View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
|
soulless_mariuno
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 33
Location: Honky Tonk
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 5:04 am
|
|
|
Hey,
I found an intresting thread dealing with the evolution of anime.It was locked for poor use of grammer.Nonetheless,i found the topic quite intresting.As i am new to anime,i would like to openly discuss this.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Fazz89x
Joined: 08 Sep 2004
Posts: 49
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 5:09 am
|
|
|
We evolved out of cool spaceships and sailing the universe fueled by passion for about 10 Tenchi clones (without the damn spaceships) each Japanese television season.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Starwind Amada
Joined: 26 Sep 2004
Posts: 981
Location: Easton, PA, USA
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:34 am
|
|
|
Why would you attempt to revive a thread that was locked for good reason? This thread will live the same fate.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Nagisa
Moderator
Joined: 19 Aug 2003
Posts: 6128
Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 11:46 am
|
|
|
Starwind Amada wrote: | Why would you attempt to revive a thread that was locked for good reason? This thread will live the same fate. |
The other one was locked for such poor use of language that it was practically unreadable. This one does not have that problem.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Nirvana
Joined: 30 Apr 2005
Posts: 261
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 1:11 pm
|
|
|
well, you could've started saying something about its evolution... seeing you wanted it back open.
As for me, I've barely started watching anime in the last year or so, so i cannot really talk about its evolution.
What I see however, is that lately more animes are more based on echiiness for comedy... I dont know if that was the case before, but didn't seem that way to me when I've watched older animes... oh, and the female body sure has gotten some development up there =).
|
Back to top |
|
|
IchigoK90
Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Posts: 1634
Location: Scarborough, Ontario
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 2:13 pm
|
|
|
Yes theres an evolution in anime. To be more precise i'm gonna say that in most comedies that have a so-called romance this is the evolution: For girls they are getting larger chests and packing a mean punch, For guys their morals are dwindling down to just being perverts and such. Also note worth evolution is the use of CGwith 2d cels and improvements in animation. One thing that seems to have barely evolved is originality in anime as alot of anime's borrow from past hits. Another part of anime's evolution is its growth in the western nations, anime is growing in america and broadcasting stations are starting to notice too. Well thats how I personally feel about its evolution.
|
Back to top |
|
|
ryokoalways
Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 562
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 3:22 pm
|
|
|
The western influence is probably the most noticeable one: setting of FMA, Music theme of Champloo, even the recent Miyazaki's "Howl's".
Another one, although maybe not as apparant, is the rise of the "cool" factor. Starting as early as the mid 90's, flashy moves or presentation has become more and more important. Recently, it basically peaked out in Seed and Seed Destiny. Heck, even Gundams from Wing was not that flashy, and you cant compare those to the MS of Universial century, which were far more realistic and practical.
|
Back to top |
|
|
LeoKnight25
Joined: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 319
Location: Puyallup, WA
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 4:33 pm
|
|
|
I agree with a lot of you guys on here...their has been a really strong evolution of anime but, not necessarily all of it in a good way. I'm a big classic anime fan and to me, the flashy animation and ridiculous amounts of fan-service, along with all the clones, has really kinda dulled my taste for a lot of anime lately. Sure the 80's and 90's were pretty flashy on some of their productions but, maybe I'm being biased, I think a lot of them had better storylines as well as felt more...I don't know...complete, maybe? They had better character designs definitely, IMHO. There are definitely a few I still pick up here and there, but I really miss the early days of fandom in America where we weren't so picky about things...
I know a lot of people will disagree but, I really strongly believe they had a lot better titles back then...hell, Sunrise was king of the hill back in the day. I think it's being geared a little too much toward Western audiences now. It's almost like the 90's with the American comics scene...T&A and half dressed women...kind of a shame really..
|
Back to top |
|
|
outlawwolf
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
Posts: 645
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 5:18 pm
|
|
|
Well there are obviously going to be advancements in artistic techniques over the years due to the use of computers and cg. Then there's the recent developement of anime getting more popular in the west and western voice actors getting better and better in sound, quality, and professionalism. I'd say that anime is going through an improvement not so much as say an evolution. An evolution would require a huge leap in advancement and I really don't see it. Note that I'm not an anime novice that has only seen what is on adult swim. I have seen different kinds of anime from different times and all I can say is that all we are noticing is a natural progression of time.
