Forum - View topicREVIEW: Tenchi Muyo! War on Geminar BD+DVD
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penguintruth
 Posts: 8501 Location: Penguinopolis |
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Actually, OVA 3 had plenty of time, it just wasted it. An episode about Tenchi getting sick? Two episodes centered around Mihoshi's brother? How many scenes of Tenchi carrot farming were necessary?
Tenchi's fight with Z was shorter than his fight with Kagato! Sasami saw more action! |
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getchman
 He started itPosts: 9134 Location: New Hampshire |
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I thought Sasami actually fighting was the best part
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penguintruth
Posts: 8501 Location: Penguinopolis |
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I thought it was nonsense. Since when can Sasami fight? Why did she not fight before now?
And where was Yosho during all this? |
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CCharmanderK
Posts: 218 |
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A nice, respectable review. I can understand a lot of your misgivings about this series, but I think that, as far as merely supplementary content for the Tenchi Muyo! franchise goes, it works well. I'd personally give it a B-average. It's an overall entertaining show with a lot to love (but as you said, also a lot to hate). It REALLY does depend on what floats your boat.
At least you didn't make any ignorant attempts at what I can only guess in a best-case-scenario are humor like the last guy who reviewed this show ("these terms must be important because they're all capitalized"). Carl can really go overboard with some of his jabs to the point where it just becomes offensive. <_< |
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CrownKlown
 Posts: 1762 |
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Tenchi ova is the main storyline from which all else flows, and it gets 7 eps and two spinoffs get a combined 52. Trust me it would be different. With 26 eps the Tenchi being sick would come off as just a slice of life eps in the series, they could throw in at least one or two episodes focusing on each girl, and they could draw out the Z plot. I mean the episodes you questioned did have a point, the episode about Mihoshi's brother was subtly alluding to the fact that Mihoshi was not always as she appears now, if you know more about it there are hints she was or almost raped by a previous love interest and was mentally broke because of it. Well I hate to break it to you girls and boys but that is not the kind of thing that does well, sure in Geminar they arguably have a guy getting raped by a bunch of women but it was off screen, and ultimately there is a double standard. So the episode was a roundabout way to hint at Mihoshi's past. Look Tenchi OVA the original is my favorite, but more than a handful of the episodes are not that great, namely the one about Ryoko's father, the one about the girl's taking care of the cousin, and so on. I like Tenchi, its my favorite, but I can also look past the coating and see that there is little difference between the OVA 1/2, OVA 3, Geminar and even GXP. They all have the same fundamental elements. If you don't want to give anything new a chance, then so be it. |
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Fronzel
Posts: 1906 |
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But it didn't have 26 episode, it had seven and there's no good reason they were unable to deal with that. You can do lots of stuff in seven episodes and it just squanders the time instead. All together the Tenchi OVAs have 20 episodes, 2 or 3 of them double-length and it doesn't amount to much after all that running time. |
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Key
Moderator
 Posts: 18454 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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Fully agreed. But this thread is about War on Geminar, not the earlier OVAs, so let's stay topical. |
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digritz
 Posts: 35 |
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I think anime where the protagonist trains, improves, trains, improves over and over again has been done to death. Yes it can still be fun to watch if paced right. But lets face it (BLEACH), at times it seems they are beating a dead horse.
Kenshi is bad ass right from the start. No extra training required. Very similar to the the plot of Heroic Age. The protagonist Age changes into Bellcross a Nodos that needs no training to destroy entire worlds. One of my favs for that reason. But I guess it depends on what other anime you compare it to. Last edited by digritz on Wed May 29, 2013 7:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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getchman
He started it Posts: 9134 Location: New Hampshire |
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it also helps that his entire environment has been nerfed which easily allows him to show just how badass he can be
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Spastic Minnow
Bargain Hunter Exempt from Grammar Rules  Posts: 4630 Location: Gainesville, FL |
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I consider War on Geminar the most solid story coming from Masaki Kajishima's Tenchi Muyo OVA continuity since the original first two installments. Basically I find it funny when it's supposed to be funny and exciting when it's supposed to be exciting.
