greek native speakers as I did in Newcastle ~ I could have asked members of the Hamilton Olympic football club how to pronounce it.

Zac wrote:
If your question is redundant or is answered during the course of the show before I get to it, obviously I skip over it.
Thanks for asking the streaming question, it was the first question that came up in forums in several other sites.

And the answer shed a lot of light on Funimation's overall strategy, even if they are not ready to announce their streaming slate yet.

ikillchicken wrote:
agila61 wrote:
People who are waiting to see how the new site works out before complaining about it would be the ones with patience. People who lose their shit in basically Funimation's first year of extensive streaming when they know that a revamp of their site will sooner or later be ready would, by definition, have little or no patience.
A few things first off: 1) Funimation has been doing streaming since late 2008 so it's actually been 2 years.
Fine, two years: I won't quibble over how much streaming constitutes extensive streaming.

No need for a wall of words on this. You are arguing that two years is a long time for a business to get a new line of business sorted out so that everything is done to your complete satisfaction.

That's not a whole hell of a lot of patience, is it? Especially in the context that they are (apparently with several hiccups) working on a revamp so that you have no way of knowing which of your complaints you will have to wave a sad goodbye to because they have been made obsolete before the start of the Winter 2011 season, and which you are going to be able to continue deploying.

As far as definitions, wordnetweb.princeton.edu gives:
Quote:
good-natured tolerance of delay or incompetence
... which sure as hell aint what you are doing, and the Wikipedia machine gives
Quote:
Patience is the state of endurance under difficult circumstances, which can mean persevering in the face of delay or provocation without acting on annoyance/anger in a negative way; or exhibiting forbearance when under strain, especially when faced with longer-term difficulties. ...
... which sure as hell aint what you are doing.

That's what made you tirade about how much patience you had already shown such a wonderful contribution. Thanks for that: its gloomy weather outside, but a good belly laugh is like a ray of sunshine.
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wandering-dreamer



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 1733
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 6:01 pm Reply with quote
Well it sounded like they are going to simulcast at least Kuragehime soon so I'll see if I can hold off on fansubs for a few weeks and it sounds like they intend to release their other noitaminA shows on DVD and that would be super awesome (I'd totally buy them early for the extra nice new packaging).
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ikillchicken



Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 7272
Location: Vancouver
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:22 pm Reply with quote
agila61 wrote:
That's what made you tirade about how much patience you had already shown such a wonderful contribution. Thanks for that: its gloomy weather outside, but a good belly laugh is like a ray of sunshine.


I'm going to say this for the last time: You can go ahead and lodge your little ad hominem attacks and insults right back up in that place you're pulling em from. If all you're interested in doing is taking a bunch of pissy little shots at me then you can just go find someone else to troll. I have no interest in a big, back and forth flame war and I'm sure as hell not going to sit here and try and have a real conversation with you while you insult me. So what's it gonna be? Can you cut it out or should we just drop this?

Quote:
You are arguing that two years is a long time for a business to get a new line of business sorted out so that everything is done to your complete satisfaction.


Well that depends. If by 'sort out' and 'complete satisfaction' you mean to get it working in a very basic sense then yeah. Two years is a pretty damn long time to take to sort this out. I can forgive some issues but right now Funimation is unable to provide me with even vaguely effective simulcasts which does lead me to wonder then why on earth are they simulcasting?

Of course this is all beside the point. Even though I think it's pretty nuts that it's taking this long, as I said a moment ago, if they could at least eventually get it working right I would be marginally satisfied. That's just the kind of patient and reasonable guy I am. However, my concern is that as it stands there really is nothing to indicate that they will solve this problem. Just wild speculation on your part about what this revamp will entail. Based on their track record I see no reason I should be optimistic.

Blood- wrote:
Aw, poor widdle baby. Damn Funi for releasing shows they think will make money as opposed to simply catering to your specific taste. Cry me a river, princess.


Blood...stop shooting your big old mouth off for a sec and read. I am not complaining about Funimation's licensing choices. If they're going to license garbage, that's their business. What I take issue with is them squatting on the licenses for shows that do cater to my taste and thereby hampering the chances of another company bringing them over here. So pretty much the opposite of what you said.
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maaya



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
Posts: 976
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:22 pm Reply with quote
Thanks for the answer, Justin ^^ It's ... too bad for Fruits Basket ^^;;

hissatsu01 wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
On the topic of pronunciations, I put that down to Japanese Engrish, like how they pronounced "eureka" in "Eureka 7"; "El-wreaka".


