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Lady Multi
Joined: 11 Dec 2004
Posts: 675
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 10:55 am
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meiam wrote: | Music is the only things I'm not worried about in FF7 since most of the music from game in the last 10 year of square enix game are pretty solid. They have many other very talented people to help out.
There still gonna screw up the gameplay and story though. |
We all hope they know better than to truly screw the story... Then again, it's a Remake; it will never replace the original.
I learned that already with the remake of PS1 Tales of Destiny for the PS2. So I'm a lot more open minded.
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pajmo9
Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Posts: 630
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 11:15 am
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I really hope they just recreate the original compositions using real instruments and not try to do crazy new versions of them. That was fine for AC and CC but I hope they don't do that for the remake.
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Kougeru
Joined: 13 May 2008
Posts: 5560
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 11:27 am
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They already have plenty of re-arranged versions to work with. As long as it's the same overall songs, it should be fine. Having a completely different soundtrack however, will destroy the mood of the game.
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belvadeer
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 11:35 am
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I'm sure it'll be fine. It's not as if FF has ever had truly horrible or earsplitting music. Even the MMOs, despite my aversion to ever speak about them, have solid soundtracks overall.
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Themaster20000
Joined: 05 Aug 2014
Posts: 866
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 12:39 pm
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belvadeer wrote: | I'm sure it'll be fine. It's not as if FF has ever had truly horrible or earsplitting music. Even the MMOs, despite my aversion to ever speak about them, have solid soundtracks overall. |
I would argue that X-2 had a terrible soundtrack.And I thought XIII had a bland soundtrack.
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AiddonValentine
Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 2309
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 2:17 pm
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Nyren wrote: | You do realize that Nomura, Nojima, and Hashimoto were the big three of Final Fantasy VII right? All three of them are involved, except that Nomura stepped up to the director's chair(Unknowingly) and Hashimoto stepped up to producer. Besides Uematsu, those are the three that originally made Final Fantasy VII. |
Oh, they were involved. But they weren't the guys that made the game GOOD and clearly don't understand what made it good. Nojima's track record since has been at best mediocre while Hashimoto was merely a producer. And that's not even getting into Nomura who was a character designer, had next to nothing to do with its narrative, and has spent the entirety of his career spiraling into self-parody. The guys were involved, but even if they contributed something of value to the game they're washed up at this point along with SE's entire crop of dev talent. 2015 SE is not 1997; this is not going to be a return to form and is in fact an admission of Square giving up on ever surpassing a game that came out nearly twenty years ago.
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CrownKlown
Joined: 05 May 2011
Posts: 1762
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 2:58 pm
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AiddonValentine wrote: |
Nyren wrote: | You do realize that Nomura, Nojima, and Hashimoto were the big three of Final Fantasy VII right? All three of them are involved, except that Nomura stepped up to the director's chair(Unknowingly) and Hashimoto stepped up to producer. Besides Uematsu, those are the three that originally made Final Fantasy VII. |
Oh, they were involved. But they weren't the guys that made the game GOOD and clearly don't understand what made it good. Nojima's track record since has been at best mediocre while Hashimoto was merely a producer. And that's not even getting into Nomura who was a character designer, had next to nothing to do with its narrative, and has spent the entirety of his career spiraling into self-parody. The guys were involved, but even if they contributed something of value to the game they're washed up at this point along with SE's entire crop of dev talent. 2015 SE is not 1997; this is not going to be a return to form and is in fact an admission of Square giving up on ever surpassing a game that came out nearly twenty years ago. |
Yeah Nojima is the only one you mentioned that had a big part in VII,
the director and co writer was Kitase, the main producer was Sakaguichi, the artist Yusuke Naora, the writers Nojima and Kitase, and Uematsu for the music.
Although it does look like Kitase is involved as a producer at least.
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NearEasternerJ1
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 3:25 pm
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Kougeru wrote: | They already have plenty of re-arranged versions to work with. As long as it's the same overall songs, it should be fine. Having a completely different soundtrack however, will destroy the mood of the game. |
No it won't. Changing the gameplay will destroy the feeling of the game.
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belvadeer
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 4:18 pm
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Themaster20000 wrote: | I would argue that X-2 had a terrible soundtrack.And I thought XIII had a bland soundtrack. |
X-2 admittedly had "different" music and it wasn't composed by the usual folks, but there were some enjoyable tracks here and there. As for XIII, if you mean the first game, it definitely had great tunes and its soundtrack seems to be one of the few things gamers don't bash on regarding it. I think the only buzzkill would be Crazy Chocobo, since it was hilariously out of place in XIII-2. I know metal is awesome in doses, but it could have done without the lyrics honestly. XD
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Shadowrun20XX
Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 1936
Location: Vegas
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 11:21 pm
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Got me wanting to play X-2 again. I wonder will Sony still be a thing when this FF7 remake happens. They still haven't delivered their last game from their PS2 era.
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Yerld
Joined: 31 Jul 2012
Posts: 60
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Posted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 11:25 pm
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AiddonValentine wrote: | But they weren't the guys that made the game GOOD and clearly don't understand what made it good. Nojima's track record since has been at best mediocre while Hashimoto was merely a producer. And that's not even getting into Nomura who was a character designer, had next to nothing to do with its narrative, and has spent the entirety of his career spiraling into self-parody. The guys were involved, but even if they contributed something of value to the game they're washed up at this point along with SE's entire crop of dev talent. 2015 SE is not 1997; this is not going to be a return to form and is in fact an admission of Square giving up on ever surpassing a game that came out nearly twenty years ago. |
That's applicable to most of the industry, including the stars of the past. So many people were untouchable before a fall somewhere along the way.