It features many of the strengths of the franchise and improves some of it but honestly keeps some of its faults. One of it's biggest faults may be that it, like just about every project Kajishima has produced, tells an adventure that seems like a part of a larger wide ranging story that will likely never be resolved. The most egregious example of a plot point never resolved and most mysterious aspect of the series happens to be the very first lines of the series, enigmatically delivered by unclear speakers. One speaker seems to the original series' Washu, the other, is presumably one of her [continuity spoiler] multi-dimensional goddess “sisters” Tsunami (who may be fully merged with Sasami at this point) or Tokimi. All we know is that “they” feel it is necessary to send the main character of this show, Kenshi, to this alternate world for unknown reasons. Kenshi is a half brother to Tenchi who may also have some Geminar-related origins,brought up by Tenchi and a group described in their universe as being one of the most powerful forces in their Galaxy. Goddesses, royalty, the offspring of both, wielders of cosmic powers and owners of some of the most powerful (occasionally sentient) spaceships and scientific knowledge known to anyone. Because of this upbringing, some inherited abilities that may come from both worlds, and maybe even a little enhancement from Washu it is no wonder that he has a bodily strength that can perform super-human feats and a breadth of knowledge that spans sword-fighting, domestic chores, traditional skills (like flower-arranging), and a solid knowledge of both academics and an appreciation of nature. These aspects are not exactly necessary knowledge to enjoy the show but it informs his abilities and attitudes greatly. The original Japanese title of the show translates as something like “Tale of a Sacred Knight in an Alternate World” so criticisms of the title referring to a war that doesn't technically start until the second half are only partially valid, as it is a title only adopted for the English language in order to avoid a lengthy and clumsy title (Especially since they wanted to add “Tenchi Muyo:” to the show's title. And since political schemes and plans of a coup d'etat start from the beginning, it isn't a horrible name. The very first episode does in fact describe what is coming as a war. True, the structure of the series could be better, the plot could have included more aspects of the second half in the first half but I do hold that the two halves serve their purposes well. The first half is meant to be funny, it is supposed to slowly and humorously present Kenshi's tremendous abilities and in my opinion it succeeds at this greatly. His innate innocence and cute animal nature is core to the series, you can't have him personally kicking enemy ass so early. And I repeat, it is funny. Escapes from his admirers and from the Dark Elf guards alike are fun and show his skills, the massage exploits are naughty and wonderfully exaggerated. The whole section effectively presents the shows likable cast at its most enjoyable. I also want to mention something here that can seen as both a defense and a criticism. The description of the show as a “harem show” keeps being thrown around... but it's a lazy criticism. The thing is, it's not really a very good example of a harem! It spends almost no time focusing on the girls spending exclusive time with him, and though he comes to be universally liked by all the girls, there is almost zero genuine romantic content. The main girls are genuinely friends with him. There may be some attraction but other than the mindless horde of Kenshi-chasers and the couple teases in the cast the only girls that show actual romantic attraction are Aura (not that she ever really throws himself at him- she's just the only main cast girl who has gotten into a typically vulnerable harem situation), Yukine (for whom *GASP* Kenshi shows mutual physical attraction) and, if you want to count her, Lapis (the bullied girl whose handkerchief he retrieved). No one else, not Lashara, not Chiaia, show real interest more than increased respect. This is not GXP, no one falls instantly in love for little reason and there is certainly not anyone the likes of Ryoko and Aeka in this cast. There may be a central male and a bevy of beauties but it really is devoid of typical harem relationships. It 's more of a sexy ensemble cast than a Harem of potential lovers fighting for the affection or even exclusive attention of the boy. And the claim that Kenshi is a standard romantic milquetoast is unfair. Kenshi is not a nose-bleeding, stuttering, accidental boob-groping milquetoast. He is appropriately embarrassed by situations he should be embarrassed with but he's also the type that can save a scantily clad Aura (in her weak period) without turning red and fainting, he participates seriously and mostly unashamedly in that funny pillow fight and sash stealing contest. For the most part, his actions are actually logical and innocently endearing, never pathetic and frustrating. The second half is usually conversely serious. I find Kenshi's serious turn when he gets into a Mech during the attack on the school to be particularly thrilling. Slithering around the stadium set-up as he destroys his multiple adversaries is a ruthless display of his abilities. And while the show consciously avoids showing much violence and death, the implication is clear that the battles are serious. Although the students are saved the initial attack is not free of casualties, guards all around are ambushed and killed in the early attack. Both the Meteor Fall battle and the rescue of Ceres and Hazuki feature our heroes taking out bad guys, relatively important ones, who do not come back. It may not be a full-on war story (it's not meant to be one) but it effectively ups the seriousness of combat more than any of the other Tenchi shows, whose only deaths are of those of the evilest of villains (and even they are often given mercy through rewritings of reality or more noble clone variations). I find the actual plot of this adventure to be adequate and interesting, the back history used, spoiler[Mecha used to battle as proxies in a society that had otherwise done away with war] has been used in other stories but I find the concept that this was practically ancient history to be an interesting