Ask yourself how that word is pronounced in just about any other language but English. It's used in Spanish, French, and German for instance. It's the English pronunciation that's very strange. Otherwise you'd be watching "Yuriika 7."


It's actually true, that in animes the Japanese do not base all their pronunciation of foreign words on english. They often go for the original language of a word. Or else just because of preference, setting of the story or to have something more exotic they will chose other pronunciations than the english one.
These may sound "unnatural", "weird" etc to english speakers, which is normal. I'd just like english native speakers to not assume right away that it is simply a "wrong english pronunciation" (which often is true as well) but consider the possibility of a foreign language just a bit more often ^^;;

PS: El-wreaka? Your ears are maybe kind of amazing Wink
They actually pronounce Eureka just as it is written: "E-u-re-ka", which is indeed based on ancient greek ("e" as in "step", "u" as in "room", "re" as in "rest", "ka" as in "car").

Of course, unsurprisingly, the pronunication of Evangelion they use in the anime is as well based on greek.
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agila61



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 3213
Location: NE Ohio
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:52 pm Reply with quote
ikillchicken wrote:
What I take issue with is them squatting on the licenses for shows that do cater to my taste and thereby hampering the chances of another company bringing them over here. So pretty much the opposite of what you said.
Of course, in the ANNcast it is made clear that they do not sign streaming licenses just to stream, but with the intention of at least trying to negotiate a deal that allows them to put a dub in the show.

If they end up not being able to negotiate a deal that looks viable from their side, why do you assume that it would be any more viable for anyone else?

And indeed, if they end up passing on a show that they have streamed, you've presented absolutely zero argument as to why that would hamper the chances of it being licensed by anyone else. You are just assuming your conclusion, short-cutting the whole "argument" part altogether.

And when the hysteria is focused on House of Five Leaves and Tatami Galaxy, we are talking about shows that broadcast in the current year, making it laughably unrealistic to jump to any conclusions about whether or not they will end up successfully negotiating a deal.
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luffypirate



Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 3187
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:11 am Reply with quote
Mohawk52 wrote:
luffypirate85 wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
Zac wrote:
_V_ wrote:


Rather, they fumbled around debating how to pronounce it, then *turned to me* in the audience and I shouted out "Ay-vangelion as in Day!"


Just be happy you weren't a fan 10 years ago when people routinely referred to it as "Evanjelawn". Not that I really give a shit, but it used to be worse.
I feel the same about the whole franchise post series. It's always been nothing but a golden shower by Anno onto anime fans what dissed the original series to me. On the topic of pronunciations, I put that down to Japanese Engrish, like how they pronounced "eureka" in "Eureka 7"; "El-wreaka".


People that can't correctly pronounce the titles of anime really irritate me. The characters even say "Evangelion!" in the show. Really now? Have you actually seen it? This makes me think not.
Laughing If you're replying to me, this makes me think you're barking up the wrong tree, but if you are replying to Zac, I leave you to your fate. Wink


It wasn't directed at anyone here. I'm just ranting. I have no outlet for this IRL.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:31 am Reply with quote
ikillchicken wrote:
Blood- wrote:
Aw, poor widdle baby. Damn Funi for releasing shows they think will make money as opposed to simply catering to your specific taste. Cry me a river, princess.


Blood...stop shooting your big old mouth off for a sec and read. I am not complaining about Funimation's licensing choices. If they're going to license garbage, that's their business. What I take issue with is them squatting on the licenses for shows that do cater to my taste and thereby hampering the chances of another company bringing them over here. So pretty much the opposite of what you said.


Don't be stupid - of course you are complaining about Funi's licensing choices. You specifically griped about the fact that Funi licensed "shit" like Dance in the Vampire while apparently "hedging" on the DVD shows rights for titles YOU like, such as House of Five Leaves. As usual, your ignorance is revealed in your baseless assumptions. You are assuming that if Funi hadn't gotten the streaming rights for Five Leaves and Tatami Galaxy, that some other distrib - salivating at the thought of selling 5 copies - would have rushed in and snapped up the titles for a DVD release. Neither you, nor I, nor anybody else who doesn't work in a distrib acquisition job can say if that is true or not. Naturally, posters like you never bother to check facts before spouting off. Are you aware there are other noitaminA titles out there that Funi never streamed which also have not yet been acquired for DVD release in R1? Why do you think that is, super-genius? I'll tell you why, O Wise One: because no friggin' company wants them. Did it ever occur to you that by streaming Five Leaves and Tatami Galaxy that Funi may have been exposing them to a wider audience than otherwise have been the case? Of course you wouldn't have thought that way. You just want to spout off some ignorant garbage without even bothering to rub two brain cells together first - as usual.
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DangerMouse



Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Posts: 3984
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:06 am Reply with quote
_V_ wrote:
I sympathize with your position in some respects: lets face facts, the dubbing industry was in its infancy in 1997...but it was also the period when it grew into maturity.

