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How do you feel about internet slang and memes inserted into anime dialogue?


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AmpersandsUnited



Joined: 22 Mar 2012
Posts: 633
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 7:27 am Reply with quote
Cam0 wrote:
They sometimes use translator notes but it's typically for things that can be explained in one short sentence. Those fansubs sometimes had like massive text boxes explaining various stuff in detail. They explained stuff like honorifics which is not something that a modern official translation would ever do today. There was an anime from some years ago, When Supernatural Battles Became Commonplace, the crunchyroll subs just left the word "chuuni" in there untranslated and unexplained. It's not like it's a term that could easily be translated or explained, but I'm certain that specific era of fansubs would have just brute-forced it and put a massive text box to explain the term taking 3rd of the screen in the process.


Oh, you mean stuff like this? Yeah, official translations don't do that much. I was thinking more of the notes like a character making a pun between kani and kami and a note saying kani means crab while kami means God. I don't really have much preference for or against definition boxes or cultural notes so long as the essential stuff like wordplay are covered.
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Alan45
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Joined: 25 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 7:57 am Reply with quote
@killjoy_the

Actually, hearing one thing and seeing something different is one of the things I find mildly irritating. I realize that it is because I'm aware of the difference and that there are other things I would notice if I knew Japanese. Thing is, that there are portions of US culture where last names and titles are used extensively (the military, some private schools). It is not that difficult a concept to understand. If I read a story set in an English boarding school, I don't expect the publisher to provide an Americanized version that uses given names and not surnames, why should it be different for translated anime.

Fiction set in Europe or South America, including that translated from the original, frequently include the honorifics from the native language. Why should it be different for fiction coming from Japan?

@Cam0

Love, Chunibyo & Other Delusions came out before When Supernatural Battles Became Commonplace. When the former ran, it was almost impossible to be anywhere in anime fandom without seeing chuni explained over and over. Leaving it untranslated when the latter show came out makes sense. I don't think I ever saw an attempt to translate that explained the concept well. There is an awful lot packed into that short word.
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Cam0



Joined: 13 Dec 2009
Posts: 4916
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 8:33 am Reply with quote
Alan45 wrote:
Love, Chunibyo & Other Delusions came out before When Supernatural Battles Became Commonplace. When the former ran, it was almost impossible to be anywhere in anime fandom without seeing chuni explained over and over. Leaving it untranslated when the latter show came out makes sense. I don't think I ever saw an attempt to translate that explained the concept well. There is an awful lot packed into that short word.


I managed to be an avid anime fan that hadn't yet seen Love, Chunibyo & Other Delusions when When Supernatural Battles Became Commonplace aired and didn't know the definition of that term so my reaction indeed was "What the heck is a chuuni?!".

I dunno what the correct course of action for a term like that should be. In this specific case, it's also kind of a "meta" thing. But I am saying that an unprofessional-looking, annoying massive text box would have actually helped me in that specific case.
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EmbraceMe



Joined: 17 Dec 2010
Posts: 2017
Location: Growing old and jaded.
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 12:01 pm Reply with quote
Alan45 wrote:

I don't think I ever saw an attempt to translate that explained the concept well. There is an awful lot packed into that short word.


The places I lurked around threw around "Peter Pan Syndrome" as the closest equivalent to that term but I don't think it ever stuck. Maybe it missed context that chuunibyou has since there's different levels of meanings in kanji/hanzi. For example, the word "相手" (aite) can mean either opponent or partner but the true context of the word is someone opposite (i.e. in front) of you.

As for Nagatoro, I think we should remember she's a gyaru-type girl which have their own slang and that culture is constantly changing. With how gyaru speak tends to abbreviate, rearrange, or add cutesy sounds to their words, I'm mixed on how the whole "sus" thing is handled. I was only familiar with the word due to the game Among Us so I saw it as a meme-y translation. On the other hand, taking the gyaru context makes the translation seem appropriate but my Japanese isn't good enough to tell.
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Alan45
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Joined: 25 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 1:03 pm Reply with quote
@Cam0

A good explanation of chuuni takes a couple of paragraphs to explain what they are (I still haven't seen a good explanation as to why). So it would not be feasible in an anime. As best I can tell there is no corresponding concept in English that is even remotely similar. I expect the translator and the people who approved the translation simply gave up. All I can say to this is Google is your friend.