one. Has that specific set-up been used before? Yes... mainly by Kajishima himself and it is obviously a story he wants to explore, mecha technology being excavated to be used in “the present” is something seen in both Dual Parallel Trouble Adventure (And apparently Geminar's story was originally conceived around the same time as Dual) and in Tenchi GXP (which basically used the same mecha design as Dual). If you take all of Kajishima's works as a whole you see that they may all come together in a larger construction. Character development does suffer a bit from the same problem of other Tenchi shows though. They are always written as if much more will be coming. These characters can't fall in love and chose someone, they can't completely deal with their dark pasts or prejudices... because that will presumably come later. I do think these characters make some good moves forward though. Lashara addresses some of the problems she has with being burdened with such responsibilities at a young age, Chiala deals with being a loving childhood friend of “the enemy” and Dagmeyer's significant daddy issues and struggles with inferiority start to make headway in the story- a story that would obviously be central to a continuation if one is ever made in further animation or novels. Kenshi's unquestioned dominance is actually pretty important to that story as well. As for the artistry, I can agree that it isn't extremely innovative but I'd still rate the execution highly. It does something many shows of the day do not do. It doesn't skimp badly on one aspect of its artistry in order to make another stand out. The show is uniformly polished to a decent degree which makes none of it absolutely daring but plenty of it more impressive than the standard. Other than the show's distinctive character designs I'm confused that the backgrounds do not get more attention. This is not a show set in a stagnant location. Even when they spend the majority of the time in a school they never just stick the characters in the same classrooms and offices. Locales change constantly and while they're never fantasy setting of grand scale they are consistently varied. Buildings have unique designs and architecture, at least three uniquely different forests are featured and they also move from plains to canyons, to caves and pits. Character animation stays at a relatively high quality as well, they gesture, they move with distinct body language, fights are smooth, expressions are expressive. I personally barely notice CGI, I think it's integrated well. The ships and mecha may get some aid when flying through the sky but they still look largely like cel drawings- not shiny pixelated messes that jar with the rest of the show. I like the look. The only part I remember being slightly overdone in its reuse of CGI battle footage were the scenes with the battle-train (or whatever they called it). So, while it is difficult to give the show rave reviews for artistry- I also find it hard to criticize. Other things can be inferred to be significant by the relationship the show shares with the parent series (and other Kajishima shows) that never get fully expounded on. --If you only watch this series you can see Kenshi's relationship to the Koros and his fascination with crystals and his personal collection of them to be humorous, and its fine like that, but it's not too much of a jump of logic to see the crystals (gems) and cute little animals to be related to Ry-ohki and Washu's habit of spreading power-giving gems to her “children” and just about anything she works on. And maybe it makes some sense to complain that Kenshi is an idiot for collecting these crystals at the possible peril of the ship but I don't see this as a coincidental quirk. It's remarked repeatedly that he is often animal-like and instinctual so If I were to make informed guess I'd say Kenshi is himself connected to Ryo-Ohki somehow and the crystals are a key component to sending Kenshi back “home” or for further travel between worlds. -If Kenshi really is some combination of various powers, this may be an aspect of the obsession of the three Goddess sisters in Tenchi. As explained in the third OVA they are searching for the secret of how there could be a being stronger than they. -A couple times during the show it is implied that the otaku-like traditions and costumes were the result of someone traveling there from another world. In this case I don't think they've made any overt explanation of who this otherworldly (and time-traveling) visitor could be... but I have my worries. There is a pervert and possible-otaku featured in the franchise, and OVA3 even made a point to remind of us of him and that he “moved to Tokyo”... but damn... I'm really hoping the cause of their messed up civilization was not a visit from Kazuhiko Amagasaki- I did not like that character. -Multiple characters in Geminar share names with characters in Photon: The Idiot Adventures and at least one resembles someone from Dual. If this has any meaning other than a tribute to his more forgotten shows, I do not know. Lashara Earth is a combination of the characters, Photon Earth and Lashara Moon. The Nanadan family (Maria and Flora) are named after the comical villain of the show, Sir Papacharino Nanadan. Lithia Po Cheena may be a reference to the Pochis characters, although it is the headmistress that has a passing resemblance to them. Doll shares a strong resemblance to D, the “Bio-roid” in Dual. It could also be said that Kenshi himself has a similar role to Photon. Photon is a much bigger idiot and even more overpowered than Kenshi though. Over all I'd probably give the show straight "A-" grades, although I haven't made it through the dub and don't pay much mind to the music. Last edited by Spastic Minnow on Thu May 30, 2013 9:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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getchman
He started it Posts: 9134 Location: New Hampshire |
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massive wall of text, but I agree with everything you posted. well said
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Spastic Minnow
Bargain Hunter Exempt from Grammar Rules Posts: 4630 Location: Gainesville, FL |
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I haven't been posting much lately, so I guess you could say I was saving up.
