Forum - View topicNEWS: Production I.G Finishes New 7-Minute Kill Bill Sequence
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pparker
 Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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The first is surprisingly close on some scenes and probably deserved credit for the story points if Tarantino saw it previous. May not be a huge deal, as I haven't seen the rest of City on Fire, and what we saw was about 10 minutes. Even from those, Reservoir Dogs was significantly different in some scenes. Of course, no one else ever depicted shooting a policeman through the front windshield... The second video on Pulp Fiction just pulls 5 or so random scenes from disparate films and proves nothing. It's the guy being butt-heart because a film festival wouldn't screen his personal attack on a filmmaker (duh). Tarantino said at the time that Pulp Fiction was an homage. I mean, the title... I tried to find Anno's quote about Evangelion being nothing original, just an amalgam of ideas from other works because there wasn't anything really original left to say, but it was taking too long. Yesterday in another thread you mentioned Band of Outsiders. Yes, that famous film from the French New Wave, who credited 40's American film noir as their primary source of inspiration. So, Pulp Fiction wins an Oscar for writing, and Evangelion becomes the most famous anime series in history, and Godard makes history with Breathless and Band of Outsiders. Hmmm... this originality thing must be overblown a bit. Or is the originality actually in the writer/filmmaker's voice and the cleverness with which they construct and present their story? You may have also heard of The 36 Plots. As in, it's all been thought of before. And I pretty much agree with Tarantino having passed his prime after Jackie Brown. I also want to see Slum Dog Millionaire. |
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Animehermit
 Posts: 964 Location: The Argama |
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I like Tarantino a lot, he still has some of the most interesting dialogue in his films. Most films buffs like his movies. I liked kill Bill a lot, both parts.
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pparker
Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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It's not that he is bad. I love his earlier writing much more is all. He did a good job directing RD and PF as well. But I don't see Kill Bill reaching the heights of True Romance, for instance, which is still one of my favorite scripts, and movies, ever. It's also a better movie for Tony Scott having directed it at that time in Tarantino's career, since it is so much bigger than Reservoir Dogs. |
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GATSU
Posts: 15382 |
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pparker:
If you count the fact that the actors are white, and not Asian, and they curse a lot, sure. 
It proves that he lacks originality.
The fest wouldn't screen his film, because it argued that it violated copyrights by using footage from the QT stuff, which is ironic, given that QT clearly shows no love of compensation to the original artists, either.
But that was a genre being credited, not specific films which were being copied and pasted.
That was also mostly Roger Avary's script. Last edited by GATSU on Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Lackshmana
 Posts: 34 Location: Orlando |
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I totally agree with what you are saying here, but Evangelion isn't the most famous anime series in history. It isn't even the most famous anime series in its own genre. |
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mrsatan
 Posts: 912 |
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That would be Megazone 23. |
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dewlwieldthedarpachief
 Posts: 751 Location: Canada |
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@Lackshmana: I don't know how you figure out what the most popular anime series ever is, but asserting whether or not that's the case doesn't really tell us anything. What do you think the most popular show is and why? Though I would say that Eva, while with a large presence, definitely faces some steep competition in that regard.
Remakes/homages deserve far less attention than they seem to be getting. It would make more sense that people should be more interested in what a film does with its content rather than harping on about how unoriginal it is. There have been a lot of inspired remakes/re-imaginings of critically solid source material that have been good contributions to their mediums (Throne of Blood and Ran were Kurosawa films that drew from Shakespeare and have been very well received by critics around the globe). Of course there are epic disappointments too (Godzilla remake, anyone?) but they fail because they are poorly executed (I think in the case of Godzilla a problem on the conceptual level might be that they diverged too far from what made the original what it was in their efforts to appeal to more audiences-maybe.) That said I'd like to add that I do really hate the notion of Hollywood remaking every financially successful (and sometimes also good) property from the East Asian region. I hate it because the interest seems to be more in yanking intellectual gold and repackaging it instead of changing it into something new (and by new I don't mean original in that "wow this has never been done before", I mean "wow this is a good take on that"). I caught Kill Bill on its theatrical run and thoroughly enjoyed it. A large part of that was because I hadn't really seen too much bloody swordplay beforehand and since I've seen quite a lot, so it doesn't send me into an adrenaline trance as much as it did that first time. I do however find it entertaining now for new reasons; I get a few more of the jokes/nods, I still like Tarantino's narrative, the actors and the choreography they're put through still deliver. More than that though, Kill Bill doesn't feel like another Lady Snowblood or Samurai Resurrection or what have you. It's its own movie. |
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Who Is This Guy!?
