Forum - View topicHey, Answerman! [2007-09-07]
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duo05001
 Posts: 18 |
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On the topic of American cartoons and anime I personally prefer watching American cartoon comedies such as The Simpsons, Family Guy, South Park and others like those over watching Japanese comedies. I mainly prefer it that way because I understand the jokes in the American shows better and I can relate to them a lot more. Family Guy, South Park and obviously the Simpsons are commentary on American culture and that’s why I can relate to them more and Japanese anime comedies are about Japanese culture which I don’t have a great deal of experience with myself so I would not be able to pick up on those punch lines and jokes.
When it comes to action shows however I find Japanese shows more engaging in that is due to the aesthetic, the story and it helps that they seem to be targeting an older audience. Yes there once was a time when there was good American action animation to but that is a time long forgotten like the X-Men, Spiderman, and Batman. Shows like that are no longer offered on American television so I have to go to a new outlet Japanese animation like Bleach, Fullmetal Alchemist, Full Metal Panic and other such shows. So for me personally I enjoy American comedies and Japanese action. I also agree with what answer man said about having variety and not having everything look the same because then it just becomes boring. |
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Mohawk52
 Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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I understand the premise that an author should only publish his own creation. But on publishing fanfiction for profit, isn't Japanese doujinshi the same thing? If the originators don't mind it there, why would they mind elsewhere?
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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What's wrong with that, though? He's basically saying "Yeah, write whatever the hell you want, but I'm not going to read all of that and I'm sure as hell not going to force myself to stick to whatever wacky crap you came up with when I decide to make another movie". Every time this subject comes up we always get a couple of fanfic writers who come in and say "Yeah it's mostly crap but it's not ALL bad!". I kinda question the value of saying that; if 99 percent of something is bad, are you trying to convince people that digging through mountains of garbage to find that 1 percent of it that doesn't suck is somehow a worthwhile endeavor? Whenever anyone tries to convince me that some fanfic is worth reading, I usually say "I'm sure it is" and then move on. I'm just not interested in reading something set in an established franchise that isn't written by either the original creator or someone officially sanctioned by the original creator. If it's just meaningless hypotheticals that have no impact on the real story, why should I care? Furthermore, there have been a few cases where some fanfiction writer will say "Oh it's not all crap, here read this!" and they'll link me to someone's magnum opus and frankly for anyone to call what I read "good" they must be so addled by reading fantasy and sci-fi falderal by hacks like Mercedes Lackey or Laurell K. Hamilton that they just don't know what good writing is anymore. It's great to have a hobby, don't get me wrong, but I don't get the evangelical "wait no some of it is really good!!" thing. |
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irishninja
 Posts: 344 Location: Seattle-ish |
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Well, I can't argue that point with you. I just feel it's poor etiquette to approve of something and then contradict it. And honestly, at the end of the day it was just my hate of George Lucas leaking out. 
I completely agree. I'm not trying to defend fanfic, which I dislike. I was trying to express the differences between fanfic and licensed fic.
I agree, although I've also read some licensed stuff that is pretty awful. 
And in the interest of full disclosure, I work for a company that used to do licensed work for another company, and the level of jerking around we received has sullied my view of licensers in general. So any level of hostility I express toward licensing companies is painted by my bias. 
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Anime_Freak
 Posts: 420 Location: Oklahoma |
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Pardon my "dumbness" but what on earth is a "moe" anime? I have never heard of this term til today.
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Neverwhere
 Posts: 351 Location: socal |
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Really? o.O And yet you're obviously a regular here at ANN...*amused* For such a simple question, it has a very complicated (and varied) answer, I think I'll let someone more interested in the subject field this one...
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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Dargonxtc
 Posts: 4463 Location: Nc5xd7+ スターダストの海洋 |
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Well here is what ANN has on it. Note: Answerman is no longer being shown on the front page, I think it is a glitch. |
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Neverwhere
Posts: 351 Location: socal |
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I meant more along the lines of the vitriol and occasional insanity seen here in the forums regarding moe...
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Serenanna
Posts: 3 |
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Here we go, again. Fanfiction, is it or is it not a derivative work? Guess what? They are. Also, guess what? Derivative works have existed as long as oral storytelling tradition. Each teller tells the same story with their own twists on it till someone wrote it down, and none of them claiming to have originated the story, only their own version of it. How is fanfiction any different that writing new twists on familiar works. If I tell a story of characters I heard in another story in a continuing adventure, but put them in my own plot, is it a derivative work, or am I plagiarizing? If I tell the story for free, does it make a difference?