@EmbraceMe

According to Google: Peter Pan Syndrome is a pop-psychology term used to describe an adult who is socially immature. That would not be a good fit at all for the concept.
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DavetheUsher



Joined: 19 May 2014
Posts: 505
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 2:48 pm Reply with quote
The closest word to chuuni I can think of is larper.
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Zalis116
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Joined: 31 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:02 pm Reply with quote
killjoy_the wrote:
I do however sympathize quite a bit with the "foreigners who only know basic English' part. English is, for all intents and purposes, the international language, and though services like Funi and Crunchy provide subs for other regions with their languages, I believe there's a vast amount of people from those regions consuming the content in English (for various reasons). This would make more "Americanized" (for lack of a better term) translations - think translating meters to feet or yards - generally feel confusing and unnecessary. But at the same time I'm sure a good amount of their intended audience - assuming Americans in this case - wouldn't really get it all that much if you didn't translate those things to terms Americans understand


I agree that things like yen and metric measurements shouldn't be localized, mainly because the USD/JPY exchange rate fluctuates over time, and we Americans need to get with the program on the metric units used by the rest of the world. But I don't want to see subtitles scrubbed of any interesting (and situationally-appropriate) English/American slang and idioms, or watered down into basic/generic translations devoid of any flavor and color. If the rest of the world (outside of China and South Korea, apparently) is going to demand that US companies serve them instead of supporting homegrown local-language alternatives, they should be willing to accept that the English subtitles created by US companies are likely going to favor US anime viewers. And if viewers in other regions are choosing English subtitles on CR/Funi over available subtitles in their own languages, that's fully on them.

To be sure, slang and memes should be used judiciously and appropriately, though I don't blame whoever put "social distancing" in the Kaguya-sama subs for being influenced by the spirit of the times. But I've seen considerably more liberal rewrites and alterations from unofficial translations than from official ones. It wasn't Funimation who put "Fox, get this guy off me!" into Yamada's First Time, or ::pogchamp:: Twitch emotes into Dagashi Kashi, after all.
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Rentwo



Joined: 05 Oct 2019
Posts: 184
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 7:45 pm Reply with quote
Alan45 wrote:
A good explanation of chuuni takes a couple of paragraphs to explain what they are (I still haven't seen a good explanation as to why). So it would not be feasible in an anime. As best I can tell there is no corresponding concept in English that is even remotely similar. I expect the translator and the people who approved the translation simply gave up. All I can say to this is Google is your friend.


A note talking about it might be nice for newcomers, but it's also one of those words that the more Japanese media you consume the more you'll see it and learn about it so some translations might feel it's not worth pointing out or clarifying. It's hard to really say if they should keep doing it for everything or phase it out as time goes on and anime and Japanese knowledge becomes more mainstream and widespread. In the early 2000s when words were newer to American fans it made sense to do it. But these days I guess there's an argument to be made that those words are such common knowledge and easily looked up on Google or will be commonly heard in anime communities that there's not much need anymore. We even see them in English titles now like "Love Chunibyo & Other Delusions" and "Rascal Does Not Dream of Bunny Girl Senpai" which cements their place in the fandom.

Zalis116 wrote:
To be sure, slang and memes should be used judiciously and appropriately, though I don't blame whoever put "social distancing" in the Kaguya-sama subs for being influenced by the spirit of the times. But I've seen considerably more liberal rewrites and alterations from unofficial translations than from official ones. It wasn't Funimation who put "Fox, get this guy off me!" into Yamada's First Time, or ::pogchamp:: Twitch emotes into Dagashi Kashi, after all..


They did revise the "social distancing" translation in Kaguya and removed it when fans voiced their displeasure, so at least they acknowledged their mistake. Although using joke subs to try to discredit fan translations seems akin to using dub outtakes to discredit official translations.
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Chocobos



Joined: 17 May 2021
Posts: 21
PostPosted: Mon Aug 09, 2021 11:02 pm Reply with quote
I think community slang is interesting in a world where everyone is the same
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