|
Back to top |
|
|
.Sy
Joined: 11 Mar 2005
Posts: 1266
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 8:31 pm
|
|
|
Other than the animation, which has definitely gotten better, I think the art style has definitely changed and progressed. Modern anime art looks...slightly less cartoony...? No, I'm not making any sense here. For example, the art of Astro Boy is different from titles like Ranma 1/2. Ranma is also slightly less modern looking than Yu Yu Hakusho. Then we move on to modern looking art styles such as Witch Hunter Robin and Wolf's Rain. I don't know if it evolved greatly with the plot. Some people say it's gone backwards, and plots are now too cliche, but I enjoy classics as well as new anime. (I haven't seen a lot of anime, so nothing seems cliche to me.)
|
Back to top |
|
|
Cloe
Moderator
Joined: 18 Feb 2004
Posts: 2728
Location: Los Angeles, CA
|
Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2005 11:14 pm
|
|
|
I don't think anime has evolved in the traditional sense; rather, it has enjoyed varying degrees of success in different genres with the passing of time. For instance, I don't know about anyone else, but when I think 70s, I think mecha, when I think 80s, I think cyberpunk, and when I think 90s, I think comedy. As far as the art goes, from a design point of view, I don't think it's changed that much. I mean, of course Tezuka's characters from the early age of anime stand out as being exceptionally cartoonish, but after that there was plenty of variety in visual style and character designs. Nobuteru Yuki's drawings in Record of Lodoss War hold up just fine to the modern standard of character designs, while Princess Tutu's visual look is quite retro (I think, anyway). Technological advancements are the only parts of the anime industry that have truly "evolved," and it's good news for everyone (except for animation cel collectors, I suppose), because it means smoother, cleaner animation. Storytelling? I think it's the same as it's always been. Anime stories will always be filled with cliches, but every once and a while a title will jump out from the rest to become an honored classic. That, hopefully, will never change.
|
Back to top |
|
|
LeoKnight25
Joined: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 319
Location: Puyallup, WA
|
Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2005 1:29 am
|
|
|
Cloe wrote: | I don't think anime has evolved in the traditional sense; rather, it has enjoyed varying degrees of success in different genres with the passing of time. For instance, I don't know about anyone else, but when I think 70s, I think mecha, when I think 80s, I think cyberpunk, and when I think 90s, I think comedy. As far as the art goes, from a design point of view, I don't think it's changed that much. I mean, of course Tezuka's characters from the early age of anime stand out as being exceptionally cartoonish, but after that there was plenty of variety in visual style and character designs. Nobuteru Yuki's drawings in Record of Lodoss War hold up just fine to the modern standard of character designs, while Princess Tutu's visual look is quite retro (I think, anyway). Technological advancements are the only parts of the anime industry that have truly "evolved," and it's good news for everyone (except for animation cel collectors, I suppose), because it means smoother, cleaner animation. Storytelling? I think it's the same as it's always been. Anime stories will always be filled with cliches, but every once and a while a title will jump out from the rest to become an honored classic. That, hopefully, will never change. |
Very nicely put. I don't think I could have put it any better than that. I feel there are different eras that used different styles of designs but, ultimately it's just a different aesthetic, not necessarily good or bad. Sure, some people don't like the designs of the older anime but, in all actuality it's just another style and sooner or later, the styles most people cling to today will be outdated to some, nostalgic to others but, ultimately it's just a style of doing things. I suppose I'm just reiterating a lot of what you already said but, I really heartily agree with your opinion and your views. But, like you said, ultimately the technology will advance and there will be different ways of doing things but, it's all anime and hopefully people will continue to push the envelope and make great titles for years to come. But, what some may consider art, others may not... so really again, like you said it's been based on the taste of certain eras and individuals living in that era that make things popular. I hope I haven't babbled on too long about this and reiterated too much of what you already said...there are other things I wouldn't mind saying but, my brain's working overtime as it is on this one so...I'll end it here...heheh. I just wanted to say thank you for having such an unbiased approach to all of this. Very rare in this day and age.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mugen The Great
Joined: 26 Jun 2005
Posts: 189
|
Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2005 8:17 am
|
|
|
1940s-1950s: Nothing really. Basically just fooling around with the idea of animation.