Copyright was a turn of the century invention. Jane Austen or Chaucer never got their work copyrighted, and the latter actually had a book that was published after his death that was a continuation written by another author. They exist in what is known as public domain, free for the people to write with. I don't see anyone in this discussion complaining about the 300+ variations out on there on The Grimms Brothers' Little Cinder Girl story, or how Alan Miller turn Dorothy, Alice, and Wendy into porn stars in his graphic erotic novel Lost Girls. Why not? It's the same thing as fanfiction, isn't it? If I write my own version of Cinderella, isn't it a derivative work of someone else's story, Disney's maybe? Why can't I come up with my own plot? Well, I could, but really, how many thing anymore are 100% original? There's only so many time someone can reinvent something until it looks the same. Copyright exists in the first place so that the author can capitalize on their work in their lifetime. They're supposed to run out about 70 years after the creator's death then the work becomes public domain, but anymore an author's families try to cash in on their family's legacy, even if their work is never as good as the original. Christopher Tolkien, last I checked, was still writing Middle-Earth books. The sons of Frank Herbert just wrote their last Dune book, which I believe was on the best seller list too. I've never heard about either of their books being as good as their father or grandfathers. How is fanfiction any different than writing something based off of public domain? Just because one copyright law that isn't enforced is still applicable. If no one's profiting off of it, what does it matter? If it's original or derivative, so what? Is all fanfiction crap? No, not to me. Why? Not because I can point specific examples of what I think is good, but because to say such a thing is same as to say anything written on the internet is crap. There, I said it, anything written on the internet is crap. That's what the basis of this argument is, isn't it? That's all fanfiction seems to be defined as, writing on the net, not counting the old fashion fanzines or anything, not anything written by professionals or from public domain. It's a convenient blanket statement to say 99% of anything is crap, but there's still that 1% that makes it all worthwhile, isn't there? 99% of all cosplay attempts look like crap, but there's still 1% that actually do know how to sew that make it look cool. I said it before, and I'll say it again, the beauty and curse of fanfiction is that anyone can write it, from ex-professor fans with actual publishing experience to 15 year olds with too much of an active imagination. It doesn't have to be fanfiction. Like many have already said by admitting to writing anything, original fiction is being published as much on the net for free as fanworks are. Is all of it good because it's original? Hell no! To think otherwise is stupidity. What makes something have actual literary value? The paper it's printed on? The words it uses? The story it tells? Maybe how much money is makes on the best seller list? Is being original or published really worth that much to be taken seriously, or is it just elitism to keep people from just writing because they want to about what they want to? Really, this question has been burning my mind lately, and I would really like an answer to. |
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Dargonxtc
Posts: 4463 Location: Nc5xd7+ スターダストの海洋 |
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Oh I know, believe me! 
I was just trying to give the most simple, objective definition I could(or available...). |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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I'm going to go ahead and suggest that the only reason you're asking any of these questions is because you're not a published professional author, otherwise the distinction between amateur self-published work and professional work would be obvious to you. The distinction, I think, is upsetting to you because you want to be taken as seriously as a professional author; you want people to look at your fanfiction the same way they look at Timothy Zahn's officially licensed Star Wars novels because you don't want to feel like your work is inferior. But the truth of the matter is, we have a publishing industry filled with people who know quality when they see it and are willing to elevate someone from unpublished amateur to published professional, and that's how the system works. If your book is hardbound, printed professionally and placed on a shelf for $17.95, it's because someone in a position of authority to put it there did so. And that's how it works. That's how you get taken seriously as a professional author. It's based on a number of things, and it might not be a totally fair system, but it doesn't have to be. You don't deserve to be taken seriously as a writer; it's something you have to earn, and being picked up by a legitimate publisher is one way to do that. Dumping out some anime fanfiction does not make you an author any more than scribbling on a napkin makes you an artist. These are professions, things people do for a living. You can't erase the line between amateur and professional just because you don't like being called an amateur. You're also making the serious mistake of comparing today's 400-page internet harry potter yaoi epics to something like Alan Moore's Lost Girls or Christopher Tolkien's Middle Earth books; they're not the same thing, not at all. One has no clout, no backing, nothing to suggest it might have some quality to it. The other has a name, an established presence, the backing of a publisher. They passed the test, they got it published. If Alan Moore rewrites Cinderella and you do the same thing, I'm going to assume Alan Moore's version is better. Why? He's proven himself to be an amazing writer, someone whose genius has captured the attention of millions, including his publishers at DC Comics. He put the effort in to get his work published, he took it seriously enough to be successful. A fanfiction writer is just someone who's self-publishing her own stories on Livejournal or whatever; why do they deserve to be on the same playing field as Moore, simply because they believe they're doing the same thing he is? I'd argue he's operating at a different level than an amateur and his success proves that. I paint in my spare time. I'm not an artist, I just paint in my spare time. I don't scan them in and post them all over the internet and then say "I'm the same as Picasso because hey we're both doing the same thing and who's to say what's worth your time and money and what isn't". I recognize that Picasso was a master and a professional and I am not. I don't put the effort in to become a successful, serious artist; I make no real attempt to have my paintings shown in a gallery. Therein lies the difference. Nobody's telling you you can't write whatever the hell you want all day long, but when you ask to be taken seriously or respected the same as a professional author, that's when you're crossing the line. Yes, you can write your own version of Cinderella. No, I'm not interested in reading it. If Alan Moore does it, then yes, I am interested. That's the long and short of it. |
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Unholy_Nny
 Posts: 622 |
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Wiki knows all. |
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Cephus
 Posts: 139 Location: Redlands, CA |
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Which is a good thing. Instead of trying to cash in on a current fad, they actually just had good animation and good stories and made it on their own merits.
Most American cartoons are complete crap. Look at half the crap on Cartoon Network, who told these idiots they could draw? My DOG could do a better job! |
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Cephus
Posts: 139 Location: Redlands, CA |
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Those are licensed and authorized stories written by professional authors, I have no problem with them. Of course, the vast majority of people who write those also have a wide range of their own original books on the shelves, it's very rare to ever find someone who only does licensed work. Most fanfic is just so pathetically Mary-Sue masturbation fare that it's unreadable. Take a run by fanfiction.net and read some of that crap sometime. It'll make your head explode. |
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