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Vaisaga
Joined: 07 Oct 2011
Posts: 13243
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 3:19 pm
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Who did they think they were fooling calling it a "Best Friend ceremony"? Might as well call it what it is.
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spark67
Joined: 15 Dec 2014
Posts: 36
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 3:45 pm
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I´ve always played as a boy, but maybe this time i woulf play as a girl to have a lesbian wedding with Marie.
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FireChick
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Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Posts: 2517
Location: United States
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 4:20 pm
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I welcome this new feature. I'm not gay myself, but I know a lot of people wanted to see Harvest Moon delve into same-sex marriage, even if the act is under a different name due to Japan "not wanting to rock the boat" or some crap like that. That's one of the reasons why the indie game Stardew Valley became so popular, because it wasn't afraid to do things the games that inspired it tended to avoid.
Oh, and before anyone thinks of trying to accuse XSEED of "pushing an agenda" or stupid stuff like that, don't. Japan has always had a problem with accepting LGBT people in any fashion, and even when actively showing stuff like that, they still have reservations about explicit confirmation of characters being on the spectrum due to their overly conformist values. The only reason its called the Best Friends system in the Japanese version is because they don't want to cause controversy by calling it what it really is, gay marriage. Since America is much more accepting of these things now, calling gay marriage what it actually is in the game is making explicit what the game makes implicit in all but name.
Last edited by FireChick on Mon May 04, 2020 6:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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El Hermano
Joined: 24 Feb 2019
Posts: 450
Location: Texas
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 5:20 pm
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FireChick wrote: | That's one of the reasons why the indie game Stardew Valley became so popular, because it had that as a feature. |
Saying a game is popular because of gay marriage is no different than when people say a game failed because it had gays in it. Most people don't care and trying to attribute that element as a key part of it's success or failure is unfounded. Stardew Valley was successful for same reason a lot of western copycat games catch on: they're on PC rather than console exclusives like all the Harvest Moon, Rune Factory, and similar games have been, which opens them up to a much wider western audience, especially people who don't normally play games but may have a PC.
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FireChick
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Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Posts: 2517
Location: United States
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 6:13 pm
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I probably should have phrased that better. Sorry. Then again, I've never been good at this kinda stuff.
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Banshou
Joined: 20 Jan 2005
Posts: 27
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 9:54 pm
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Although I have no problem with the concept, on principle I prefer my localizations as unaltered as possible.
FireChick wrote: | The only reason its called the Best Friends system in the Japanese version is because they don't want to cause controversy by calling it what it really is, gay marriage. |
If this is the case, I'd really like XSEED to confirm it.
As much as I'd like to believe that this is what the original developers had wanted from the beginning, right now it looks like something the localization team thought up.
Could it be possible that Marvelous wouldn't want it on record that they had wanted this?
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DavetheUsher
Joined: 19 May 2014
Posts: 505
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 11:09 pm
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Banshou wrote: | As much as I'd like to believe that this is what the original developers had wanted from the beginning, right now it looks like something the localization team thought up. |
My general rule is if something was really what the original creator intended, they wouldn't need a foreign localization team to change anything. It always comes off like damage control to me to justify changing things in localization. I see this more like XSEED trying to avoid another Tomodachi Life outrage where certain gaming outlets raised a stink because there was no option for same-sex marriage in that game, so if they can change the dialog and alter some art assets to avoid all that then they will. XSEED did something like this with Akiba's Trip as well to try to head off the accusations of sexism toward the American version of that game. I suppose we'll see how far they'll take it and if they also censor out the gender select option like the American localization did with Animal Crossing: New Horizons since even that seems like a touchy subject these days.
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Calico
Joined: 05 Jan 2013
Posts: 383
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2020 1:41 am
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For the homophobic dumbasses claiming that Xseed is pushing a "gay agenda" against the will of the original producers or whatever: Xseed has literally said that the producers have supported them in just calling it for what it is: gay marriage. In the Japanese version of the game, it is literally marriage in all but name. You move in together, sleep on the same bed, raise a child together, and the romantic dialogue is the same if you marry a character with either gender. I'm pretty sure that the only reason that it isn't called marriage in the Japanese release was to avoid the rating going up.
