Forum - View topicWomen in anime.
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RHachicho
 Posts: 897 Location: Essex, UK |
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Gah! sorry then  I am rubbish at telling emotion from text it seems. Though I think the point about you needing to see more Anime is valid. There are plenty of excellent women in Anime you just have to find them. I can relate because I had a similar opinion to you when I first joined this site. But because of the many wonderful non mainstream titles I have been introduced to my perspective is totally different now.
Last edited by RHachicho on Sun Sep 26, 2010 11:30 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Sentire
 Posts: 981 |
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I thought that poilk92 has admitted to not seeing much anime compared to some others, let alone ones where a female is depicted in a manner that he/she thinks is not degrading in their opinion. That doesn't seem unreasonable to stir up discussion.
I guess I can understand why either extreme of a female character may not be preferred for some. As an older, female viewer of anime, I like to see females depicted in a way that is respectful, gives women dignity, depth and value. Sometimes, either extreme lacks in this. Don't get me wrong, I like the occasional "ball-buster" (I believe that is how someone worded it) female. Yet all might and no vulnerability seems rather unrealistic, and can get tiresome as well. Yet, I think there are plenty of female characters out there that do have depth - you just have to look in the right places. Some of my favorites would be Shurrei from Saiunkoku Mongatari, Hiroko from Hataraki Man, Kyouko from Skip Beat (I believe someone else mentioned her), Chiba from Paprika, Fuu from Samurai Champloo, and Motoko from GITS - just to name a few. Oh - and I had to edit this to add Re-l from Ergo Proxy - considering that is my avvy. 
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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I had forgotten about her. She's a strong and independent woman who nevertheless keeps her femininity, which is an alluring combination. She is far more preferable than the chain-smoking gun-toting macho women that abound in Anime. Just because gender equality means that women should get to do what men do, it does not mean that they have to look or act masculine to get those equal rights and equal respect. In fact, the case can be argued that macho women are not a good example of what many feminists actually desire, because it implies that to be strong-willed woman you have to give up that which makes you a woman in the first place. Honestly, Revy from Black Lagoon might as well be a man with tits the way she acts. I hope that people can see that I am not against women being macho if they want; feminism is about choice. And implying that women cannot be strong-willed without being badarse is not a choice, it is another form of discrimination. That's what I'm trying to say. |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar  Posts: 16961 |
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I REALLY hate to agree here as I love Black Lagoon but DTM does have a point. Revy is basically a man trapped in a woman's body. I do think though there's a difference between the macho woman and the ridiculously macho woman. Simply being macho to a degree I think doesn't take away from being equal etc. I mean "macho" as a description is a bit open to interpretation. There are varying degrees of what someone might consider to be macho. Someone might see Re-l or Matoko, to use Sentire's examples, as being macho but I don't think in either case they stray away from what women want in equality. Both are macho to a degree but not overly so. They're not beer swilling, cursing, cigarette smoking, macho women from hell. Hello Revy lol. I swear you could place her in the deep south and just slap a Confederate flag on her ass and she'd fit right in lol. I think navigating that line between macho/competent and just overly macho/masculine is a bit of a challenge. I agree with Sentire though that there are plenty of strong women out there but ya gotta dig often. Many really are overlooked as characters or are from shows that are overlooked or not more mainstream. |
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agila61
 Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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Perhaps adding in a small way to the excellent examples already given: Fee Carmichael from Planetes is strong willed without being a Green Beret ~ even Ai Tanabe, though a bit more traditional lead character, has more depth to her than appears at first. Saeko Shirasu is a photojournalist in FLAG, joining a front line unit in a UN peacekeeping mission that is threatening to spiral out of control. Celty, the strongest female character in Durarara does, in fact, have a head, but she's misplaced it. That would probably be more traumatic if she were human, but not being human does not lead her to be a two-dimensional character. Lavie Head is one of the two young protagonists of Last Exile, which also features first officer Sophie Forrester and vanship pilot Tatiana Wisla in strong supporting roles. And no list would be complete without Utena, who is a revolutionary girl who can handle a sword, but who is no Revy. |
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RHachicho
Posts: 897 Location: Essex, UK |
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Yeah definately agree with this. However I think you have to give some characters the benefit of the doubt that they chose to be how they are. Revy seemed to have some fairly solid reasons for being like she is for example. Armitage and Balsa also fall clearly into this catagory. But I completely agree that I don't like the girls that just seem to be bat sh*t crazy and blokish just for the hell of it. It is definately just altered sexism. Bit where excactly to draw the line in this matter is probably a matter of perspective. |
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Hulten
 Posts: 74 |
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I think that women are portrayed pretty badly in most anime. I mean they are obviously conjured ideas for men. They are made to be appealing to a male audience half the time, but there are some that come close to how a women or girl would act, but that's from a Japanese perspective of what women are like in japan. Not to say I'm Japanese. I've never seen an anime portray how women realistically act like in the U.S. at all. That's just to say if you were looking from the American perspective.