And since I haven't found any of the reviews on ANN representing my thoughts on the series very well I figured I'd better get as much as I could. |
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Key
Moderator
Posts: 18454 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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It's still the title that was chosen for the English release, though, so the criticism is perfectly valid. Whether or not the English title is close to the original Japanese title is irrelevant.
You're forgetting Mexiah and Maria's mother (who is quite explicit about wanting to marry Kenshi) as characters with clear romantic interest. That's plenty enough to warrant the harem classification, and your statement that I underlined is just flat-out wrong, as he has several scenes of alone time with several of the girls in situations were one-sided or two-sided attraction is evident. Sorry, but you can't even argue that this is a weak or atypical harem set-up. Now, whether or not you take that as inherently a negative point is another story.
Yeah, I just totally forgot to mention this.
You're certainly welcome to your own opinion on this, but frankly, I don't think your comments match to that grade. |
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Spastic Minnow
Bargain Hunter Exempt from Grammar Rules Posts: 4630 Location: Gainesville, FL |
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I count Mexiah and Flora as "the couple teases." I never take such "horny teacher/ MILF" characters seriously- they are embarrassing characters doing embarrassing things. The problem with any "alone time" a girl spends with Kenshi is that it rarely goes anywhere other than respect and friendship. Chiaia goes from wanting to kill him to acceptance. Even her making the red cord meant little more than acknowledging that she hurt him and wanting to make up. I find the big scene with Lashara at the end to speak great amounts about her general fear of abandonment but not much about her fear of losing Kenshi specifically. Harem shows really are a pretty regimented group, take any "great" harem, Tenchi, Love Hina, Clannad, Shuffle, Hayate, etc. and you get the same thing, the hero spending an episode (Or a section of an episode) with each girl, bonding exclusively with that girl. They get "forced" on a date, get stuck in small building alone in a rain storm, have to find something they've lost, etc. There is very little like that in this show. But I'm not categorically saying that it isn't a harem, just that it isn't a very good example of one. It may be a typical harem set-up, but it is not played out like one and the funny little super-harem ending of the show (Everyone wants to marry/own Kenshi) is IMO very forced. There's also the problem that as far as you can tell Kenshi doesn't see or treat any of these girls (with the possible exception of Yukine) anything differently than any of his "sisters" back home. Just compare it to GXP. Seina likes all four of the girls at the end of the show and each of them categorically like him for whatever reason they have. Kenshi blushes a little when he thinks of Yukine but runs away, figuratively and literally, from everyone at the end. It's not even a case of "I don't know if I like her or her or more- so I can't chose" it's a case of -"screw this, I'm outta here"
Well, being defensive rarely comes off as being convincing. If I were to write a sidebar summary of my feelings of the show it would be something like: Informed by the past, Geminar still takes it's own path. Although the structure could be better the shows succeeds with a likable group of protagonists and some relatable villains at being funny when it needs to be, fun and a sexy without relying so regimentally on the set rules of harem anime, and showcasing an action storyline more serious than any other Tenchi property without ever getting gritty, dark or overtly violent. |
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Key
Moderator
Posts: 18454 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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Whether you take them seriously or not is irrelevant. They still count.
Doesn't matter if it's forced or not; it still counts. Now, if you want to say that it's not a good harem, I might agree with that, but to say it's not a good example of one is silly. The main issue separating us here seems to be that you require the presence of very specific, formulaic elements to call something a proper harem series, and I don't. (And for the record, a male lead only actually being romantically interested in one girl, and treating the rest as just friends or like sisters, is pretty common in harem series.)
What was "being defensive" about indicating that I thought that your comments reflected too many issues with the series to justify only dropping it to an A- grade? |
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