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Blanchimont
Joined: 25 Feb 2012
Posts: 3543
Location: Finland
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 4:33 pm
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RaylenCypher wrote: | If a series whose fundamental premise is to obtain the best outcome is not achieved, then it is ultimately a failure in my eyes.
I'm not putting any eggs in the basket for a second series, so I hope there will be a deviation in the anime from the source material and deliver an original ending. |
A happy ending is not a be-all end-all to a show, there are many that deviate from that to varying degrees. That doesn't necessarily mean the journey itself isn't enjoyable enough. Just look at the classic Greek plays...
I too hope for an ending on good note, reason why I dropped Akame ga Kill and continued with the manga adaptation instead. That said, if this show will force Subaru personally to put an end to someone he's gone through hella trouble 'protecting' to REALLY turn the knife in the wound in the yet to come story, can't say I will be surprised. It's brutal...
I have the first volume of the manga and novel on pre-order and aside what the anime has shown so far have no idea where it will all lead. But unlike you I do hope this follows the source, and gets a second season later. (unlike Akame ga Kill which...didn't...exactly...do that). Because even if I can't really stomache tragedy(which I hope won't be the case), I do recognize a good show when I see one, and rather not have it butchered.
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Key
Moderator
Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18394
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 4:42 pm
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RaylenCypher wrote: |
HaruhiToy wrote: | I'm looking forward to what Theron has to say about it. As of this writing he hasn't posted Ep 15 yet. |
As am I. |
Just turned in my review, so it should be up shortly. The short version is that the episode-ending shot of Subaru's eyes was a perfect cap to what the episode was doing. Still, I probably would have graded the episode that high even if it had ended with the credits scene.
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Hameyadea
Joined: 23 Jun 2014
Posts: 3679
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 4:59 pm
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I'll be very hard-pressed to find any other TV show -- animated or other -- that forewent either the OP, the ED, or both, as many times as this show has. And even then, each episode just feels too damn short.
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RaylenCypher
Joined: 03 Mar 2015
Posts: 138
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 5:17 pm
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Blanchimont wrote: | A happy ending is not a be-all end-all to a show, there are many that deviate from that to varying degrees. That doesn't necessarily mean the journey itself isn't enjoyable enough. Just look at the classic Greek plays... |
On a personal note, I completely disagree. When it comes to mass media entertainment, I look exactly for that and what I especially look out for in any show which is romance i.e; intimate-romantic love between characters.
On that same note regarding Re:Zero
Quote: | ...fundamental premise is to obtain the best outcome... |
Like Groundhog Day, Steins;Gate, or Edge of Tomorrow, the end-goal is to achieve the best result. The journey/development of the characters are secondary to the core premise of the show. The results are what matter, and so far Subaru has been shooting aces.
I'm already aware of Greek Mythology, since I took Classical and World mythology in High School for two years.
Blanchimont wrote: | I have the first volume of the manga and novel on pre-order and aside what the anime has shown so far have no idea where it will all lead. But unlike you I do hope this follows the source, and gets a second season later. (unlike Akame ga Kill which...didn't...exactly...do that). Because even if I can't really stomache tragedy(which I hope won't be the case), I do recognize a good show when I see one, and rather not have it butchered. |
That's great and all, but I'm hoping it does deviate since I have info on how Arc 3 ends. And if we take Akame Ga Kill! as an example, even if they follow it faithfully to the original source, it wouldn't have sold well with the general audience (the Japanese really don't like gore/extreme-violence).
If they pull a Deus Ex Machina of some kind, then that would be the show's only flaw as poor development. It wouldn't be a plot-hole, because it doesn't contradict what was already pre-established in the show.
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HaruhiToy
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Posts: 4118
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:14 pm
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Ep 19 review wrote: | What the hell is that giant animal-like creature with the glowing yellow eyes emerging from the mansion? |
Wasn't there mention of a dragon in the story's pantheon? That's what I took it for.
Whatever the case it was chilling (no pun intended) on how effortlessly it dispatched Subaru. There was nothing visible it did. But it strongly suggests that it knows something about Subaru's reincarnation ability if indeed it isn't the originator of the spell.
If any of our ensemble is going to have to fight that entity they are going to have to muster a whole lot more power than anything we have seen so far.
I notice that Subaru never found Beatrice's body. I was expecting to see her this episode and I still think she is a key player here.
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Hiroki not Takuya
Joined: 17 Apr 2012
Posts: 2625
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:16 pm
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Holy cow, this made me cry. This is shaping up to be interesting, Subaru is being subjected to torture to make him turn evil. I also was expecting Beatrice, but don't count her out yet. I'm fairly sure she knows about Subaru's "condition". Also, for ED music, Ep15 makes my list for epic-ly tragic. I think this is a high point for anime...
