Forum - View topicthe tone of ANN compared to other anime news sites
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Ademis_666
Posts: 3 |
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I will first state that yes I have been banned for my views on ANN chat and have come to terms with that (thanks to my own site) to be quite honest i have been reading various reviews, news and such in this site for about eight years and I have to say I am rather disappointed at how the collumnists and such think they are high and mighty. Every thing i have read on this site recently has been anti fan or anti internet fan to be more precise, remember ANN with out those fan dubers and with out people on bit torrent ANN would most likely not exist We all have at least one or two series, movies etc that we have downloaded via online and while i think the sale of these downloads is wrong private use is ok (yes i do include people that sell tickets to view bootlegs) but lets be honest with our selves ANN is anti internet fan. But why? simple they advertise other anime sites. However not news sites but rather shopping sites. Thats right im calling ANN biased they will abuse fans tendencies in public articles and then collect cash from shoping sites. Most anime series and such that are rated badly seem to be lesser known titles yet DBZ movies remain on the rental shelf or higher in Shelf Life. I am saying to ANN that it is and may always be anti fan. Yes i know they have contests and such, however so do radio stations. ANN is the rush limbough/Fox News of anime news one sided. Now if you like this thats your opinion however, for me I hope ANN gets run into the internet ground by people like me who care about the fan's voice and if you dont believe in all i say try viewing this page with out pop up blocker or go to their chat room and argue against mods opinions your gonna get booted or like me a +b ban cause ANN is nothing more then a bunch of one mind one heart people
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Key
Moderator
 Posts: 18394 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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I was going to let this pass because of how blatantly ridiculous these arguments are, but he makes it hard to resist. . .
So what's your definition of an anime "fan" then, Ademis_666? In my book it's anyone who rates watching and enjoying anime as one of their chief hobbies. I know all the anime reviewers fall into that category, and I'm pretty sure most or all of the rest of the staff falls under that classification, too. You seem to be defining "fan" as only the dedicated elitist fansubbers and those who strictly watch fansubs. Even under that definition, does it automatically mean that ANN is "anti-fan" if it doesn't approve of the practice of fansubbing in general? Are we "anti-fan" if we promote legitimate, legal distribution of anime over illegal methods? And if we are, doesn't that reinforce the illegality of what the "fans" are doing? You should also be very careful about casting aspersions about us reviewers. To say that I am slanting reviews to fulfill some greater agenda is something I take as a personal insult. I call 'em as I see 'em, and the editors here let us do that. If you want to disagree with the way we review and rate things, you're welcome to do so. Making personal attacks because of that is not. |
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Keonyn
 Subscriber Posts: 5567 Location: Coon Rapids, MN |
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Well, I'm going to have to flat out disagree with you, not only that but I'm going to have to point out your own obvious bias in the process. Sound like fun? Good, cause I thought so too.
You've been reading reviews and news articles here? Well good, that's what it's for, but I'm afraid I don't see where you see the bias or the high and mighty attitudes you claim exist. First off, reviews may seem bias simply because they are one persons viewpoint and that cannot be helped, it is the nature of a review. They may also seem all "high and mighty" to you because of that very same reason, it's a single person telling you why they think something is good or not, and that is also why you should take it as such, just one persons point of view. If it seems high and mighty to you that is because you view it that way, otherwise it's a review and that's just what reviews are. Now, you seem to be anti-fan yourself, by basically stating disliking the fansub community is being "anti-internet fan". There are some fans that believe in a moral standard regarding theft and one must wonder just how much a fan one can be when they refuse to give the creators their due and instead steal the art they're a fan of. I wouldn't say ANN owes their existence to fansubbers because it is frankly the popularity of the DVD medium and sales that have allowed anime to prosper in the US. Anime has been more marketable thanks to DVD's and the rise of anime magically seems to correspond to the rise of the DVD medium. But simply, what you see as "internet-fandom" I see as a thief and I still fail to see how willingly stealing from the people who's work you claim to respect so much is considered being the better fan. Now I'm an anime fan but you're basically attacking the type of fan I am because I purchase my anime and dislike