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jellybeanbandit
Joined: 18 Jun 2019
Posts: 107
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2020 4:27 pm
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Calico wrote: | For the homophobic dumbasses claiming that Xseed is pushing a "gay agenda" against the will of the original producers or whatever: Xseed has literally said that the producers have supported them in just calling it for what it is: gay marriage. |
So does that mean Naoko Takeuchi supported DiC's decision to change Haruka and Michiru into cousins? What about when China or Russia removes a gay kiss from a movie? Just curious if this is a two way street here and we should acknowledges those changes are the true canon since localization can't do anything without the explicit consent of the original creative side, as all defenders of localization changes love to bring out as a defense. You can like this change if you want, but a change is a change.
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ATastySub
Past ANN Contributor
Joined: 19 Jan 2012
Posts: 708
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2020 6:04 pm
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jellybeanbandit wrote: |
So does that mean Naoko Takeuchi supported DiC's decision to change Haruka and Michiru into cousins? What about when China or Russia removes a gay kiss from a movie? Just curious if this is a two way street here and we should acknowledges those changes are the true canon since localization can't do anything without the explicit consent of the original creative side, as all defenders of localization changes love to bring out as a defense. You can like this change if you want, but a change is a change. |
Lets pretend that everyone that has the intelligence to post on this forum can figure out that "a change is a change" doesn't make them all equal, because like any other action the reasons behind them matter, and trying to equate censorship based on homophobic ideas as the same as LGBT people being portrayed as real people is extremely disingenuous and gross.
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Rentwo
Joined: 05 Oct 2019
Posts: 184
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Posted: Tue May 05, 2020 7:38 pm
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FireChick wrote: | Japan has always had a problem with accepting LGBT people in any fashion, and even when actively showing stuff like that, they still have reservations about explicit confirmation of characters being on the spectrum due to their overly conformist values. |
At least until the next time someone makes a claim that Japan doesn't have "Shonen Jump Weekly themes" then people will shift the tone again and say Japan is actually super progressive and has tons of support for LGBT stuff. It's getting a bit tiring seeing the narrative flip flop back and forth depending on stuff like this happening. Everything I see says that Japan doesn't really support this kind of stuff, but certain people keep trying to tell me it does.
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Cardcaptor Takato
Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 5278
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Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 11:53 am
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Quote: | At least until the next time someone makes a claim that Japan doesn't have "Shonen Jump Weekly themes" then people will shift the tone again and say Japan is actually super progressive and has tons of support for LGBT stuff. It's getting a bit tiring seeing the narrative flip flop back and forth depending on stuff like this happening. Everything I see says that Japan doesn't really support this kind of stuff, but certain people keep trying to tell me it does |
It’s almost as if Japan like the US is a complicated country where some people support it and other people don’t and people should stop making generalizations about an entire race of people.
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switchgear1131
Joined: 14 Mar 2013
Posts: 219
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Posted: Fri May 08, 2020 7:23 pm
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DavetheUsher wrote: |
Banshou wrote: | As much as I'd like to believe that this is what the original developers had wanted from the beginning, right now it looks like something the localization team thought up. |
My general rule is if something was really what the original creator intended, they wouldn't need a foreign localization team to change anything. It always comes off like damage control to me to justify changing things in localization. I see this more like XSEED trying to avoid another Tomodachi Life outrage where certain gaming outlets raised a stink because there was no option for same-sex marriage in that game, so if they can change the dialog and alter some art assets to avoid all that then they will. XSEED did something like this with Akiba's Trip as well to try to head off the accusations of sexism toward the American version of that game. I suppose we'll see how far they'll take it and if they also censor out the gender select option like the American localization did with Animal Crossing: New Horizons since even that seems like a touchy subject these days. |
Pretty sure I have seen interviews with high up members of the ACNH dev team that completely contradicts the false argument you are making. The English version didn't censor the gender select option. There never was a gender select option if the words of the game's director and head staff are to be believed.
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