Forum - View topicANNCast - Whiplash
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dewlwieldthedarpachief
Posts: 751 Location: Canada |
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We do. It might take some deliberation over terms, but ultimately something will or will not fit a definition. And it's really important that this occurs, else 'sexist' or otherwise 'wrong' things will be left festering and hold back society as a whole. A really good example of this is women's reproductive rights; communities that enable women to control when and how they want to have children via contraception, family planning, and so on are able to slowly break free of the vicious cycle of poverty that seems to follow communities with women who do not have those choices. It's an important issue everywhere, regardless of nations being developed or rather undeveloped or cultures being similar or dissimilar. Depictions of women in popular culture might not appear to be so crucial, but not only are they an important barometer of how our societies view women, they have to potential to influence us as well. So naturally we should like to evaluate portrayals; perhaps not so that content can be unilaterally condemned or praised, but appraised. This is criticism after all, right? |
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YotaruVegeta
Posts: 1061 Location: New York |
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If we all have basically the same level of transportation, communication, technology, etc, why wouldn't we compare and contrast our culture with Japan's? Just because your brother lives on his own doesn't mean you can judge the cleanliness of his home when you come by.
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Hypeathon
Posts: 1176 |
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Well technically you can judge the cleanliness of your broher's home, just don't be surprised if as a result you're asked to leave for acting like an ass about it. |
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RogerSterling
Posts: 69 |
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That's pretty Harsh Zac - Man has an Opinion. Is this a court of law? must we defend ourselves to "You" or to the Masses (the fellow ANN readers & posters)- I thought this Forum was for the 'little people' to share opinions, yet here we have you calling us "Neanderthals"? Fine, it's your opinion. I stumbled on a 40 min interview voice actor Crispin Freeman (Alucard, Kyon, many other English Dub roles) gave with someone at "MYMHM" (a YouTube channel) and Crispin gave probably one of the BEST Answers Ever about WHY we love Japanese Anime - it actually destroys your claim that "Cultural Relativism" is a Guise. The comment he made (I'm paraphrasing) is that - Anime is not bound by the social norms & patterns of Western Animation. The societal norms and cultural lessons seem strange to us because it's NOT our 'norms' and AS SUCH, it doesn't have to explain itself because WE go to "it"- and "it" doesn't conform to US. He laughs and says "it's like, I am French Wine - Drink Me or Not". (the link to this is here http://youtu.be/mdDKTUXJerM ). Crispin does an amazing job of explaining how Vampires can be 'sparkley' in "Twilight" and yet, still be badass in "Hellsing" and we all can Get Along. To call another person "Neanderthal" and dismiss his argument on "Cultural Relativism" (which is a valid line of debate) makes me wonder if you just got frustrated and couldn't agree to disagree. Not trying to be antagonizing but I looked at the end of the thread and saw that "comment" and was saddened. You didn't even 'counter'. I like that Japan isn't "P.C." - YET! they respect women to such a degree that they give them their own "trains" and have strict laws against sexual assaults. Men should be Gentleman and keep themselves respectful! However, Japan encourages with the might of the rising sun itself, that females be "Womanly"- be girly and Kawaii and soft. Japan likes their men to be hardworking Salary Men & Strong independent providers (for the Pride & Honor of Family & Japan) and Woman to be maternal, soft, & beautiful and have kids for the glory & honor of Japan. **I should note: Progressives hate the 'traditional family structure' and have done well to destroy it in the USA, so this might be Zac & I agree to disagree. Lastly - how did this thread shrink from 22 pages? to 12? Why No Podcast for this week? I was all excited Friday morning. |
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SereneChaos
Posts: 384 Location: Middle of Nowhere, USA |
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Am I the only one who remembers Totally Spies, where the three lead girls would kick butt and also go crazy over their laser lipstick and computer compact? Or Winx Club and The Powerpuff Girls, which are magical girl shows? Or The Life and Times of Juniper Lee, Lilo & Stich series, The Mighty B!, My Life as a Teenage Robot, and Sabrina the Teenage Witch? And even if they didn't make them, American companies thought Sailor Moon, Tokyo Mew Mew and W.I.T.C.H. (which is European) were good enough to be broadcast. Yeah, most cartoons don't have female leads, but it's not because they think girls aren't strong enough to lead. You said it yourself, most cartoons are aimed at boys. Boys don't want to watch series where a girl leads, they want someone like them to lead. Most cartoons do have a strong female within the main party, like how Power Rangers usually have one or two female rangers, Teen Titans had Starfire and Raven in the main group, or American Dragon had a girl in the MC's group of three friends. |
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HitokiriShadow
Posts: 6251 |
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None of that has anything to do with "cultural relativism" or issues like gender roles and representation in media. You completely missed Freeman's point and twisted into something I am absolutely certain he was not saying. Because he would have been ripped to shreds if he said something like what you are.
