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MFrontier
Joined: 13 Apr 2014
Posts: 12935
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Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2024 11:05 pm
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Graphics and animation look very on-point.
I was kind of assuming that it would be like the Raging Blast game where you can switch between forms at will or start out in your preferred form.
I'm assuming you will also be able to use Ultra Instinct for Goku.
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Radrappy
Joined: 11 Jul 2011
Posts: 78
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Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2024 5:55 pm
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KiboEM wrote: |
Megax36 wrote: |
KiboEM wrote: | And what‘s the harm with Season Passes?
Microtransactions and skins (if they are in the game) are optional. No one forces you to buy them. It‘s sad that you base you decision with just this little aspect that hasn‘t even been confirmed. |
LOL, first off, name me a AAA fighter that's been released in the last 10 years, that hasn't contained any of those things?!
So call me old school (I'm on the cusp of 40), but part of the problem with season passes for me, lie in how much they de-value the base game. For instance, lets take Tekken 7 as an example. If I'm a child and my parents bought me the base game for $70 plus tax, and later on we end up with 4 season passes worth of additional content somewhere down the line. First off, there's no guarantee that my parents can afford to pay for additional content, second you have now lowered the value of the base game by requiring me (or my parents) to incur more cost in order to keep my roster on a level playing field with anyone else that I would be playing against online. I mean after all, you couldn't really call it a fair game, if others have access to a larger roster of characters than I do, just because they happen to have enough wealth to keep paying the developer for more content.
I miss the days where if devs had ideas for more content or improvements to a game, they would save it for a sequel! By sticking to this rule, you keep all the players on a level playing field. Using this model, the only impediment to being able to to play the game, is one simply being able to afford the base game, and not requiring you to be able to afford that and who knows how many additional season passes that are released after the fact, like it is today.
I think the 7th gen consoles (360, PS3) utilized the online component in a more reserved/justified manner then current generations do. During the 7th generation, the online component was used to compliment games, with things like bug fix patches, demos, online gameplay with friends or family, or to simply give someone the flexibility to download the game in full if they didn't want to bother to travel to a store to pick up a physical copy. Fast forward to today, and while the online component is still used for those things, it's also used to exploit gamers with endless amounts of paid DLC, in the form of microtransactions, season passes, skins, etc, and a lot of games are only available digitally now instead of serving as a compliment to a physical release. I know there were some games during the 7th gen that did these same things, but they were much fewer in number.
I don't have a problem with free DLC (like GoW Ragnarok, Valhalla), as this offers additional value, and proves that you're not trying to nickel and dime the players who already paid for the game. This is usually the result of content that was already developed for the game, but cut from the final release for some reason. However, I also realize that developing unplanned additional content cost time and thus money, and it's unreasonable to expect devs to work on something and not get paid for it. So in cases where they can't offer the DLC for free, I would prefer they save it for a sequel.
TLDR, in short, I see the industry shifting more towards tactics that benefit the companies, and not the players, and I think one of the best ways to fight something you don't agree with is by using your wallet! |
And as I said, buying additional stuff is optional. Microtransactions are small stuff, which not all the fighting games have. Skins or additional characters don‘t belong in the category of microtransactions.
No one is forcing you or requiring you to buy DLC. It‘s your choice if you want it or not. It doesn‘t devalue the game whatsoever. It‘s the same principle when a sequel was released with 5-10 additional characters. If you are old fashioned, then you would realize that DLC are better in regards to the old fashioned way. Repackaging an old game with additonal characters and then smacking the number „2“ on the title doesn‘t honor the sequel number in my opinion. This way, you can choose (if you want to) what to add additionally to your existing game. It doesn‘t change anything about your fun factor of the game. If you feel obligated to buy DLC, then it‘s a you problem. And also, is it unfair that they release a sequel and you don‘t have enough wealth to buy the next game, while others are playing with the new title? Your comparason makes no sense.
Expecting free updates with additional content is also not entitled. And what if don’t access to internet? Isn’t it unfair for others to enjoy a free update when you can’t download it? Everyone wants profits. They don‘t just create companies or products to please everyone. If they work on DLC, they are entitled to make it purchasable. They put their resources into that additional content. Then it‘s up to you to buy it or not.
It is true that certain companies withhold content to make them purchasable, which is extremely disrecpectful and a scam. I don‘t deny this. But, after finishing the initial game, and starting to create DLC immediately after is acceptable. Since games have to be shipped, they have to finish developing the games, and also have to stick to their deadlines. |
You are so wrong it hurts my teeth. DBFZ is the perfect example of DLC done wrong. The game launched with a roster of 21 characters and 20 additional characters have been added as DLC. To own the entire roster will cost you roughly 60 additional dollars. The main game occasionally goes on sale...but the DLC never does. It's extremely predatory and unacceptable, especially if you want to own the game on multiple platforms (that's 60$ each time, baby). You can claim that those additional 21 characters are optional but the developers intentionally made these fighters extremely powerful. To remain competitive you are going to need some of them on your team.