So yeah, it's really hit and miss when it comes from a fantasy to a realistic portrayal of women in anime. But its mostly a miss almost all the time because of a male audience. |
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RHachicho
Posts: 897 Location: Essex, UK |
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Sorry but that kind of blanket statement just isn't true both this topic and the one that spawned it teemed with examples of strong deep female characters. Sexism does not mean sexually potrayed characters it means that the show features sxual discrimination with women being treated differently from men. Thing is women and men ARE fundamentally different so equal treatment is not only untenable it is undesirable as well. As people we all decide where to draw the line and call prejudice. While examples of real sexual prejudice no doubt exist in Anime I would suggest you either need to see more Anime or are confusing sexism wit sexuality if you simply think all Anime is guilty of it. Hell I know a couple of women who even like the way women are potrayed in alot of mainstream Anime. Let alone some of the non mainstream stuff. I would say on the whole Anime treats women no better or worse than hollywood does. Women are often objectified in the mainstream yes but leave the mainstream and you will find much to youre liking.
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gundam83
 Posts: 93 Location: Caribbean |
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I seen some anime with strong female lead characters and I have also seen the other extreme for example where women are portrayed as weak and as sexual objects. I think the question that should be asked is-Is there a balance of how women are portrayed in anime? In real life there are women who are strong,who act macho and there are some who are girly and really act like the damsel in distress,lol. But with the anime that I have seen SO FAR. I usually see the latter.
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OtakuExile
 Posts: 202 Location: Neo Vegas |
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Hold on. Strong female characters? And you want it in Japanese animation? Ha! The same Japanese that have women walk three paces behind the man? The same Japanese that will sexually harass you on a morning commute? Hell, you better clutch that box set of Moribito tight, because last I checked, fantasy is a lot different than reality. Moe and T&A still sell.
Don't worry though, the old generation that think this way are on their way out, then you can command your legion of herbivore men to animate all the "strong women anime" you want.
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Unicorn_Blade
 Posts: 1153 Location: UK |
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I have loads of Japanese friends, none of them walks three steps behind their man. A lot of them actually work in big companies and what a surprise, noone harrasses them on their way to work. The last time I checked, the reality wass a lot different from what you saw on the TV. Time to wake up. |
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Sanosuke_Inara
 Posts: 1662 |
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ThePoliced
Posts: 130 |
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That girl from Genshiken(the one with brown hair). I actually know girls like that, and also she's like Penny from the Big bang theory lol.
She's pretty much like any girl her age and that's pretty realistic to me. |
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PetrifiedJello
Posts: 3782 |
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I'll give the favor Shurei was indeed "I don't need no man..." but there's no escaping the fact men were there defending her as well as pointing out it was their duty. That being said, this series defines an important aspect of this discussion in that era has just as much to do with sexism as the portrayal. Even today, Shurei's attitude is commonplace in American society as well. I can't count the number of times I've heard women remark they don't need a man to do things for them all the while berating them because they didn't open the door for them. There is a difference between sexism and chivalry but it seems many don't realize this. Probably because there aren't many knights running around... unless they're in anime. Which is why I can't see any sexism in Fate Stay/Night as Shirou comes off more a knight than he does a sexist pig. |
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OtakuExile
Posts: 202 Location: Neo Vegas |
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