Forum - View topicCuteness... phobia?
|
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4 Next |
| Author | Message | |||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
Case
Posts: 1016 |
|
|||||||||
Even after hearing this arguement approximately a hundred thousand ways (in many different forms), I still fail to understand it somehow. Why are certain "classes" of anime fans totally unable to accept cute characters? I've been hearing this since I first got into Sailor Moon fandom about six years ago. "Chibi Usa! Gawd! Ewww! Yawn! Evil! Puke-inducing! I wish I could stab her in the face with a soldering iron! Any episode with her in it isn't even worth watching! Avoid! Let's cut up a plastic model of her and pretend that there is actual significance to it! Oh, and Chibi Chibi! Awh! Omigod! Old man beatoff mateial! Gross! Gag! Don't watch if you have any taste at all!" Since then, I've heard these same things arranged numerous different ways, applied over and over again to numerous different shows from Urusei Yatsura to Ai Yori Aoshi. I happen to like watching cute characters piddle around doing cute things. Sometimes, anyway. That's why I bought into Fancy Lala a few months back. It just makes me feel good inside - something that can be hard to achieve under the stresses of modern living. It makes me smile, and it makes me laugh. I can assure you, on my word as a phychology student, that its appeal has nothing to do with sexuality. It's just clean, good-natured fun like our parents like to think doesn't exist anymore. Anyone else have feelings on this issue? |
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
Cassandra
 Posts: 1356 Location: Birdsboro, PA |
|
|||||||||
|
(Let me start off with the fact that I haven't seen this anime yet. Perhaps I'll find an episode and come back with another opinion.)
There's a big difference between "cute" and "lolicom" (Lolita Complex). Cute is Chibi Chibi playing with puppies. Lolicom is Chibi Usa wearing a black negligee. In reference to this particular series, it depends if they are trying to portray a minor in a sexual manner. I believe what Zac is saying is that they are taking the 'cute' character a little too far and trying to make her more 'appealing' to men. (Which usually involves making her more sexual.) |
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
Mr Mania
 Posts: 581 Location: UK |
|
|||||||||
|
The majority of these types of characters are one dimensional. Also most of the characters in questions are exactly the same,seen them once seen them a million times.
I can handle cutsie character designs as long as the characters have depth eg Metropolis. |
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Cassandra
Posts: 1356 Location: Birdsboro, PA |
|
|||||||||
|
OK. I have sat through half of episode 2, which is about all I can handle. I can see where Zac is coming from on this one, though I wouldn't personally classify it under the Lolita thing. It's way to friggin sugary for that. (Unless, of course, you happen to be turned on by the incessant "OMG! HOW CUTE!!!" type things.)
The characters remind me of Battle Skipper....at least in design. In personality....well....there wasn't much personality to really go on. (Granted, it was only half of episode 2 but at least a little personality would be nice.) And now....I'm going to attempt to forget I even watched it 
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Coral Skipper
Posts: 223 |
|
|||||||||
|
I think that there is such a thing as too cute in anime. Take Hamtaro for example I watched one episode and nearly rotted out my teeth it was too cute and sugary.
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Dan42
Chief Encyclopedist
 Posts: 3793 Location: Montreal |
|
|||||||||
|
You know Case, I've noticed the same thing. There's one friend of mine who absolutely cannot stand anything "cute" in anime. He loathes Cardcaptor Sakura and during club screenings of Azumanga Daoih and Jungle wa Itsumo, he sleeps! I honestly don't understand that aversion since I really *like* those hyper-cute things à la CCS or Tiny Snow Fairy Sugar. But then again I can't say the aversion to cuteness is extremely common. It seems to me the opposite (addiction to cuteness) is more common. I guess I'll have to watch Stellvia in order to see what Zac was talking about exactly.
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Case
Posts: 1016 |
|
|||||||||
Certainly. But how often do you actually see something that obvious. In Urusei Yatsura, Ataru outwits Lum by taking her bikini top and baring her supple breasts for all the audience to see. Clearly, that makes UY cheap lolicom fodder, right? In other words, if the distinction were that clear I might understand. But oftentimes it is not, and I think most of the time people just blow it out of proportion because it suits them. And maybe because they like the word "lolicom". (Which I must admit, is a pretty nifty abbreviation.  )
Cool. Point made, then.
Awesome. I'm glad that I'm not the only person here who sees value in this stuff.
I'd agree with that, especially after reading an article a while back in the Yomiuri (IIRC...) about "Japan's obsession with cuteness"; but I think it's at least prevalent enough among American anime fans that it deserves to be commented on a bit. 
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Mr Mania
Posts: 581 Location: UK |
|
|||||||||
 Ironic considering your avatar is from Jin-Roh,which has ultra uncute and realistic character designs
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
|
|||||||||
|
"I can assure you, on my word as a phychology student, that its appeal has nothing to do with sexuality."
