Forum - View topicINTEREST: hololive Virtual YouTubers Akai Haato, Kiryu Coco Suspended For 3 Weeks Due to 'Inappropri
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Sakura Shinguji
Posts: 194 |
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Imagine being as pathetically sensitive about everything as China is.
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Hoppy800
 Posts: 3331 |
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Streaming on Billibilli was a mistake, it's where all of the mindless CCP drones lurk. Cover needs to get the hell out of China, I know that 6 talents will have to graduate, but it's too dangerous to be dealing with CCP and especially the mindless drones on Billibilli lurking around, they seem to be out for blood, just because Taiwan is mentioned and nothing else, sad isn't it.
Also, Taiwan is a sovereign country, it does not belong to China, these drones need to get over it, they'll feel better in the morning. |
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jirg1901
Posts: 150 |
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It's much more complicated than that. The area itself hasn't solidly decided whether to represent itself as the rightful China with the PRC as a rogue state, or the independent nation of Taiwan, and in international relations it tends to stick to the status quo of the former (which is oddly enough the PRC's preference because it gives them grounds to unite the two without having to outright annex a foreign country). That obviously makes it hard for most countries to recognize it as a sovereign nation rather than a de facto territorial government even if they want to, because they clearly do not control the territory they claim. If you put aside the more complex sovereignty issues Taiwan is a bit like Greenland or Puerto Rico as a geographically distinct colony region, and while in the west we use all those location names for convenience, the PRC (and political groups in the ROC as well) take particular umbrage of the region name being used in contexts that might lead someone to believe it's the name of a country so you have the politically correct terminology "Chinese Taipei" that implies some sort of direct connection with the mainland. In the end though, saying you're taking a trip to Taiwan or that you have viewers in Taiwan is geographically correct and doesn't have inherent political context so getting up in arms about any instance of it is pretty paranoid. |
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BadNewsBlues
Posts: 6233 |
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Kinda loops back on itself with the way Israel treats Palestine and how it regards any criticism towards said actions. |
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Kougeru
 Posts: 5562 |
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Youtube has nothing to do with this. The girls work for a company and the company is what is suspending them, not YouTube. And no, it's not as simple as that. A LOT of money they make it from archived videos. And hololive was largely made by popular in the US by YouTube recommendations. And most major companies actually take China's side on this, including the US. So one VERY important bit that people keep leaving out is that it WAS NOT against the rules to read statistics. The talents have been doing that for years with no issue. It only suddenly became a "Violation of rules" when people from China complained that Taiwan was mentioned. Cover literally made up a new rule to punish them for saying Taiwan. That's it. |
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Rob19ny
Posts: 1937 |
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Well, that sucks, but on the other side... those designs got amazingly designed oppai so I benefited from this news.
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surgemaster140
Posts: 2 |
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I'd love for them to get out of China and give the CCP the finger, but I'm not sure if all the talents feel the same way. Fubuki, Aqua, Suisei, and some others have a huge fanbase over there and their current popularity can be partially attributed to streaming on Bilibili in the early days. As much as I hate seeing Cover bowing down to China's authoritarian nonsense, I would hate seeing the potential career suicide of these members even more including the HoloCN branch. Right now they need to keep walking on eggshells until they can come up with some exit strategy that won't end with the 50 cent army coming after all of them, which I don't know if it is possible. |
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zrnzle500
 Posts: 3768 |
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I’m no fan of the Chinese government and I think if the people of Taiwan decide they want to be independent, China ought to recognize they don’t control them, but I’m not sure defiantly thumbing their nose at the world’s second largest economy would be the better decision. The talent of their Chinese branch (and likely their support staff) would lose their livelihoods, the many of the rest would lose a significant chunk of their income, and fans in China would no longer be able to follow their favorite members, at least as readily. All of that for what? Defiantly making a political statement that many in the affected area don’t even want or necessarily even agree with, and which will do nothing to change the status quo, which most countries tacitly agree to? It would be one thing if it were a big corporation just forgoing some profits, but we’re talking about actual people losing their livelihoods. I don’t know that I would say that I like the decision per se, but it seems like the one that best protects their employees, and I’d prefer that over some quixotic defiance. I personally put more responsibility on China and the international community for the situation, who actually have the power to change the status quo, rather than a single company that China wouldn’t care about if they decided to take their ball and go home.
