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Utsuro no Hako
Joined: 18 May 2012
Posts: 1046
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 Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:41 pm
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| uguu wrote: | | The thing is you're all focusing very hugely on Trump and/or how EVERYONE HATES AMERICA when the cover is not just about America. Trump was just one of multiple shitty world leaders caricatured. |
Yes, the cover shows Abe partying down with evil dictators. And the fact that Yaz included His Oleaginous Majesty as one of those dictators is the most relevant part to English-language readers.
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Chrysostomus
Joined: 11 Mar 2015
Posts: 335
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:43 pm
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| octopodpie wrote: | | The crux of this argument is asking journalists, even when the focus is entertainment, to ignore anything that might upset anyone. |
Please don't make assumptions and snide insinuations about people's political affiliations. -Galap
But anyway, the point of the person you replied to is that ANN is quickly developing a Trump derangement syndrome and people don't come here for that.
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uguu
Joined: 02 Oct 2010
Posts: 220
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:47 pm
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| Utsuro no Hako wrote: |
| uguu wrote: | | The thing is you're all focusing very hugely on Trump and/or how EVERYONE HATES AMERICA when the cover is not just about America. Trump was just one of multiple shitty world leaders caricatured. |
Yes, the cover shows Abe partying down with evil dictators. And the fact that Yaz included His Oleaginous Majesty as one of those dictators is the most relevant part to English-language readers. |
I don't think the point is 'evil dictators' as much as 'shitty politicians'.
I get that Trump is gonna matter more to the west but I also think Japanese politics matter quite a bit to anyone interested in the inner workings of anime/manga and their themes. For example: there may have been western parallels to nazism and whatnot in the Fullmetal Alchemist manga, but at their core, the series' racial issues were based on Hiromu Arakawa's knowledge of Japanese racism above all else.
And then there's the way a lot of nerds are suddenly getting political over Trump and realizing that politics suck and are corrupt after lying dormant during even the worst of Obama's decisions (which paved the road to a lot of Trump's more overtly-horrible actions). "Trump derangement syndrome" as an earlier poster said.
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ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 02 May 2011
Posts: 2999
Location: Email for assistance only
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:13 pm
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| Chrysostomus wrote: | |
But anyway, the point of the person you replied to is that ANN is quickly developing a Trump derangement syndrome and people don't come here for that. |
There's a handful of articles about Trump recently, since he's a prominent public figure and leader of the U.S. People, like artists, react to what leaders do either with commentary, agreement, or parody. What I find incredibly interesting is the conflation of Interest writing about the manga/anime/game industry's reaction to a public figure as an immediate endorsement of the views that were written about because of the perception of political views expressed in Editorial. Again, this is a softball call to not write about something that is deemed unfavorable by a subset of readers related to a public figure.
I'm going to stop you right there before this is construed to be hypocritical based on your previous forum posts being deleted. You can make that argument in the feedback thread.
But this isn't a good faith argument, and I think I've explained my point very thoroughly at this point which was immediately thrown out by you with the assumption of my political views ("liberal") and the pathos you attach to that designation.
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Juno016
Joined: 09 Jan 2012
Posts: 2410
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:24 pm
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First of all, a personal appreciation to octopodpie's transparency and getting involved in the discussion while being mature and professional.
This is a topic that can get really heated quickly, but it's just as important to have mature and critical discussions about such heated content. These are real events and they have an effect on everything, including anime/manga. In this case, we can see how it affects the artist and see how him and others in Japan may see world politics/economics. Like anything this big, it's complex.
Also, probably a good thing to avoid making assumptions of peoples' political alignment and focus on what it is they're saying. Plenty of my liberal friends are critical of how liberal news media portrays some conservatives and my conservative parents are very critical of how the conservative media's bias affects how topics are approached. We're all complex people first and labels second.
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Chrono1000
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:24 pm
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| uguu wrote: | | It's worth noting a lot of Japanese left-wingers see Japan as quite easily comparable to America. Particularly likely for Yasuhiko, an animator of that generation who's made glorified drawings of Che Guevara before. |
Well that would explain a lot. Che Guevara was a mass murderer who once shot a pregnant woman and than bragged about it later. Of all the revolutionaries that a person can pick he is one of the worst and yet there are plenty of people who praise the guy just because he had a talent for guerrilla warfare.
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Ashley Hakker
Joined: 31 Aug 2016
Posts: 115
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:26 pm
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| mgosdin wrote: |
| testament956 wrote: | | I actually think it’s a good thing, it’s great to have a perspective on how Japan views America. Even if it’s not a pleasant view for Americans to know, they should still know how their country’s politics affect the world. |
It's only a single illustrator's view, pleasant or not, and likely doesn't represent the total of Japan's citizenry. After all, they keep electing Mr. Abe and he's not being flattered by this illustration either.
In this day and age there's nothing that can separate people faster than politics, do we really want that here?
