Forum - View topicNEWS: 1st Manga to Be Restricted by Revised Tokyo Law Listed
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GWOtaku
 Posts: 678 |
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Of course it depends on the work. Of course it depends on judgement. What were you expecting, a bunch of separate laws decreeing that manga X, Y and Z are to be restricted from time to time? You are effectively complaining that the law will have to be interpreted in order to be applied. But that's how it works! Before Bill 156, the original criteria for judging material "harmful" to minors was this (source): "Any material that may be detrimental toward the healthy development of youth because of their capacity to be sexually stimulating, encourages cruelty, and/or may compel suicide or criminal behavior.” Any material that may be detrimental because of these things? As I said, that's absolutely vague in its own way. Open to interpretation? You bet. All these years, was that law abused? No. This is a matter worth paying attention to, sure...but the case for the worst case scenario hasn't gotten any more convincing since people started worrying and arguing about it last year. |
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Harafan
Posts: 30 |
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Well, to me the lack of rules tells me it isn't about porn, protecting children, or even morals.
It's about politics. It's about something the politician can drag out into the spotlight and say, "Here! I protected your child from this!" And like many posters in this forum, the public will nod and say, "Yes. I don't want my 4-year-old exposed to that." And maybe even vote for the politician. And because there are no stated rules, just a board who will "know it when they see it," the board will be immensely corruptible. If this law stays as-is, I expect to hear of news stories about scandals involving massive kick-backs to the censors from the publishers to overlook their books in about five-to-ten years. The power to ban is the power to extort, and seeing how corruptible Japanese politicians and bureaucrats have been in the past (especially in a case like this when the rules are unclear), I have no doubt that corruption will follow. I wonder if the corruption hasn't already started since no books from the big-three publishers were targeted. |
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GWOtaku
Posts: 678 |
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It restricts, it doesn't ban. The word "restricted" is even used in the news article headline. I really wish more people would talk about this based on what the facts are (the link contains opinion too, but it also explains things well). Last edited by GWOtaku on Mon May 16, 2011 10:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Saturn
 Posts: 513 |
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this stuff isn't ACTUALLY being banned, is it? (EDIT: thank you, GWOtaku) Everyone keeps using the word "ban" but as far as I understand it-- and I might be wrong-- it's just going to be a case of putting a sticker on it and moving it to the adults-only section of the bookstore. This is NOT a big deal. If you've ever been into a Japanese store, the "adult" section is more open to the public than Suncoast's used to be (remember those black plastic things that hid the covers of porn dvds? I never saw any of those in a Japanese bookstore. Just the graphic and often highly offensive covers of books, right out there for all eyes to see.)
All people are doing by saying that these books are being banned and their authors are going to starve to death and Japan is going to become a wasteland is creating straw men, the same way the politicians in Tokyo are creating straw men by saying that porny comics are causing all the problems in the country. Hyperbole isn't going to help anyone out. |
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E-Master
 Posts: 471 |
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I too had to look for solid facts on this matter, and as long as the government isn't planning to go the Farenheit 451 route with these manga, then I'm fine with it.
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marcos torres toledo
Posts: 269 |
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It is about censorship pure and simple I though Japan had 14+ to 17+ in their manga they have it in their anime this harassment of artist and publishers just look at American movies ,comic books ,television go back to the late sixties and seventies and now you can see the difference the only R rated films I know of lately are comedies most of the movies are PG to PG-13 the 14+ to 16+ for manga made sense that the Tokyo prefecture rejected this idea show their true colors though control like in America.
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Mad_Scientist
 SubscriberModerator  Posts: 3011 |
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Except the bill is already being used in ways no one talked about before. "Sex in school." I read quite a bit about the bill, on ANN and other sites. And not one thing I read, not even the most extreme of the doom and gloom predictions, mentioned a thing about that. From the translations I read, there simply wasn't a single mention of sex in schools being singled out. So how the heck is this bill now being applied to that? Did everyone miss some "sex in schools" part of the bill before? Or is the bill's apparantly vague language already being exploited to restrict things people didn't expect? |
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P€|\||§_|\/|ast@
 Posts: 3498 Location: IN your nightmares |
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I would have thought that concurrently with these titles that various manga depicting gay relationships have also been published. The law seems to have been directed toward restricting works of this sort but none are currently included on this list. Could it be that it was decided it will be more lenient towards BL and yuri titles than previously anticipated? I'm not happy about the existence of the bill overall but an indication of more tolerance for homosexual romance manga that don't fall under rape, incest and child exploitation is a good thing.