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Badej
Posts: 19 |
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Bad argument, back when the Netherlands revolted against Spain in 1568 the later didn't recognise the Netherlands as a country until the peace treaty of Münster 80 years later. All throughout history you can find similar examples where one party doesn't recognise the other. Does this mean we should suddenly care about the views of one of the parties? Especially when said party doesn't care about human rights and borders (hello Tibet among other things)? Hell no. For all intends and purposes Taiwan is an independent nation. |
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DRosencraft
Posts: 671 |
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So, believe it or not, there are rules to being recognized as an independent nation. That recognition brings with it certain advantages and disadvantages, not least of all dealing with access to foreign markets (everything from trade to financial help through the World Bank and recognition/assistance in potential military disputes (say, invasion by a foreign nation). There is actual international case law on the subject, and national laws, including the U.S., often operate in reference to this. As much as public opinion may be against China and its treatment of Taiwan as well as its own people, a company doing business there can't hope to merely thumb its nose at China anyway and still survive. An individual as a dissident, in this circumstance, has more power than a company as a dissident, unless it can pull along A LOT of other companies too, and Cover doesn't appear to have that kind of clout.
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faboo95
 Posts: 94 |
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Absolutely this. I understand that Cover Corp probably had to act fast and harshly in order to ease tensions and to protect their Chinese talents, but maintaining this relationship in the long run just isn't safe for all of their talents. |
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kotomikun
Posts: 1205 |
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Looking at it on a micro-level, that makes sense, but more broadly... well, this is one of the many problems with globalized capitalism--authoritarian nonsense from other countries can bleed into yours. They weren't even making a political statement, by the standards of anyone other than the Chinese government; they were, apparently, just reading their Youtube analytics on-stream and Taiwan happened to be listed in there. This is like getting banned from Twitch for mentioning the "Florida Man" Twitter account because it offends the state's governor. Yes, most other countries also don't officially recognize Taiwan, for the same reason--they're afraid of making the CCP freak out and sabotage their trade relationship in retaliation. As is currently happening to the US. Everyone, including China, knows perfectly well that Taiwan is its own country, but we all have to pretend it isn't to avoid hurting a dictator's feelings. It's just sad, honestly. And it makes me worry just how far this type of cultural influence can go. |
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Suxinn
 Posts: 249 |
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Uh, your data is about a few decades outdated lmao. While the KMT originally claimed (like... back in the '60s and '70s) to be the rightful nation of China (specifically, the Republic of China), most of them are a bit more... pragmatic now. In that they tacitly accept Taiwan as an independent nation, but they're also committed to maintaining the status quo on the world stage so as not to start a war with the Mainland. Anyone who still claims that Taiwan is the "true China" are the kind of radicals that get laughed off the Taiwanese political stage nowadays. In general, most of Taiwan have been shifting more left in recent years, and if you just look at who's in power now (the DPP, who have always been firmly Taiwanese independence), you'll see that the majority of Taiwan is fully on-board with finally getting their independence acknowledged -- if only other major countries will lend a hand. Anyway, I still find it absolutely bizarre that the CCP is so determined to hold onto Taiwan. Like... we don't share government infrastructure, currency, or even the same writing system nowadays... Even our electronic standards are different! How they think we'll eventually "come back into the fold" is anyone's guess... It's kind of like if England still kept claiming the United States belonged to them decades after the American Revolution... Who does that. |
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Hellsoldier
 Posts: 805 Location: Porto,Portugal,Europe,Earth,Sol |
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Just came by to say that Taiwan is either an Independent Country, or the Better China... Kinda like South Korea is the Better Korea.
Cultural and Economic Exchange is good, but, it is high-time people put limits over how much influence a world power -any world power- can have over your country. Japan has a strong (if debilitated) economy. Neither Japan nor the corporations within Japan need to cave to such tantrums. |
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jirg1901
Posts: 150 |
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I know the political balance has shifted towards independence, but there's no binding commitment to that direction still. Even if that's because of the influence of the PRC, you can't really expect other nations with relations with the PRC to just unilaterally decide that on their own if the government in question is still deciding to go along with the charade. Obviously reconquering mainland China is some "south will rise again" fringe craziness at this point, but there's still the lingering split between Taiwan being another China or uniquely Taiwanese, which obviously leans further away from the former the longer you get away from the mainland exodus.
I really don't care with Japanese entertainment companies trying to go after a Chinese market with a product they know does not reliably adhere to the restrictive values of their government and society. Even the Chinese companies are censoring their Japanese styled products in their home market. Even putting aside the moral issues it's overly opportunistic. |
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