Is it fair to lock approximately HALF the roster behind these practices? You are foolish if you think this is ordinary and fair to the customer.
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BadNewsBlues
Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 6196
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Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2024 6:16 pm
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Radrappy wrote: | You are so wrong it hurts my teeth. DBFZ is the perfect example of DLC done wrong. The game launched with a roster of 21 characters and 20 additional characters have been added as DLC. To own the entire roster will cost you roughly 60 additional dollars. The main game occasionally goes on sale...but the DLC never does |
Someone better tell the people running the PlayStation & Microsoft Xbox Store that all those sales of FighterZ content over the last few years never happened
Radrappy wrote: | It's extremely predatory and unacceptable, especially if you want to own the game on multiple platforms (that's 60$ each time, baby). |
Unless you sold or somehow lost the original system you had the game on why would you buy the game on multiple platforms and then complain about having to rebuy the DLC?
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Radrappy
Joined: 11 Jul 2011
Posts: 78
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Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2024 7:34 pm
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BadNewsBlues wrote: |
Radrappy wrote: | You are so wrong it hurts my teeth. DBFZ is the perfect example of DLC done wrong. The game launched with a roster of 21 characters and 20 additional characters have been added as DLC. To own the entire roster will cost you roughly 60 additional dollars. The main game occasionally goes on sale...but the DLC never does |
Someone better tell the people running the PlayStation & Microsoft Xbox Store that all those sales of FighterZ content over the last few years never happened
Radrappy wrote: | It's extremely predatory and unacceptable, especially if you want to own the game on multiple platforms (that's 60$ each time, baby). |
Unless you sold or somehow lost the original system you had the game on why would you buy the game on multiple platforms and then complain about having to rebuy the DLC? |
I have been constantly checking to see if the DLC was ever on sale and it...never was to my knowledge? It might have been discounted and I missed the window. The base game is often on sale, I'm aware of that - but for the past year at least, the DLC has remained at 20$ per pack (each pack is 6 ish characters)
Also for your second question - I had the game on PS4 and wanted to get it for Xbox Series S when I bought a next gen system. I also wanted to get it on Switch to practice the game portably. So uh, there are many instances why one would want to buy it on different hardware.
ALSO - because the DLC is so profitable there will in all likelihood never be a Super/Ultimate DBFZ that includes the 20 dlc characters. The whole thing stinks.
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Megax36
Joined: 20 Nov 2018
Posts: 40
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2024 12:21 am
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KiboEM wrote: |
No one is forcing you or requiring you to buy DLC. It‘s your choice if you want it or not. It doesn‘t devalue the game whatsoever. It‘s the same principle when a sequel was released with 5-10 additional characters. If you are old fashioned, then you would realize that DLC are better in regards to the old fashioned way. Repackaging an old game with additonal characters and then smacking the number „2“ on the title doesn‘t honor the sequel number in my opinion. This way, you can choose (if you want to) what to add additionally to your existing game. It doesn‘t change anything about your fun factor of the game. If you feel obligated to buy DLC, then it‘s a you problem. And also, is it unfair that they release a sequel and you don‘t have enough wealth to buy the next game, while others are playing with the new title? Your comparason makes no sense. |
I'm glad you responded the way that you did, because your response serves as the perfect testament to what I was saying!
Let's take the scenario where both you and I buy DBFZ, and we both have access to the same roster of characters, and you choose UI Goku and I choose base Goku. In this scenario we have a "level playing field", because I made the conscious decision to chose the weaker form of Goku because I'm either confident in my level of skill or just wanted the additional challenge. However, lets look at a second scenario, where UI Goku is paid DLC. Lets say that this time around, the reason I pick base Goku is because I can't afford to buy UI Goku! The developers have now created segmentation amongst the game's players, based on either wealth or the willingness to fork over cash for more content. You and I both bought the same game, but you are being afforded a "unique" experience (advantage) in that SAME game, because of your wealth or willingness to splurge cash. My desire or lack thereof to purchase UI Goku is irrelevant, the fact of the matter is that your roster does not resemble mine.
Now let's look at a completely different case. Let's say you purchase Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3, and I just purchase Marvel vs Capcom 3, because it's cheaper. In this example, the segmentation is done at the game level, and not IN THE GAME. In other words, anyone who I play against online, will also be playing the original Marvel vs Capcom 3, and thus have access to the same roster as me. The same would be true for you, in that everyone you play against online will have UMvC3, and have access to the same roster that you do. At no point in this example, will either of us be playing against someone with a different roster other than the same one that we have access to! This sustains the concept of a "level playing field" amongst players. The fact that I can't afford UMvC3 is irrelevant, because I can still be guaranteed a level playing field in the game that I could afford to purchase.