Yes, you are a [expletive] Neanderthal. It is incredibly depressing that someone living in 2012 actually just typed that and thinks its a good thing. The "traditional family structure" as you think of it cannot be burned to the ground fast enough. And you completely ignore the horrifying reason they need their own trains. It's NOT a good thing at all and its hilarious (in a sad, depressing, if not rage inducing way) that you think they're getting their own trains because they're just respected so much. |
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Ryand-Smith
Posts: 33 Location: Saratoga Springs |
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You have offended me, as someone who does not come from the WESTERN AMERICAN culture, some of us had both our parents work, and were raised by our grandparents. Also, the traditional family structure is a construct of the 1950s, the 1 parent works, 1 parent in the house thing is very new, have you taken any sociology at all. Also, the idea that women should just stay in the house is offensive to not just me, but every female sailor I've worked with or am working with, so before you call me a PROGRESSIVE LIBERAL who wants to Destroy America, I'm a sailor who is defending freedom as I speak, so please don't try that. Man, I'm sorry for being late, but thanks Zac and guests for pointing this out, I mean I had no idea that they were literally going for this in Tomb Raider, I mean this is 2012, not the edgy 90s or some of the worse 80s comic *cough miller cough* TitanXL: what measure harms the most people, or forces people into a role, I mean its pretty easy to judge both on a utilitarian basis and on a basis of final outcomes and happiness. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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You're getting really tired. Just about done with you. |
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YotaruVegeta
Posts: 1061 Location: New York |
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Let's remember: women "got" their own train cars in Japan because there were disgusting perv dudes doing obscene things to them. What women want to have in Japan is a train they can ride on where they can just get from point A to B without incident.
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YotaruVegeta
Posts: 1061 Location: New York |
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Teen Titans didn't include the characters they did "just because" Its source material built up those characters to be important to the team, so they would be expected to be in a cartoon adaptation.
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RogerSterling
Posts: 69 |
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You are correct that Freeman's initial remark isn't about "Cultural Relativism" - I am using his statement of (again 'paraphrasing') "I am a French Wine- drink me or not" - in this case - "I am Anime - enjoy me as I am or Don't". You can't judge Japanese Anime by Western standards - Crispin even mentions that a lot of US ("viewers") enjoy it because it's NOT western. Believe me when I say I'm kind of disgusted when I see shows like "Yosuga no Sora" or "Astralotte's Toy". I want to ask anyone who was responsible for it "What the Hell are you doing?" - But it's Not my culture. I can't really judge them anymore than they can judge me for coming from a "broken home" (More on that in a sec). In Japan a Harem sex comedy is exactly that! A pervert is exactly that! A sweet innocent Moe house wife in training is exactly that - there's no 'Beating around the bush' - it's not trying to be anything it's Not. It knows this is a comedic fantasy setting for guys that like women. Who are we to judge Japan for what excites them? We can have opinions certainly but in the end it's Japan's culture that inspires these shows to begin with.