1960s: Same fooling around, only more mainstream. Out of this we get some of the main genres of anime. Tezuka's the main influence, so comparisons to Disney works, mixed with some Hanna-Barbera, are inevitable with the character design style of the era.
1970s: Animators seem to be getting a hang of the TV production process, allowing more mainstream series. Lupin III comes out and becomes the first anime to get a large adult fanbase, opening up the doors for such animators as Go Nagai (and indirectly launching Miyazaki's movie career). Super-sentai (Gatchaman) and super-robots (Mazinger) dominate Saturday mornings. Yoshiyuki Tomino notices these trends and uses them as the base for his minimally-noticed but revolutionary anime series such as Gundam and Ideon.
1980s: Between the success of newcomer Macross and an extremely large fanbase, Gundam-mania sweeps anime, resulting in are large boom of rip-offs. Dragonball comes out in this era, adding to the action shonen formula established mostly by Knights of the Zodiac, and creates another huge boom of similarly styled series. Going against the grain of the "classic anime" trends of the time are Miyazaki, Takahatta, Oshii, and Otomo, creating new works that defy the public's stereotypical perception of anime, and creating a new perception in the process. This creates a sort of Renniasance of anime, and gets anime it's first real grounding as a sub-culture in the United States. Also, the OAV gets going, resulting the genres of ecchi and hentai.
1990s: The first big breakout for the OAV and creator of the harrem formula, Tenchi Muyo, and the formation of shojo masters CLAMP are really the only things of much influential note for the first half of the decade, which was mainly continuation of the scene from the '80s. The second half of the decade was a sudden shift for anime, and that shift can be described in these three words: Neon Genesis Evangelion. Hidaki Anno's tribute, satire, and deconstruction of all things classic anime completely shook up the anime world, resulting in series getting inspirations of all sorts from the program, of everything from the mind-blending plots to the boobs-and-robots fanservice to the parodies of other shows to sometimes all of the above. Even CLAMP was adding to the craze, with the success of Cardcaptor Sakura on cable TV allowing these series to thrive without the contraints of network censorship. Anime's continued success in America, lead in part by the American airings of Sailor Moon, Dragonball Z, and Pokemon, was probably one of the main things that started getting series like Cowboy Bebop made, which had mainly American influences and floped on broadcast TV while gathering big cult followings on cable.
2000s: Digital production allows higher visual quality and faster production for anime series. However, there doesn't seem to be any big Lupins, Gundams, Dragonballs, Akiras, Tenchis, EVAs, CCSs, or Bebops in this decade so far, despite lots of high-quality, should-be-revolutionary titles such as Azumanga Daioh and Paranoia Agent. Perhaps this lack of big successes is due to oversaturation of the market, which has created lots of quality series but even more total flops. The closest thing we have to a mass-media success of EVA-level proportions is currently Fullmetal Alchemist, and even that show seems to be overshadowed by the increasing number of productions each year. Rising out of the ashes like a Phoenix comes Makoto Shinkai, an upcoming animator who along with his wife entirely animated, voiced, and directed the short subject Voices of a Distant Star. With his recent theatrical feature The Place Promised in Our Early Days, he has proven that he is capable of Miyazaki-level quality work. In due time, independed animators like Shinkai, shows like Fullmetal Alchemist, and the increase in Japanese-American co-productions will certainly lead to another anime Reniassance yet again.
|
Back to top |
|
|
ChurchofVirus
Joined: 28 Jun 2005
Posts: 26
Location: Eagan, MN
|
Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 10:08 pm
|
|
|
Around the time when we reach the year of 2010 we will be able to make a better observation of this decade in anime. Mugen that was definatly a good read and as for what you said about the current lack of big titles these days I totally have to agree with the oversaturation of the market. It's very difficult to siphon out the honest crap from the great anime.
I have a feeling there will be some companies claiming bankruptcy(sp?) due to the many, many titles, oversaturing the market thus leading to large loss of profits. Too many product, not enough consumers. Well well have to see but again great post Mugen. Perhaps then there will be a more overall quailty of anime being produced as companies will need to ensure they will get a good profit because in the end, really, it's all about the money.
|
Back to top |
|
|
|