-->Even I think that the dub only really hits its stride around episode 8, when the second storyarc starts. And it gets truly great around episode 17 or so.

This is why I like the English dub of Rebuild of Eva 1 so much: particularly because it was so close to episodes 1-6, it allows Spike and Allison a real chance to do Shinji and Misato, with justice, in the first storyarc.

Also, speaking of Blu rays, the Rebuild of Eva 1.11 Blu Ray was the first I ever bought, what made me get a Blu Ray player, and I was not disappointed. All the major Blu Ray review sites said it was the new *benchmark* in Blu ray audio-visual quality.

(extras, on the other hand, were sorely missed...)


Agreed, and I would love to hear Grant do the same for Asuka since I already loved her Asuka and like those two in the first movie the re-do for these movies so many years later with the new Voice Director will be miles better than a performance I already liked for it's time just like theirs in the first Rebuild movie.

Yeah, even having bought Blu-rays before Eva 1.11, it was one freaking gorgeous audio-visual feast of demo material.

Oneeyedjacks wrote:
einhorn303 wrote:
Ouran bombing on BD doesn't mean Index/Railgun will. Of course female fujoshi don't care as much about HD and high tech audio/video as male otaku fans.


Yeah, I don't understand the logic behind this decision.

Ouran is a High School romantic comedy with loads of Bishōnen, that was originally released on DVD. And then later released as an up-scaled Blu-ray. I can understand why no one bought it.

Index and Railgun are both action/comedy/dramas with some fanservice elements. Both of these I'm pretty sure were animated in HD.

I would much prefer to own both of them on Blu-ray, and I think Funi is making a big mistake not doing so.


Agreed, I'd get them both as well.

And I'm also not sure why they'd be put in the same category with Ouran at all, it just doesn't make sense, the Index and Railgun franchise is an action title and something like Index easily fits into the mold of action titles with a bit of comedy on the side that have regularly tended to sell well here I think so I'm kind of shocked.
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ikillchicken



Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 7272
Location: Vancouver
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:30 am Reply with quote
agila61 wrote:
Of course, in the ANNcast it is made clear that they do not sign streaming licenses just to stream, but with the intention of at least trying to negotiate a deal that allows them to put a dub in the show.


Okay, but I would have to call bullshit on that. I can believe that they intend to do that for some of these shows but assuming this streaming deal is ongoing, then this would apply to current and future noitaminA shows as well. Sorry but he's a liar if he's claiming that they're seriously considering bringing something like Kuragehime over on DVD with a full dub. There's no way and he knows it. Or what about the live-action one from last season? Or what about whatever noitaminA comes up with next that may be even more odd? As I said initially, my concern is that this will become a recurring problem.

Quote:
If they end up not being able to negotiate a deal that looks viable from their side, why do you assume that it would be any more viable for anyone else?


Well hang on. It's not just about a DVD release. Other simulcasters actually offer workable streams. If Crunchyroll, Section 23 or ANN had picked up these shows or were to pick up future noitaminA shows then at the very least I would have a decent fall back option to watch them via streams even if it didn't actually result in a DVD deal. That's really the primary problem with the funimation situation. If these shows just don't justify a DVD release and must remain simulcast only then I can accept that. But then give me a bloody decent simulcast. Funimation hasn't really done that.

In regards to the DVD though, their dub only rule is probably the most obvious reason it might work for somebody else but not them. It's a rule I generally appreciate but in these cases it seems to be working against me. This is definitely one case where I would buy sub only (especially in the hope that a dub might eventually be made if sales justify it).

Also though, as you've said a company can't overextend itself. For this reason, a deal may not make sense from their end not because a release of these shows would be hopelessly unprofitable but simply because it's not profitable enough or not enough of a sure thing compared to other options. Funimation is the biggest player in the market right now. They've got their pick of pretty much whatever they want. If there are better options then clearly they're going to have to go with those options. On the other hand though, it might be a deal that makes sense another company who isn't quite so high on the food chain.

I mean, come on. You're saying here that a if a show doesn't make sense for Funimation it must therefore not make sense for any other companies. The implication then is that any show that does make sense for any other company must also make sense for Funimation. Obviously that isn't true unless of course you're going to tell me that every obscure, niche title that Section 23 or Media Blasters or Nozomi has put out recently would also have made sense as a Funimation release (and if so, I must ask: why didn't Funimation release it?)

