Forum - View topicEP. REVIEW: After the Rain
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Blood-
 Bargain Hunter Posts: 23917 |
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Might have even been the first episode. It was pretty early but yeah, that info was conveyed. |
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Emdykay
 Posts: 85 |
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Very first episode? The anime logically gets his relationshipstatus cleared up right away o.O It´s the scene where his son is sitting in the staff room, Akira smashes a dish in disappointment that he is married, the next day she smashes a dish because she is excited when told he is divorced. That my former comment is interpreted as satire is interesting, assuming it was the one mentioned, I was sure making fun of the "17 years and 364 days means no go, 1 day later everytjhing is fair game" attitude, but otherwise I meant it... |
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 23917 |
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@ Emdykay - no, I'm pretty sure that Panino Manino was referring to #Verso.Sciolto's post (i.e. the one that refers to Kondo as "...patient statutory rapist...") as the potential satire. I suppose it might be. I didn't consider that possibility when I first read it, I just took it at face value.
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#Verso.Sciolto
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The fluffy opening number for this anime is indeed among the tools used to disguise the problematic nature of its content. The manager does nothing without the scriptwriter for these scenarios telling him what to think, say and do. The manager is portrayed as feckless for a reason. His seduction of the depressed teen is deliberately shown as almost accidental. Just as her bright sunlight strip was not one of his creation unless you note that Akira's accidental exposure in the stark light of day is scripted too. The manager is shown as though he doesn't mean to do any of those things we see him doing but that is deliberately written and depicted in contrast to the cook so that the audience can be manipulated into deeming the manager "harmless" by comparison. The creators of this series are indeed quite devious in that regard in every aspect of their scripted scenarios - and you’re falling for their manipulation. Statutory rape law holds the adult responsible for good reason. The portrayal of the predator as though the victim echoes the frequently heard excuse from predators -and their advocates- in such situations: “the minor was the one who initiated, your honour”. This is set up and played out in word, deed and visuals throughout this series. The manager had no business taking the teenager on a date to begin with because she is portrayed as the one initiating and thus it has already been made clear for what reason she invites him by the script writers - while every thought the ostensible adult manager is given is an attempt to lower the adult manager’s actual age to an age more approximate the age of the minor in this plot. She lost her ability to run but she can be a substitute mother now. As a substitute for the ambitions she was forced to give up, by accident. From "overdoing it" until her body failed. The manager gets a replacement wife to live out his rejuvenation fantasies. "Wholesome" motives all around. How much more fluffy can you get? Throw in a woolly Alpaca right at the beginning. |
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yuzumei
Posts: 55 |
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Verso.Sciolto wrote:
We are only 4 episodes and you keep talking about rape, Kondo taking advantage of Akira, seduction, replacement wives fantasies! I don't understand how can you reach those points you mention with only 4 episodes. I watched every episode many times and I still cannot get how you got to those conclusions. Why don't you allow the story to progress more before you reach a verdict?
LOL Yes you are right! I have been manipulated by this cartoon show! Maybe because this is my first anime and I always get confused about what is a fictional cartoon and what is real life also I am too young and naive to understand the meaning of rape and may-december relationships and also maybe because I have absolutely no experience with relationships including relationships with girls much younger than me with crushes. Peace |
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CrowLia
 Posts: 5510 Location: Mexico |
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I find myself a bit on the middle of both arguments. I really liked the first episode, but am growing increasingly weary about how they're handling and framing the situation. Episode 4 was the worst in the whole show in my opinion, because it seems like it's trying too hard to showcase the narrative Verso.Sciolto is talking about "look at this extremely Nice Guy(TM), he's definitely not a predator, the girl is throwing herself at him, and honestly look at the younger guy, he's actually an asshole and not good for her, this Nice Guy can definitely treat her like she deserves". I don't agree that he's taking advantage of her vulnerable state because he doesn't know her story with the track club and being injured, but I think the show is going way out of its way to make him overly sympathetic to justify the inevitable relationship.