Mark Gosdin |
I fully agree with this. Politics are divisive and we come into anime for unity. We in this fandom, other than politics, only speak about unifying things. ...Like dubs vs subs, or weather the manga was better, the merits of piracy, streaming vs physical media, weather the ending was bad, who is 'best girl/boy', weather an anime is over-rated, selecting which anime fans to look down upon based on their series preferences, lecturing people about how they just weren't 'smart enough' to get the ending of a series, arguing about romanized character spellings, how to pronounce the word 'Anime', fighting about who can and cannot cosplay which characters based on bodytype, skin color, or quality of fabrication skills, which Gundam would win in a fight, which DBZ character would win in a fight against the winner of the Gundam fight, which character relationships are 'OTP'...
Ya know? Unity! But not politics. We don't need that kind of division in anime.
...We could also spend some time debating if it's weird to sign a forum post with your name every time like it's an email or something...
Last edited by Ashley Hakker on Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Chrysostomus
Joined: 11 Mar 2015
Posts: 335
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:29 pm
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| octopodpie wrote: | | What I find incredibly interesting is the conflation of Interest writing about the manga/anime/game industry's reaction to a public figure as an immediate endorsement of the views that were written about because of the perception of political views expressed in Editorial |
When you only publish unabashed hit-pieces about someone, and even his son, your (not yours specifically, I mean ANN as a whole) credibility and impartiality is called into question. As of now ANN is basically Huffpost-lite.
| octopodpie wrote: | | Again, this is a softball call to not write about something that is deemed unfavorable by a subset of readers related to a public figure. |
No, I would argue it's a call for ANN to not push its patently anti-Trump agenda so hard.
Also, please don't bring attention to my censored posts when you champion yourself as a journalist who breaks the stories people don't want to hear. That kind of cognitive dissonance is really embarrassing.
| Chrono1000 wrote: | | Well that would explain a lot. Che Guevara was a mass murderer who once shot a pregnant woman and than bragged about it later. Of all the revolutionaries that a person can pick he is one of the worst and yet there are plenty of people who praise the guy just because he had a talent for guerrilla warfare. |
They praise him because he was left-wing. Of course when ANN covers him they make absolutely no mention of him being a mass murderer who sent people to slave-labor camps, executed people without a proper trial, and enacted a totalitarian police state that has kept the Cuban people on food lines for over six decades.
Last edited by Chrysostomus on Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:54 pm; edited 3 times in total
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DeTroyes
Joined: 30 May 2016
Posts: 521
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:50 pm
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FWIW, I come to places like ANN to escape politics and other real-life issues. I get enough of that in the course of an ordinary day that it feels good to have something to retreat to devoid of such concerns.
Please, don't start getting political, ANN. There is no need to drag such issues into every aspect of our lives, no matter how strongly they may be felt.
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DerekL1963
 Subscriber
Joined: 14 Jan 2015
Posts: 1119
Location: Puget Sound
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:04 pm
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| Ashley Hakker wrote: | | I fully agree with this. Politics are divisive and we come into anime for unity. We in this fandom, other than politics, only speak about unifying things. |
"We"? Sorry, no. I didn't appoint you to speak for me.
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鏡
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:14 pm
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| Chrysostomus wrote: |
| Chrono1000 wrote: | | Well that would explain a lot. Che Guevara was a mass murderer who once shot a pregnant woman and than bragged about it later. Of all the revolutionaries that a person can pick he is one of the worst and yet there are plenty of people who praise the guy just because he had a talent for guerrilla warfare. |
They praise him because he was left-wing. Of course when ANN covers him they make absolutely no mention of him being a mass murderer who sent people to slave-labor camps, executed people without a proper trial, and enacted a totalitarian police state that has kept the Cuban people on food lines for over six decades. |
Did...ANN write about Che Guevara?
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Chrysostomus
Joined: 11 Mar 2015
Posts: 335
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:19 pm
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Lemonchest
Joined: 18 Mar 2015
Posts: 1771
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:57 pm
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One day there'll be a sponsored article on sexy Trump figurines being flogged by Tokyo Otaku Mode. Seems like only a matter of time. Then we can finally come together in unity.
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Ashley Hakker
Joined: 31 Aug 2016
Posts: 115
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:04 pm
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| DerekL1963 wrote: |
| Ashley Hakker wrote: | | I fully agree with this. Politics are divisive and we come into anime for unity. We in this fandom, other than politics, only speak about unifying things. |
"We"? Sorry, no. I didn't appoint you to speak for me. |
...My entire post which you jumped on to say doesn't speak for you was blatant satire... o.O
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Lord Oink
Joined: 06 Jul 2016
Posts: 876
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Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:05 pm
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| uguu wrote: | | .That said there might be some bias in the "look at all everyone in Japan shitting on Trump" list at the end. I kinda doubt they'd have brought up something like Tadashi Hiramatsu's disliked of Hillary and feeling that even Trump is a less-bad choice, then going out of his way to portray her negatively in Ibuseki Yoruni. |
Are you implying ANN cherry-picks certain depictions and articles to run in order to push an anti-Trump narrative? Good sir, I am offended at that accusation. The fine staff here know better than to let personal political feelings interefere with their unbiased, objective reporting. I'm sure all those other Trump cameos and anti-Left events happening in Japan are in their backlog waiting to be published in the future.
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