those who steal it which makes you just as anti-fan as you claim ANN to be. So selling downloads is wrong but offering them for free and private use is fine? Either way the people who created it don't see a cent of your money and as ANN has posted in an article already these people are already barely making enough to get by. ANN is supporting the genre and promoting it while all the internet fans are doing is stealing it and then trying to villainize ANN for pointing it out. Pretending wrong is right doesn't make it right, and hating someone or something because they point it out makes it even worse. ANN has explained why they are "anti-internet fan" many times and feel free to reference that if you need a reminder. They put up banners because banners pay for bandwidth and a site of this size and popularity has to pay its bills. Anime news sites aren't going to pay for banners because they are most likely in the same boat for funding but vendors and licensors will, hence the ads you see. The one inconsistency I see here is that you claim ANN is one-sided but the viewpoint I get from your rant is more one-sided than anything I've seen posted on ANN. You also managed to take it a step further by wishing ill will on ANN for this difference in viewpoints and to insult them directly. You may claim to care about the fans voice but you seem awfully eager to dismiss it or villainize those voices when they disagree with you. Not to mention by claiming the true mark of fandom to be downloading and stealing anime you are completely disregarding the voices of the people that create what you're a fan of which is worse than one-sided, it's selfish and greedy. Then to also call them one-sided for rating DBZ as they do when in reality not doing so and not seeing who might like such an anime or why is more one-sided. You called them one-sided and then attacked them for their rating of a particular title that you don't think belongs there, is that not even more one-sided? In closing might I also suggest some language courses. Paragraphs are a common component of literature for many great reasons, I do suggest looking into them. |
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Tempest
 I Run this place.ANN Publisher  Posts: 10454 Location: Do not message me for support. |
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Chip on your shoulder ?
Nothing you've read on this site has been anti-fan. You may have interpreted it as such, but if you did, you're rather daft. ANN is a group of fans sacrificing their finances, lives and what not to make a resource for other fans. Yes, ANN has grown into a business, that was a decision I made because it just wasn't possible to continue maintaining and improving this site in our spare time. But I'm out six figures compared to what my finances would be if I'd stayed at my old career and put half as much time into advancing that career as I've put into ANN. What'd you've mis-interpreted as us being anti fan, is generally us picking a bone with a certain minority of fans. Yes, a minority. Over different topics. We have never spoken ill about people for simply downloading or making fansubs. We've spoken ill about people for continuing to make & download fansubs after the series in question have been licensed (see my recent editorial in PA#86 for an exception). We've spoken ill about people who are rude and/or have expressed a retarded belief in their self-entitlement to free anime. And we've spoken ill about a few other morons. Never have we spoken ill, in anything other than self-directed jest, about the average anime fan. Nor have we spoken ill about our readers, who are not average anime fans.
We've made numerous moves to give cheap or free advertising to anime conventions through trades and what not. But in general, other fan sites don't have money to advertise with us. This site costs alot of money to maintain, so we need to make money off our advertising. When a fan site comes to us to advertise, provided they don't go against our TOS (which I'll make public shortly), we'll gladly run their ads (provided they have a budget).
Huh? Mind repeating that in English? PS: If what you said was half true, I'd have banned you from the forum. That's not going to happen... yet. -t |
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Emerje
 Posts: 7393 Location: Maine |
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If news sites choose not to advertise with ANN then that's the choice that they've made. I'm sure ANN hasn't done anything to prevent these sites from advertising with them as long as they meet the requirements. As many times as Anime on DVD, Anime News Service, Anime Insider, Animerica, and many, many other online and print news sources that don't advertise with ANN have been cited in the news here I really don't see where you can say that they show any form of bias against other point of views. Emerje |
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Zalis116
Moderator
 Posts: 6897 Location: Kazune City |
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Oh noes! ANN doesn't support or encourage bootlegs, the illegal downloading of licensed show fansubs/DVDrips/scanlations/mp3s, or any other methods that fans use to obtain anime/manga/music for free or cheaper than it should be!!! Let's DOS them because DEY R TEH EVAL POWER!!!!!!11one11!ichiichiichi!1!