I'm also concerned about how Kondo is taking the situation. The dialogue that led to them having a date (him saying "try and go on a date with me it'll be boring ") was so contrived I could see right through the script. I'm worried that he seems more concerned about his own feelings -his insecurities, the failings he perceives in his life and nostalgia for his youth- than actually trying to talk to Akira and turn her down in an effective but gentle manner. Given how hard the show hammers us with how he is a Nice Guy, that he couldn't think of a way of rejecting her without going to the date seems hard to believe. He seems more concerned with how they would look as a couple rather the moral implications and the power imbalance of trying to pursue a relationship. I could get behind this show if it showed a more natural process of Kondo flat out rejecting Akira instead of his wishy-washy plot convenient response and then developing feelings for her and struggle against that morality. I'm also worried about how the show is giving Kondo way more interiority than Akira. As the episodes progress, I am left wondering about how Akira feels and what are her specific thoughts, because we never actually hear them. An argument could be made about "show, don't tell", we get enough visual hints about her general feelings, but then the script is very explicit with Kondo's thoughts. About this line from the review:
sounds pretty awful to me. Saying that what Kase did was a consequence of Akira's wish makes it seem like Akira should've expected to get harrassed and blackmailed by a creep for the sin of crushing on an older guy. I'm sure Gabriella didn't mean it like that, but it sure sounds like victim blaming. Another thing I'm confused about:
I'm not sure what Gabriella means with this. It's been years since I read Rashomon, but I don't remember it being particularly focused on "difficult to reconcile different perspectives", that seems closer to the story of Yabu no Naka, the Akutagawa story in which the Kurosawa Rashomon movie is based on. TL;DR I want to believe this show can have a tasteful approach to the topic because it has so far had very strong visual and emotional language, but episode 4 has set off a number of alarm bells that make me concerned this isn't a female romantic fantasy about dating an older guy, but instead a male fantasy about how it's totally okay to date a cute teenager who is 30 years younger than you if she throws herself at you. |
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 23917 |
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Are people out there really that naive? Did anybody who knew the premise of this show going in really believe it was going to be about an older man who, when confronted with the knowledge that a 17-year-old girl was infatuated with him, would gently and appropriately turn her down, the way we all hope it would work if this was real life instead of a work of fiction? Wow, that would have made for a fascinating story, wouldn't it? I can easily see getting 12-episodes out of that.
Honestly, I think anybody who is looking for the kind of story as outlined above should just drop the title. Clearly, your expectations aren't going to be met. |
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CrowLia
Posts: 5510 Location: Mexico |
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Wow, thanks for not reading what I said at all. After watching the opening it was clear this was a show that would have the characters pursue a romantic relationship. I literally said I would like:
My concern is with the fact that Kondo is more worried about how he'll feel ridiculed or rejected by society than by the moral implications of dating an immature child who is closer in age to his own son than to himself. He's not thinking "it's wrong for me to date her because she's too immature" but "I shouldn't date her because I would look bad" |
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Cam0
 Posts: 4896 |
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The show has also been hammering us with how spineless Kondo is. Him being unable to flat out reject Akira is inline with Kondo's character. Particularly with starry-eyed Akira saying "You'll go on a date with me?!" I will say that I agree with how the conversation got to the subject of a date was slightly silly. But Kondo trying to reject Akira in a roundabout way seems to be inline with his character. |
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CrowLia
Posts: 5510 Location: Mexico |
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But his response is not in accordance to that personality "I am in love with you" "Hahaha Try and go on a date with me, you'll see it is awful". It's not a natural response, it's the script forcing the plot forward. I would've thought it more natural for him to stutter and stay in shock or say something like "let's talk about this later" and running away, then maybe have Akira force a date on him, and him being too Nice and much pushover to turn her down.
Last edited by CrowLia on Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:56 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Cam0
Posts: 4896 |
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I feel like it's in accordance to that personality. Kondo reminisces about his youngster days and that causes him to use the "boku" pronoun (I guess that makes sense?). Akira notices it and points it out which embarrasses Kondo and throws him off. He just quickly tries to change the subject and put something together that might stop Akira from pursuing him. The whole "Hahaha Try and go on a date with me, you'll see it is awful" is born out of that awkward situation. It's obviously a plot convenience, but it doesn't seem as unnatural to me as it seems to you.