Aren't you in high school, Case? Last I checked, High School students aren't students of anything but High School, so let's not throw around credentials we don't have, mkay? Shows like Tiny Snow Fairy Sugar aren't really Lolicom shows because they're obviously for children. Yeah, creepy old men and even creepier doujinshi artists get off on it, but the show isn't designed solely to appeal to that audience. Something like Stellvia, which mixes fairly complicated sci-fi trappings and 12-year olds in tight costumes IS, in my opinion, designed to appeal to purient interests. It grosses me out, and when a show is blatant about doing that, I'm gonna blast it. "In Urusei Yatsura, Ataru outwits Lum by taking her bikini top and baring her supple breasts for all the audience to see. Clearly, that makes UY cheap lolicom fodder, right?" No, that's just fan service. Lum looks like she's about 17-18 and clearly isn't designed to look really super young. There's a big difference between lusting after someone who's 18 and someone who's 12. It's about 30 years of prison time, I believe. -Zac |
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Case
Posts: 1016 |
|
|||||||||
Logical Fallacies : Appeal to Authority As it happens, I am deeply involved in a college level Psychology course at present. It's not accredited, but that's neither here nor there; the material is the same as the Intro Psyche (101) course at Iowa State University. As such, I am in a position to know what I'm talking about when it comes to personality and sexual disorders - at least moreso than your average internet troll. So I hate to burst your bubble, but as a matter of fact I am more than that. Mkay?
But how does that make a difference, when the person in question who is watching is me? Or Dan? Or any other adult who just happens to have an appreciation for cuteness? If a show is cute and funny, and I like it, who it was originally intended for is of no importance to me. That doesn't change how the show looks, and what it is.
So if Zac or Dan took a liking to it, that would clearly define them as deviants in your mind? That's a really narrow outlook.
Oh, oh, but I think Stellvia looks at least 18! In fact, I think she looks *at least* 30! There's nothing quantifiable in that arguement. The characters can look any age you want them to look; to that end, all you have to do is chalk it up to the character design style. That's abused to no end anyway. Just look at... I dunno... Krillin from Dragonball Z. We all know him, right? Does he actually look like a grown man of whatever age he is supposed to be? If there's something quantifiable, then I can understand. To go back to Cassandra's example, if you've got a very young looking girl appearing in clothing that is only suited to lascivious grown women in real life, I can understand a distaste for it. But neither you nor Rebecca cited anything even remotely similar to that. Going by what I have heard about the show previously and the concurring opinion Cassandra has given, it seems to me that all we have is a cute young character with a little bit of a coquettish streak. To call that "lolicommed-out" is blowing things out of proportion in the same way that drooly fangirls blow the Gundam Wing pilots' relationships out of proportion. If you can provide solid evidence to the contrary, more subtantial than "Well they look young and sexy!", feel free to prove me wrong.
Breathe and chant with me Zac. "Child molestation law doesn't apply to cartoons... Child molestation law doesn't apply to cartoons..."
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
LordByronius
ANN Columnist
 Posts: 861 Location: Philippe for America! He is five. |
|
|||||||||
|
I think one can gauge which "cute show" is lolicon and which cute show is just cute by one little thing: smut.
Now, I'm no Hentai Scholor or nuthin', but from what I've noticed, the amount of h-doujinshi for Azumanga Daioh seems to be greater in number than that show's entire female fanbase. Compare this with a cute show along the lines of Chibi Maruko-chan, which has smut that I've never seen yet I am still sure it exists, albeit in much smaller numbers. My not-so-scientific analysis: Maruko-chan is not lolicom, yet AzuDai is! It's all so simple! And inherently flawed and innacurate! |
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Mr Mania
Posts: 581 Location: UK |
|
|||||||||
No they look the age they were designed to look,the artist ovbiously approached the character thinking,I want this character to look twelve
That doesnt mean its ok to have fantasys about a cartoon character who looks twelve and some series are aimed at exactly that sort of person. |
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Coral Skipper
Posts: 223 |
|
|||||||||
|
What exactly is lolicom. The term is new to me.
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Cassandra
Posts: 1356 Location: Birdsboro, PA |
|
|||||||||
*points up to her first post in this thread* lolicom = Lolita Complex. Basically, lusting after minors. And Case....the kids definitely do NOT look 30 or even over 16 in Stellvia. Krillin, if you watched Dragonball before DBZ, has definitely aged. He looks like an adult midget, honestly. Child molestation laws cannot apply to cartoons because you cannot TOUCH cartoons. However, child pornography laws can and do. Like I said, I can definitely see where Zac is coming from. The material presented is not aimed at children. (Like magical girl shows or cute fuzzy animal shows.) But it's not presented in an "in your face" manner. (The kids aren't wearing sexy clothes and whatnot....from what I've seen in that half episode.) It can pretty much be compared to putting a woman in a school girl's outfit (which conveys the image of innocent minors) then placing her in a business setting. It's not blatantly sexual, but the overtones are there....and they're aimed at those who fancy little kids. ARGH! You people are making me remember this!! I say it doesn't matter what Zac says....he should have just said "This show sucks" and left it at that. |
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
Mr Mania
Posts: 581 Location: UK |
|
|||||||||
|
Zac loves to stir things up doesnt he,and the forum is a more exciting,happier and friendler place for it.Well all except the last two.
|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
 |
All times are GMT - 5 Hours |
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group