It's hard to believe that no new talent exists within the ranks (i.e. geniuses born in the 1960s, everyone who came after being uninspired, incompetent hacks). More likely, there are people who hit their creative peak long ago and have never ceded creative control since. At the end of the day, they're corporate salarymen who aren't just going to step aside.
Even in anime, there are new stars who come along, and we see both directors and writers peak at certain points in their careers before a new wave of talent emerges.
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tsundereikemen
Joined: 27 Feb 2015
Posts: 57
Location: France
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 4:04 pm
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Rearrangements from AC and CC are there so I see no problem there as I quite enjoyed how they had done so to fit both works. And yes, taking off nostalgia goggles, it's not like Uematsu is the only talented composer SE ever had. Some fanboys/girls love to complain about the later FF games coz "they're not FFVII" (or whichever first FF they ever played and liked) anyway lol
Let's just face it, things change. If you've had enough, there's always the idea to just step away from the franchise instead of crying over and over that isn't what it used to be.
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AiddonValentine
Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 2309
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 5:50 pm
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Yerld wrote: |
It's hard to believe that no new talent exists within the ranks (i.e. geniuses born in the 1960s, everyone who came after being uninspired, incompetent hacks). More likely, there are people who hit their creative peak long ago and have never ceded creative control since. At the end of the day, they're corporate salarymen who aren't just going to step aside.
Even in anime, there are new stars who come along, and we see both directors and writers peak at certain points in their careers before a new wave of talent emerges. |
That's arguably the BIGGEST reason Square started to implode quality-wise: none of the guys in charge have an eye for talent. After Matsuno left with FFXII making him nearly undergo a nervous breakdown they kept bleeding talent. It didn't help that they then tried to prop up talentless hacks like Motomu Toriyama as some kind of visionary despite anything he touched becoming awful (as well as his bad track record with handling criticism). So far the best thing Square has released in the past few years is Bravely Default, and even then Nintendo had to release the game overseas for them. The company is not in a quality phase and it's gonna be awhile before they even begin to recover.
tsundereikemen wrote: | Rearrangements from AC and CC are there so I see no problem there as I quite enjoyed how they had done so to fit both works. And yes, taking off nostalgia goggles, it's not like Uematsu is the only talented composer SE ever had. Some fanboys/girls love to complain about the later FF games coz "they're not FFVII" (or whichever first FF they ever played and liked) anyway lol
Let's just face it, things change. If you've had enough, there's always the idea to just step away from the franchise instead of crying over and over that isn't what it used to be. |
Ah yes, this classic, last-resort argument. Yes, we're all aware that SE had more talented composers (who then eventually went freelance) like Yasunori Mitsuda, Hitoshi Sakimoto, and Yoko Shimomura. However, that's not the point. Fact of the matter is that this is clearly a sign that anyone who made the game good on any level isn't involved. Not a confident start.
And that's before we get into the "time change" argument. If FFVII were really affected by time, people wouldn't still be playing it and others wouldn't keep discovering it to find out what the fuss was about. VII is probably the best-aged entry alongside VI and IV due to its mechanics holding up and its narrative being influential for a REASON. And like I said before, there's also the big, glowing elephant in the room: that remaking VII is an admission that Square has given up on ever surpassing it. For all of ex-Pres Yoichi Wada's faults, he had the right idea by banning an FFVII remake until they finally found a game that surpassed it. And it hasn't come in nearly twenty years. This is Square admitting that they've given up any ambition and that they're just going to rely on pale imitations of past glories. Not a good place for creators to be.
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Yerld
Joined: 31 Jul 2012
Posts: 60
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 7:37 pm
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AiddonValentine wrote: |
That's arguably the BIGGEST reason Square started to implode quality-wise: none of the guys in charge have an eye for talent. After Matsuno left with FFXII making him nearly undergo a nervous breakdown they kept bleeding talent. It didn't help that they then tried to prop up talentless hacks like Motomu Toriyama as some kind of visionary despite anything he touched becoming awful (as well as his bad track record with handling criticism) |
That's corporate politics. It isn't an inability to rear young talent (in fact, it's actively discouraged at the large companies to some degree; you don't want anyone to take your place, whether you're a business exec, game producer, or senior artist) but rather an emphasis on protecting one's place in the system. What happens is that each wing breaks down into fiefdoms with allies propping each other up to maintain that hierarchy. Ultimately, your best allies aren't the young hire who may be great creators if given the chance but rather the people whom you'd expect to be most loyal to you.
A turnaround like FFXIV 2.0 only came about because a long-standing dynasty was turfed overnight, ending a 20+ year run. Some unknown capitalized and led the company to its greatest accomplishment in years.
As I said though, it's a problem across the entire Japanese game industry. There's an uncomfortable discord between expectations of seniority-based advancement and the reality that there's actually little security for anyone regardless of what they accomplished in the past. Basically, ranking is seniority-based until it's determined that you're no longer needed, so you do everything you can to stay in place.
The anime industry can avoid a lot of this because of its looser structure (with most talents working independently and not as life-long employees in a rigid hierarchy).
Edit: Those who are most skilled and passionate about making games are undoubtedly concentrated at the large development studios. However, most will never get a chance to shine, unless the senior layers step aside, which never happens by choice.
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jr240483
Joined: 24 Dec 2005
Posts: 4427
Location: New York City,New York,USA
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Posted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:55 am
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