 
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Starwind Amada
Posts: 981 Location: Easton, PA, USA |
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ZOMG!!!!!1111 Ademis, you are so totally wrong in every regard. Stealing anime is ILLEGAL. You elitist snobby bastards who download your Naruto fansubs and claim that anime should be free because your fanboy self says so are utter scumbags. You guys complain when CN paints out blood in a Naruto, claiming that they've ruined the true essence of the show because a 2-second frame of Naruto getting stabbed was cut. You complain when an anime is licensed because you think every company is like 4Kids. Then you go and insult a website and its staff members on their own forums. That is completely stupid. I hope YOU get run into the ground by a bunch of rabid Naruto fanboys because you are one of the most clueless people ever. You don't deserve to be in the anime fandom. |
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Steroid
 Posts: 329 Location: At home, where all good hikikomori should be |
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I have not (yet ^_^) been banned from any function of ANN, but I am inclined to agree with Ademis_666.
First things first: ANN's encyclopaedia is well-written and useful. It's like an anime-specific imdb. And that is sorely needed. So, I use the site. Also, ANN is a wonderful clearinghouse for major anime news. It's fast and covers a wide base of information. This is also useful. The problem comes when ANN makes itself out to be a "fan" site. It simply isn't. I won't insult you by saying that you're in the pay of any company, but your sympathies clearly lie with the producers of anime as opposed to the consumers. This is not a bad thing. Deception, or undeclared bias, is. If ANN wants to say, "we're here for the casual fan, not the hardcore otaku," wonderful. If it wants to run a campaign against the hardcore otaku by inviting them in and then trying to argue with them, I disapprove. When my positions are dismissed as un-arguable, I do not feel welcome. Personally I would not do business with an ANN sponsor. The site would do itself a service by bringing in a single columnist to represent the sub-only, free-for-all, anime-is-life position. Until then I can't help seeing it as an unofficial front for an industry with which I already find disreputable business practices. |
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Nobuyuki
Posts: 536 |
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But those aren't "consumers", they're just parasites.  
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shirokiryuu
Posts: 714 Location: Northern California (SF Bay Area) |
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It would be hard to deal with mulitiple personalites (i would be classified as crazy) and two hearts in a body would be physically impossible *sarcasm*
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Steroid
Posts: 329 Location: At home, where all good hikikomori should be |
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They consume the product. By my standards, and by those of many others, the method they use to do so is fair. If the site disagrees, then it is a bias based on its own standards, not a site dedicated to all fans. Perhaps this is the crux of our difference: as I see it, ANN views the measure of a fan as how much they contribute to the fandom. I see it as how much they get from it. |
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shirokiryuu
Posts: 714 Location: Northern California (SF Bay Area) |
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i think it's impossible to satisfy everyone. besides, i think ANN is so publicized i thought they might be sued for supporting something illegal like fansubs... |
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Patachu
Past ANN Contributor
 Posts: 1325 Location: San Diego |
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So, to you, anime is basically a Pokemon contest where the leecher with the most GBs of fansubs on their hard drive(s) wins? Maybe it's because I simply sympathize with the difficult work of designing, drawing, scripting, voice acting, and the other creative aspects of producing animation, but I have never understood people whose entire devotion to an artform is measured in technical worth. |
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remember love
 Posts: 764 Location: Germany |
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This is probably from all the partying last night but honestly...I didn't understand a darn word he just wrote. Except for not supporting fans....what the heck is he talking about?
Anyways, to me as far as not supporting fans...this is an opinionated website(In my own opinion). Noone is ever going to agree with everyone else. That's why I've stuck around so much because we can talk about are own opinions. As far as news goes they get what they want and I read up on it..nothing bad about that. If they didn't get all the news then too bad we jus thave to find it ourselves. As reviews go... there are reviews on there I whole heartedly(I don't think that's spelled right) I disagree with but like I said it's an opinionated website and the reviewers who made the reviews wrote what they feel is right. If I disagree with them and the subject it up I will say so but that isn't going to change it. It's the opinion of the reviewer. Now if you all excuse me I think I'll fall a sleep somewhere. |
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Baal Zebul
 Posts: 40 Location: Midwest |
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You forgot to mention that they are paid hardly anything, from what I have heard. I think we need to give 'em a break, they work hard. I never buy bootlegs (ok, once on accident...) or download not because I find it wrong, but because they work hard and deserve the money we pay them. Mr. number of the beast, have a little empathy for the people who worked so hard to make what you watch. |
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