Quote:
And indeed, if they end up passing on a show that they have streamed, you've presented absolutely zero argument as to why that would hamper the chances of it being licensed by anyone else. You are just assuming your conclusion, short-cutting the whole "argument" part altogether.


Well it would obviously stop it from being licensed to stream by anyone else. As for DVD though, I'm definitely inclined to think that it would hurt it's chances. Look at the stuff on Crunchyroll. How often does any of it get picked up? Maybe on occasion but otherwise it's rare. If a show has already been streamed it doesn't look as appealing in the eyes of other companies. I'd think even more so if another DVD distributor already had the option (as well as the numbers from streaming) and passed on it. Plus there's the issue of time. The more time passes the less appealing a show is going to be.

Quote:
And when the hysteria is focused on House of Five Leaves and Tatami Galaxy, we are talking about shows that broadcast in the current year, making it laughably unrealistic to jump to any conclusions about whether or not they will end up successfully negotiating a deal.


For a show that didn't belong to anyone I would agree. Come on though. These are shows that Funimation has the streaming rights to already. Do you really not think that if they wanted the DVD rights they probably would have gotten them by now? Not that I'm saying it's impossible they won't still get them of course. I never said that, just that it's really not looking good. It's been a good four months since they finished airing. They've picked up the rights to the other stuff they've simulcasted a whole lot quicker. The single biggest reason I doubt they will though is that I actually don't know if a DVD release for these shows is a good idea. Sure I'd personally love it but for a company like Funimation, if I was in charge, I probably wouldn't put it out there. On top of that though, I sure as hell wouldn't put something like Kuragehime out. Again my original point was in regards to not only the two shows I mentioned but the news that their streaming deal was apparently still going which does not bode well for future series.



Blood-:
I have absolutely no intention of responding to you until you express your point without having a little hissy fit and calling me names. I mean my god. You're a middle aged man. Grow the hell up. If you'd like to try again, feel free to do so. Until then I have nothing to say to you.
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CG-LOVER



Joined: 22 Mar 2010
Posts: 355
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:51 am Reply with quote
Well it is nice to hear from someone in the anime industry again, though really we're still just hearing more of the same.

Yes, we know that TV is still the best way to get exposure.

Yes, we know about all the issues with anime retail sales.

Yes, we know that the selling of FUNimation shouldn't be considered a negative (or at least we should know that by now).

I guess there were a couple interesting things to hear about though:

First, I agree with what Lance said about selling Blu-Rays at retail stores, because I've had confusing experiences looking for those myself. It is also nice to know that the low prices on these Blu-Rays are also managing to bring in good numbers. That's a nice trend.

Also, as a person who loves collecting I'm very glad about the return of premium items!

I'd also love to see the new Trigun movie in theaters, but like many I expect that it won't be playing anywhere near me.
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bayoab



Joined: 06 Oct 2004
Posts: 831
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 2:00 am Reply with quote
ikillchicken wrote:
agila61 wrote:
Of course, in the ANNcast it is made clear that they do not sign streaming licenses just to stream, but with the intention of at least trying to negotiate a deal that allows them to put a dub in the show.


Okay, but I would have to call bullshit on that. I can believe that they intend to do that for some of these shows but assuming this streaming deal is ongoing, then this would apply to current and future noitaminA shows as well. Sorry but he's a liar if he's claiming that they're seriously considering bringing something like Kuragehime over on DVD with a full dub. There's no way and he knows it. Or what about the live-action one from last season? Or what about whatever noitaminA comes up with next that may be even more odd? As I said initially, my concern is that this will become a recurring problem.

(This isn't just to what's in the quote)
You are combining FUNi's strategy over multiple strategies into one based on his answer to the most current strategy:

Their initial simulcast strategy was to get DVD rights "with*" (or a little after) the streaming. Ex: Corpse princess, Phantom. Also remember it was a while between Phantom streaming and them announcing they had the DVD rights. (*Note: They claimed streaming numbers mattered here.)

Then there was strategy where they waited until they had DVD rights to go simulcast. Ex: Bund and Bakatest

The next strategy was closer to going back to the the "simulcast only, we'll see how that does" strategy. Ex: noitaminA. These are the shows since April where they made it clear at panels that DVD rights actually depended on how the show did. They were also now picking up a few clearly for simulcast shows.

It appears from Lance's response that they have gone back to their middle strategy for the most part.


As for the "live-action one" from last season, I don't see why they wouldn't release it along side the anime when that finally gets released. (Although J-dramas are supposedly extremely hard to license.)
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