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Nemo_N
Posts: 272 |
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Why such interpretation cannot be clearly expressed, even by the person in charge? You are confusing interpretation with "opinion" when interpretation of law should be based on the text and those texts based on clear, rational statements. Ms. Sakurai could have answered the question with a clear, concrete statement. She didn't. She couldn't. You make it sound as if it's okay for a law to be vague because someone will be there to find the meaning, yet this only leads to people choosing to read it whatever way they want to.
It hasn't happened, therefore there is no way it could happen in the future? That's very weak. The guy spearheading this is a nut and a homophobe. For him that law was, obviously, not enough. That should tell you enough about his intentions. |
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Nemo_N
Posts: 272 |
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Seriously? Why until release? Or is the law so vague that the guys applying it can't figure it out in advance? "Sorry sir, we can't tell you if that action you are describing is a breach of the law until you complete said action! Come back when you complete the action in question and then we will tell if you are going to be penalized for it!" It's like something out of a Monty Python sketch. If you ask if theft is illegal you get a straight answer. But then again theft is based on a fact, not an opinion. |
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MaxSouth
Posts: 1363 |
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correct... scientists found that bearers of hypocritical puritan morals are much more dangerous for society than people who are free to engage in harmless interests... |
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Kyaa the Catlord
Posts: 300 |
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Other than Aki Sora, which comes from a rather well known mangaka, none of these are being scanlated. So the impact to English speaking fans is NONE.
There's very little to Japanese fans either. |
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configspace
Posts: 3717 |
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I mentioned this before, but even in the US there is NO restriction like the way it is in Tokyo. Following the ratings are voluntary. Even ratings themselves are voluntary, hence the many "UNRATED" titles offered here. We do have a different issue, which I won't bother with here though.. Back to the issue, it's simply wrong pure and simple to legally restrict these based on what is perceived to be socially disruptive. Totally idiotic. They weren't classified as porn before i.e. due to lack of genitalia, but now they are treated in exactly the same way. For example, if those incest title simply changed the stated relationships (or ages) BUT kept the exact same art work, then they would not be legally restricted. Put an advisory sticker and that's it. If a 16 y.ear old wants to read them, then let them read them. If a parent disagrees then it's between them. Let's think about it rationally and objectively for a minute: if you didn't know about these titles, what have you observed before this ban on material for those less than 18? And what are the effects you observe after this? Was anyone measurably harmed before? And after?
.. which makes for bad, just terribad laws. That not how laws should work. A lot of people like to think so but only because it allows laws to be biased and totally, completely irrational and never logically consistent. Laws should NOT depend on what someone perceives of the work, it should not depend on the whims and foibles and emotions of people. And ironically what you'll get is exactly that outcome: that from time to time, manga X,Y,Z are put now on the blacklist based on some arbitrary decision. And remember it IS a "blacklist" because it is punitive: they either must remove it or republish it under an 18+ category. They wouldn't have gone through such punishment if they had so in the first place, but then again, the content would be vastly different, as in more raunchy like Ms. Itosugi of Aki Sora mentioned before. (since hey, it'll be classified in exactly the same way as porn now, so why bother with something more discrete?) |
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Mohawk52
 Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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ptj_tsubasa
 Posts: 129 |
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But stuff like that would've been R-rated even before this law passed, no? Something that graphic would be explicit. Manga like that is already sold at the porn section. No, this is about non-explicit manga - manga that is thematically immoral to Ishihara and his gang. For instance, even though My Wife Is an Elementary Student is listed because of "child rape" it does not contain anything resembling realistic sex or sexual violence. All the mock sex scenes are actually fantasies involving bananas and whipped cream in people's thoughts. Fetish fuel for the lolicon, sure, but not porn. If the author would've wanted to make porn he would've drawn it straight to an R-rated magazine like Comic LO or something. But he didn't want to - just like the author of Aki Sora:
Last edited by ptj_tsubasa on Tue May 17, 2011 7:38 am; edited 1 time in total |
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