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Panino Manino
 Posts: 748 |
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Not you, I was talking about other that are making comments that are hard to believe.
I'm glad that you pointed this Crow, I knew that the Rashomon talked in the anime is not the same story from Kurosawa's movie, this is often confused, but I don't remember what the original Rashomon is about. Using you as subject for this question @CrowLia, it's not possible to reconcile with the fact that this is a "love story" about and between Akira and Kondo? And thus, of course that even when he could put an end to this he will not, because the story needs to continue? What's the point in insisting on denouncing him for this behavior then? He is a creation of his creator, that'll manipulate actions to move the story, this love story. Wanting this to end means wanting the series to end. But I guess that's not the biggest problem for some people, the biggest problem is his portrait as "a nice guy". He can't be? He is. For me these accusations that he is a "predator" are absurd. He is a "nice guy", and he ending together with Akira doesn't automatic makes him a "predator". That thing about "power" and "position of authority over her" as his boss, it's actually the one thing he could take advantage to get rid of her, not to get inside her panties instead. Maybe the current climate are clouding people minds and forcing them to view this anime in the worst way possible when it's not that bad actually. An example of this is "his concerns" @CrowLia. Yes, he is concerned with the societal blackslash, yes he is, and it's natural for us viewers to understand this and question his character about this, but, believe me or not, in this story his biggest concern towards Akira is actually her depression for her lost passion. They both share this pain, to not be able to do what they loved and gave meaning to their lives. So instead of taking advantage of her depression to have sex with her Kondo is in reality, no interpretations here, concerned about her depression making her giving up on what she loves to do. Details and realities like this are what makes these accusations of him being a predator absurd. It's a shame that people are taking this nuanced story and characters so black and white, good and evil. |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11454 |
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Ah, thanks. I remember now. You're new here, so you probably don't know I have the memory of a slice of Swiss cheese.  A lot of stuff from first episodes tends to slip right on through my brain-sieve, since I'm not yet invested in any of the characters.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 23917 |
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Oh, I read what you wrote. It's not my fault you phrased it in such a way that left it open to misinterpretation. If you had written it this way there would have been no confusion:
Need I add that the "...before starting a relationship..." that wasn't in your original post at all is a rather important statement? The way you wrote the original comment didn't even offer me an opportunity to infer that you, under certain circumstances, were even open to the idea of thetr being a relationship at all. |
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Terrible90sDub
 Posts: 168 |
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Is it not possible that it's neither? A lot of anime are fantasies for a specific group, but it doesn't have to be. Experimental pieces are more common in manga, and that's what this feels like to me so far: A exploration "what if?" piece. Admittedly, these rarely seem to be made into anime. I do agree that he should've rejected that date, but he also seems to do his best to get away from it. Going on about how bad his eyesight is because he's so old is... definitely an attractive and manipulative thing to do on a date, lol. If he does do something awful later on, I will eat these words, but the sort of ultra-caution in the script I interpreted as being indicative of how they know this is problematic subject matter and are trying to be sure neither of the central characters immediately turn people off. I'm also not convinced the 2nd date is supposed to be seen as that much better than the first. I had that exact same fear at the beginning of the episode when I wasn't sure which direction it would take, but then the dates became mirror images of each other and both come across as awkward, forced, and unfulfilling. Akira is happier about the second one, but Kondo sure didn't seem to be, as he even gets up and leaves around the same moment Akira did during the previous date. I think the second one may look a bit better since the framing usually follows Akira, but ultimately all she got out of it was... another movie poster which she can't distinguish from the other one. (Perhaps also meant to show how, in the end, the dates were almost exactly the same?) They both learned nothing about each other and their relationship didn't grow at all. Kondo does seem self-absorbed and focused on his own issues, but we've seen nothing to indicate he'd act on anything for that reason. I seem to be going in the opposite direction, as I went into this show with caution and expecting to dislike it, but have seen nothing to confirm those fears so far. |
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