You are welcome to think I am, I applaud your honesty. To be honest I've met quite a few women older & younger who have at times lamented that they "wish" some guy would sweep them off their feet and pay for everything while giving them an exciting life where they can NOT work as they become "home makers". They Pine for the days of "Tradition". Me Personally?, I was from a "Broken home" at the age of 8. I was raised by my Father and once a week saw my Mom (She did not fight for custody). I was instantly ostracized from 'many events' as being from a "Broken home" was NOT the 'cool badge of honor' it is today. Yes, the parents of classmates instructed their kids to avoid "including me" in things. So as someone who never really had a "traditional family" upbringing (and at times Penalized for it!) - you can see why I tend to 'romanticize' the simple comfort of having TWO parents. I have cousins who were given 'everything' and lived the Dream and I think I turned out rather well. So Shoot Me for my "pie in the sky" notions of a "Traditional Upbringing" As for the "Women Train" comment. I was half kidding. I understand the need for this is cause of the 'Chikan' issue. I am pleased with the fact that they encourage girls to be "Girly" and men to be "Bread winners" and I know a few Japanese people & they tell me stuff- They're VERY Family oriented and I like that they actively enforce 'gender roles' (by Societal peer-pressure?). I'd love to live in a society where I'd actually have an excuse to "be a better man" - Most of the women I know as shallow, insecure, hen-pecking, bored (smoke a lot of weed), or gold diggers - Just out for themselves. Japanese women have Pride in their family's, their work, Motherhood, their nation (atleast most of the one's I've come across) - Sorry if I applaud the fact that Japan hasn't "sold their Soul" to Progressive values. I don't want a 'mother' and I'm not looking for a 'female slave' - I just enjoy seeing women who enjoy being women and inspire me to be a man of Value - Sadly they only exist in Anime. Call me a Neanderthal All you like - I can charm the F*ck out of an Attractive women with a few choice words of sincerity. As good as I am at "trolling" I am at the art of 'Verbal massage'. We can agree to disagree. I hope you enjoy the fires of burning "Traditionalism" what's gonna be left for your kids ?? |
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Fencedude5609
Posts: 5088 |
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This needs to be printed out, framed, and hung on the wall of every guy who uses the internet, with these words written underneath: "Don't be that guy" |
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RogerSterling
Posts: 69 |
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Dude, I wasn't Alive in the 50's, 60's, & most of 70's - When I say "Traditional" i simply mean "2 parents" in the same house. Especially after the depression & decline of America in the 70's (Carters Malaise speech?) - It was understandable that BOTH parents needed incomes to support an 'Average' family. No One said - Keep the women in the kitchen all Bare-foot & Preggo - CHILL (where's the fun in that?) I want my wife to be out there pursuing her dreams & making stuff happen - I like strong & confident women - I just like them to be Sexy, Attractive, non-Male Bashing as well. NEVER have I implied women are not equal - I just like that Japan keeps them "Girly" - like flowers. There's a lot to be said for 'Presentation'. Also - Thanks for your service. I don't care what your background is, religion, education, or political views - if you are serving this country as an unselfish member of the American Military, You have my respect. (nods head in respect). Seriously - I respect virtue and anyone who serves in the Military with honor deserves more respect than is often shown in todays society. |
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RogerSterling
Posts: 69 |
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LOL - really? I'm nothing like this in "real life" - I am actually quite charming. I just happened to be a Bold Debater sorry.
Really Zac? You're throwing in the "Tolerance Towel" after a about week? So basically what you're saying is. Come to Anime News Network forums - But don't have opinions that YOU (Zac) personally disagree with. Honestly, I've been on MANY forums (over many years). Religious, Political, Pin-Up (playboy) sharing, Movie & TV criticism, Otaku/Cosplay, 4chan & Sankaku types, Philosophy, News Media....They ALL thrive on diversity of Opinion. I make boards Better! I am a very good "Idol smasher" But if you honestly can't handle "me" - that's pretty pathetic. Or it just means lazy. You say want debate & opinions but then you really don't - I don't dislike you, but it sounds like you've already 'Written me off' - so throw the Ban Hammer Skeletor if you can't take ONE GUY with an opposing opinion. Just saying... there are 'Worse' creatures out there on forums than me. People with no feelings at all, people who are souless - I am not one of those people. Can't we all just have our 'opinions' as God intended? This is Your sandbox Zac - Do what you think is right in your heart. |
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Chagen46
Posts: 4377 |
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