Posts: 183 |
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You are...retarded, is all I can say. You're just a desperate bitch trying to find random shit to throw against the guy. "Hey look! Sam Jackson's character HAS AN AFRO!!! He's RIPPING OFF SHAFT!!!" Seriously. Piss off. |
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Xanas
Posts: 2058 |
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I agree originality discussions are generally silly, hardly anything isn't influenced after something else. In fact, this is probably one of the major reasons I'm not a pro-copyright guy. We all learn from one another and what is around us. I think that's great, I wish the laws didn't make things like AMVs and fanfiction technically illegal like they are now.
I'm not opposed to rules over wholesale copying and I certainly think credit should be given where it's due, but I don't agree with allowing people to control every aspect of something once it's published. Yes, I think they should be able to trademark a branding and control that, but if someone wants to use a universe or characters in their own story, that shouldn't be a big deal. Disney and others built themselves on adaptations of fantasy stories that were based on concepts from others including names, places, etc. Yet they have no intention of ever giving those rights back for anything they worked on (even if all the people who actually worked on it are long dead). Ok, aside from the short rant there, I think Kill Bill and Kill Bill 2 were great films. They were a lot of fun. They were violent, bloody fun, but fun nevertheless. |
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pparker
Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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I don't care about disagreements. I do care about truth (emphasis mine): He (Roger Avary) had at one point written an 80-page script called "The Open Road", which he described as being about the "odd couple relationship between an uptight business man and an out-of-control hitch-hiker who travel into a Hellish mid-Western town together " and compared to Martin Scorsese's After Hours. After moving on to another screenplay, a spec adaptation of The Silver Surfer, he allowed Tarantino to rewrite his script to add enough length to bring it to a 120-page industry standard length. Tarantino did more than that, turning out a 500-page handwritten behemoth of a screenplay which Avary described as "the Citizen Kane of pop culture." Impressed with Tarantino's work, Avary took on a producer role, and proceeded to work with Tarantino to pare down the script into what would ultimately become True Romance (1993) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Avary Now, if you could explain to me, first of all, how the plot of The Open Road is even close in literary terms to that of True Romance, or how True Romance is a version of After Hours, I would like to hear it. And how 500 pages vs. 80 pages, of already highly reworked script, equates to "mostly Roger Avary's script", then I'm all eyes. Having written screenplays myself, I'm very interested in your answer on percentage of authorship. And if your approach will be to attack my source, then please provide your own more authoritative that in contrast support your position. |
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GATSU
Posts: 15382 |
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pparker: His site said something completely different, which is that he corrected QT's illiterate-filled grammatical mistakes, and often collaborated on material with him to come up with a final product. Also, QT screwed him out of a writing credit on Pulp Fiction.
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pparker
Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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His official site per IMDB is www.avary.com. It requires authentication to enter what could be the core of the site. Pulp Fiction is shown as a link but isn't live. The cafe/forum site has 5 total messages, all by Avary himself, all about the forum itself, dated in Feb, 2008. If you have a link that is accessible where Avary himself is quoted, please include. But perhaps your information is just outdated (again, emphasis mine): But just as Avary and Tarantino had hit the big time, the two had a loud, public falling out, perhaps fueled by their overwhelming success. While many speculated their spat was Tarantino hogging screenplay credit, Avary later confirmed that he was upset that his former partner lifted a speech mocking the homoerotic undertones of “Top Gun” that he wrote and gave it to Eric Stoltz to deliver in “Sleep with Me” (1994). Avary eventually let his anger go, though the two remained on the outs, at least professionally. http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/contributor/1800216554/bio Tarantino's grammar and spelling are the stuff of legend, so no surprise. Avary's collaboration is also universally recognized, and he has an Academy Award and various writing and production credits as evidence. |
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GATSU
Posts: 15382 |
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pparker: The site's been renovated, but there used to be an FAQ specifically about his credit(and lack thereof) working with QT. Plus, the book "Down and Dirty Pictures" covers the rest of QT's hackery. And I'm guessing the Top Gun joke was the final straw, since he's had other grievances against the guy.
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pparker
Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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Okay. It's not important to me what he thinks. Suffice to say, Avary may have changed his mind or message at some point based on what I've found. Nuf said, really. Life continues.... |
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TokyoGetter
 Posts: 416 Location: CA. You can tell by the low moral standards. |
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Now you're just talking bullshit. 
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