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ThatGuyWhoLikesThings
Joined: 04 Jul 2013
Posts: 1022
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:20 pm
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I frankly really enjoyed Betelgeuse. I feel like he really represents what true madness is supposed to be, with frequently bizarre gestures and some incomprehensible (to us anyway) dialogue. I also like how he represents his sin, valuing diligence and hard work (in rather twisted forms I should say), rather than being lazy himself.
Also, that giant at the end was most definitely Puck.
And remember that Puck has referred to Emilia as his "daughter" before, although it was played as a gag then. If I had to guess, Emilia died and Puck went berserk as a result.
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jutsuri
Joined: 14 Aug 2015
Posts: 49
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:46 pm
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I also think it was Puck. Like Theron mentioned in the review, during the first death by freezing it sounded like Puck was the one who said: 'You're too late.' So it seems to me Puck reacted to Emilia's injury or death by going into some sort of super-freezing mode, which progressed further the second time around because it took longer for Subaru to approach the mansion. I can't wait to see what Subaru does next week!
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cloud8100
Joined: 30 May 2010
Posts: 550
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:07 pm
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Haven't felt this emotional about a series in years . This was something else. The music at the end credits was perfect and after seeing Subaru hold Rem I could've fricken cried. It's cool how even though we know there are loops it still manages to be much more emotional than, heck some series where people die and you don't care half as much even though you know you won't see them again.
On another note, I loved when Betelguese put his hand to his ear whenever he listened to one of the cultists speak lol.
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Gistradagis
Joined: 03 Nov 2014
Posts: 96
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:20 pm
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Am I the only one who feels there might be some importance to the fact that one of the first sentences Betelgeuse pronounces is: "You wouldn't happen to be Pride, would you?"
Is he just referencing to how most of Subaru's mental breaks have had him going all nuts about how he HAS TO be vital and plot-centric to the lives of everyone around him?
Or is that capital on "Pride" more than just the people who did the sub's decision, and points to a sort of Fullmetal Alchemist plot developement?
Although the latter would be very impressive and change how we see Subaru and the plot yet again, I have my doubts about the author going that deep...
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sunflower
Joined: 04 Sep 2005
Posts: 1080
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:29 pm
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Gods, I wept for the last ten minutes. This episode was positively operatic in the best way.
I understand why they had to do the epilogue this week, but I wish they hadn't. The ending in the snow was so perfect for just one episode. But between putting that epilogue in this week and starting cold at his 'restart' next week, they made the right choice so the series flows better.
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Showsni
Joined: 13 May 2008
Posts: 641
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:29 pm
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Gistradagis wrote: | Am I the only one who feels there might be some importance to the fact that one of the first sentences Betelgeuse pronounces is: "You wouldn't happen to be Pride, would you?"
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Since he refers to himself as the Sin Archbishop of Sloth, I think we can assume that Pride is meant to be capitalised there.
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michizure
Joined: 28 Jun 2006
Posts: 177
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:43 pm
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Gistradagis wrote: | Am I the only one who feels there might be some importance to the fact that one of the first sentences Betelgeuse pronounces is: "You wouldn't happen to be Pride, would you?" |
This is the only major point I feel Theron missed in his review. Whether it plays a significant part in the plot later (and I'd be very surprised if it didn't), this is the perfect summation of Subaru's problems in the series to date, especially lately: hubris. Overweening pride.
That was a major "aha!" moment for me.
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Gistradagis
Joined: 03 Nov 2014
Posts: 96
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:51 pm
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Showsni wrote: | Since he refers to himself as the Sin Archbishop of Sloth, I think we can assume that Pride is meant to be capitalised there. |
Yeah, but that's the thing. Are these witch cultists some batshit crazy outcasts, and the sins thing simply the shtick of the even crazier Betelgeuse? Or is he related to the witch, and that referenced to the sins and Subaru as Pride has a deeper meaning?
It's a "theory" that explains a lot about the problems of mentality and attitude that Subaru has as a person, and could even partially explain the nature of his power (he refuses things to happen as he does not wish them to; he demands a perfect outcome to his problems), so I get the feeling it might be important enough for us not to just go and ignore it completely.
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HaruhiToy
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Posts: 4118
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 8:09 pm
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OK so if it is Puck, and not a relative with the same taste in accessories, then I can think of only one reason for him to dispatch Subaru. He knows about the time-loop magic and may be its caster.
Further, he may know what transpired in previous loops, which puts him in the role of Nagato in Haruhi's famous endless-8 arch.
That does raise a sort of depressing possibility. This is the only time I can recall where the animation went further than Subaru's actual time of death. It suggests that each iteration of the story is actually a continuing parallel universe with the surviving characters living on under the conditions while unaware that another universe started from the last save point. I always get frustrated with stories like that.
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