In regards to your other comment regarding sequels, you are correct that simply adding a few new characters to an existing game, while maintaining the same levels, music, story, and gameplay, are nothing more than cheap cash grabs. The Street Fighter II series comes to mind in this regard, although I'll cut Capcom some slack since the technology used in the arcades was changing rapidly at that time, which was why half the series was on CPS1 and the other half on CPS2.
However, if we compare Sonic the Hedgehog to Sonic 2 or Street Fighter Alpha 2 to SFA3, in both cases the sequels differ on several points from their predecessors, so much so that there's no way that anyone who actually played the games could confuse them for being the same. Sega originally wanted to put super Sonic in the original game, but this content was cut due to time constraints, and instead we wouldn't be introduced to this till Sonic 2. However, Sonic 2 didn't only introduce a new form for Sonic, it also introduced us to another character in the form of Tails, it refined it's gameplay and level design to focus on what made the first game fun... SPEED! In the case of Street Fighter, SFA3 had new characters, new music, new stages, completely different gameplay mechanics, and a story that actually progressed, in order to differentiate it from SFA2 . These are perfect examples of sequels done right, by devs taking what they've learned from their previous outing, and using it to improve and fuel new ideas for their next one, as opposed to just dumping whatever ideas they can conjure onto gamers in the from of paid DLC.
It's become far too common for companies to knowingly release games in an unfinished state (aka Cyber Punk 2077) so that they can either (A) charge gamers to access the rest of the game as originally envisioned, or (B) use gamers as free Q&A testers to discover bugs and game breaking glitches for them to patch later on. Why do they knowingly do this you might ask... because of corporate greed! They're more concerned with getting a return on their investment ASAP, even if it comes at the expense of giving the player a subpar experience. This is not the way the industry worked in the past, nor should it operate now. More companies need to take queues from Nintendo in regards to prioritizing the quality and experience that a game offers more than its content.
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BadNewsBlues
Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 6196
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2024 8:45 am
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Radrappy wrote: | I have been constantly checking to see if the DLC was ever on sale and it...never was to my knowledge? It might have been discounted and I missed the window. The base game is often on sale, I'm aware of that - but for the past year at least, the DLC has remained at 20$ per pack (each pack is 6 ish characters) |
I’ll admit I can’t recall when was the last time the passes have gone on sale but I do know the individual character DLC was on sale on one of the two fronts as recently as a few weeks ago. Anyone’s best bet for buying this stuff would be to wait for sales that focus on a specific theme like a major holiday, add ons, or Japan/anime.
I’d almost guarantee that stuff goes on sale sometime within the next 3 months especially during golden week.
Radrappy wrote: | I also wanted to get it on Switch to practice the game portably. |
How did that go?
Megax36 wrote: | Why do they knowingly do this you might ask... because of corporate greed! |
Sometimes corporate greed other times corners knowingly and intentionally being cut that isn’t always to blame on the publisher or them wanting to ship the game out for the holidays or whatever.
Megax36 wrote: | They're more concerned with getting a return on their investment ASAP, even if it comes at the expense of giving the player a subpar experience. This is not the way the industry worked in the past, |
?
This is exactly how the industry worked in the past many of the video game companies that were putting out games in the 80’s and 90’s which were considered the golden era of games. Were rushing games to the market in various states of incomplete. And like I said the only difference between now and then is that stuff can be fixed post launch.
You got a video game back in the day that had a glitch or designed as intended aspect that can render the game unable to be finished? SOL
Mechanic in the game not functioning as intended? SOL
Through no fault of your own something caused your game save to be corrupted or deleted? SOL
Even if you want to argue that this stuff is too common by today’s standards it’s definitely not new.
Megax36 wrote: | More companies need to take queues from Nintendo in regards to prioritizing the quality and experience that a game offers more than its content. |
The same Nintendo whose last four published Pokémon games each had quality issues which were comically enough the same issue?
Once put out Skyward Sword and Link’s Adventure two of the most divisive entries in the Zelda series which were treated of such because of the “experiences” they offered.
Or how about Super Mario Bros.2 which they found so hard and unfair despite them developing it. They took a whole different game “filed off the serial numbers” and released that instead in other parts of the world. It also didn’t help that the game was essentially the same exact game as the preceding Super Mario Bros game.
I like Nintendo to a point but they’re most definitely not the company that any other video game company should look at when it comes to publishing or developing video games as of course they have their fair share of problems.
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