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INTEREST: Translator Resigns From Cipher Academy Manga, Citing Translation Difficulty


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mdo7



Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 6360
Location: Katy, Texas, USA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 6:17 pm Reply with quote
Reading the ANN article and the Screenrant article supplement that came with it, I can understand the difficulty from what I'm reading regarding complex translations that goes beyond just simple translation, Japanese language is not an easy language to translate (well, the same can be said about Chinese given the many dialect the Chinese language has).

I can imagine the opposite could be true when something complex in the English language get translated into Japanese and I wouldn't be surprised a Japanese translator facing this type of same complex difficulty like our Cipher Academy translator has to go through. I wonder how common this translation difficulty happened when it comes to manga and light novel (that includes anime and video game from Japan)? That also makes me wonder, how many of our stuff that get Japanese translation face this same type of situation when it come to complex wordplay get localized for the Japanese market?

I mean I'll cite this from Screen Rant:

Quote:
However, given how difficult these are to create without the added restrictions of matching the meaning and tone of the original Japanese, the English translation chooses to just transliterate the Japanese lipograms and provide a tonally accurate translation alongside them.

However, the lipograms in Cipher Academy are basically impossible to translate perfectly. They are a good reminder that no matter how good a translation is, it will never be able to completely convey all the nuances of the original Japanese. And this is especially true for Cipher Academy, which relies directly on Japanese words and characters to construct its puzzles. Even the simpler puzzles and footnotes in the manga often rely on or discuss the nitty-gritty details of the Japanese language and alphabet.


I mean if this can happen for translating the manga, then I have to assume the opposite might be the same thing when our stuff get translated from English to Japanese. Try imagining a US comic book or a English novel getting a Japanese translation and they used a complex wordplay in English similar to like the lipograms in Cipher Academy and the Japanese translator who translate English to Japanese have difficulties translating that complex English wordplay into Japanese for the translation, and yeah you have that same situation that English to Japanese translators faced like Kumar SIVASUBRAMANIAN have to endure.

So I understand the whole situation, and translation is not an easy thing to do. It goes both way no matter if the language is English or Japanese.
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Roger Pepitone



Joined: 27 Apr 2016
Posts: 26
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:22 pm Reply with quote
Reminds me of Never 7 (palindromes became portmanteu words) and I/O (the crossword puzzle).
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ExplodingPrinny



Joined: 15 Nov 2022
Posts: 45
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:23 pm Reply with quote
I get it. I struggle to read the series and have no hope of participating in any of the puzzles.

But I am impressed by the level of writing by the author, even in the form we see. Creating this series must be brutal.

Might be better to translate volume-by-volume instead. Give them more time to figure out how to handle it.
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harminia



Joined: 24 Aug 2015
Posts: 2032
Location: australia
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:30 pm Reply with quote
Damn. Not surprised as this seemed like a beast to translate in general. Good luck to the next translator...
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aereus



Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 576
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:37 pm Reply with quote
kgw wrote:
Sometimes the problem is "the day is not long enough for this". I do not know how the translation process is for Manga Plus, but I am guessing the translators are not given a whole week to process the chapters. There is a limit for miracles, specially when you have other works to do.


That's my take as well. It's not that it isn't possible, but if this is a weekly, doing it within a week is probably a tremendous amount of effort AND I bet Shueisha wants to pay him the same amount as any other title despite it being several times more work-hours to do properly. It sounds like this title really demands two translators working together to bounce ideas off of to finish it in time.
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moozooh



Joined: 30 Sep 2022
Posts: 151
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 8:41 am Reply with quote
Having your name on a title like this would be a star of any translator's portfolio, but considering the unreasonable time constraints and what most likely is a severe underpay for this level of difficulty, I can very well understand Kumar's decision.
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Shay Guy



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2242
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 12:52 pm Reply with quote
mdo7 wrote:
I can imagine the opposite could be true when something complex in the English language get translated into Japanese and I wouldn't be surprised a Japanese translator facing this type of same complex difficulty like our Cipher Academy translator has to go through. I wonder how common this translation difficulty happened when it comes to manga and light novel (that includes anime and video game from Japan)? That also makes me wonder, how many of our stuff that get Japanese translation face this same type of situation when it come to complex wordplay get localized for the Japanese market?


Honestly, I'm still surprised that Deltora Quest was as popular in Japan back in the day as it was.
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mtza



Joined: 12 Feb 2021
Posts: 8
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 1:20 pm Reply with quote
This series has gotta be hell on earth to translate; don't blame the guy at all. The lipogram "battle" was essentially the translation equivalent of an SOS, and that came on the heels of kana ciphers and kanji ciphers and essentially everything in between.I remember seeing the self-introduction crossword being left untranslated (Ch. 11, p. 4, bottom-right panel) and getting the feeling that the translators probably literally didn't have enough hours in the day. And it's not just the ciphers—the entire thing's chock-full of puns and wordplay even without it.
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luisedgarf



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Posts: 664
Location: Guadalajara, Mexico
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 6:08 pm Reply with quote
Shay Guy wrote:
mdo7 wrote:
I can imagine the opposite could be true when something complex in the English language get translated into Japanese and I wouldn't be surprised a Japanese translator facing this type of same complex difficulty like our Cipher Academy translator has to go through. I wonder how common this translation difficulty happened when it comes to manga and light novel (that includes anime and video game from Japan)? That also makes me wonder, how many of our stuff that get Japanese translation face this same type of situation when it come to complex wordplay get localized for the Japanese market?


Honestly, I'm still surprised that Deltora Quest was as popular in Japan back in the day as it was.


Technically speaking, translating from English to Japanese isn't too different than translating from viceversa, except when translating idioms or stuff not implied in English but have to be stated in Japanese, like the age of the characters or their social or familiar standing. This goes more complex when twins or multiple children are involved, since one should be the elder slibing and the rest the younger ones, something that English and other western languages rarely care at all.
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