Forum - View topic4Kids: Their reason?
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DemonDragonJ
 Posts: 116 Location: Somewhere in the United States |
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It seems to me that not many people here are fond of 4Kids. The reasons that have been given for this dislike are:
1. 4Kids cuts and edits the anime series that they license. 2. The English voice actors in series licensed by 4Kids do not do a good job when compared with the English voice actors in series licensed by other companies. 3. 4Kids alters both the names of characters as well as some of the dialog in the series that they license. 4. They create new opening and ending theme songs for the series that they license, theme songs that are almost alwyas worse than the series' original opening and ending theme songs. I myself am not fond of 4Kids, for the reasons that I have listed here, but I am wondering; what logic does 4Kids use when they license a series? Surely, they realize that the series will sell better if left uncut and unedited, with good English voice actors, so I do not at all understand why they "ruin" every series that they license. Can someone help me out here? |
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LydiaDianne
 Posts: 5634 Location: Southern California |
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This is a link to a thread about an interview with one of 4kids script writers.
animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=21842&highlight=4kids If I remember the article correctly, they remove Japanese puns and cultural references because American audiences are too stupid to understand them, the background music doesn't fit with American audiences and it's all Fox's Standards and Practices fault that they have to edit the progams so heavily. 
Last edited by LydiaDianne on Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:19 am; edited 3 times in total |
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CyberViper
Posts: 218 Location: Matsumoto, Nagano Japan |
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Well, I have not seen any series dubbed into english that has been licensed by 4kids, so I can only guess how 'bad' it is based on what other people say. However...a possible answer to your question:
4Kids = For Kids. I think when they imagine kids they imagine very young children...maybe at the best very young teenagers. They take anime that probably isn't really suitable for say, 12 year olds, and edit it so that it is. They see promise in these shows and their ability to attract multiple audiences. For example: If they leave everything in One Piece then they'll only attract older audiences, because little kids won't be 'allowed' to watch it. I'm sure they'd encounter a lot of problems airing some of that material at certain time slots on certain channels. However, if they edit out a lot of the unsuitable material it will then be suitable for all age groups. Now younger children and older children will be able to watch it. I just see them doing this to try and attract as many different audiences as possible. Why they change the names of characters? The only reason I can think of is to appeal to western taste. I'm against it, but this is the only logical reason I can think of. Why do their voice actors suck? Because they don't want to pay more money for better ones? Because they don't want to put too much time into fixing minor errors? I really don't understand their logic for this either. Changing theme songs could only be because they want to make it more westernized or more suitable for children. Lastly, perhaps the only reason we see as this as being 'bad' is because it doesn't measure up to the original anime that aired in Japan. We see it in comparison only, however, a lot of people (especially younger kids) who are seeing this on TV for the first time have nothing to compare it to. To them it's just 'x' show, not 'good x' or 'bad x'. At first I guessed that Naruto was done by 4Kids, but said I wasn't really sure...I got rid of that now. Oops, my bad....(see I really don't watch dubbed anime.) Last edited by CyberViper on Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:59 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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outlawwolf
 Posts: 645 |
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Whoa man, better change that 4Kids does naruto before the Naruto fans here come to tear you a new one. Naruto is done by Viz. If you wnat an example of 4 Kids atrocities, watch dubbed One Piece and Yu-Gi-Oh. But for someone who has never watched a dubbed 4 kids series, that was a really good explanation. The only unbiased opinion that I've ever seen that hasn't consisted of "OMG!!! 4KIDS SUXORZ IT RUNIED MY ONE PIECE BLAMBLAMBLAMBLAM!"
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Urb'
Posts: 54 |
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As you say.. "It seems to me that not many people here are fond of 4Kids."
Your reasons 1,3 & 4 are insignificant because the people here probably watch these shows or have seen some of these shows in there entirety or fansubbed.. There is a majority of people/kids out there who dont know any different from the series presented to them, so what difference does a cut/edit, name alteration or songs make to these people. which in my opinion is alot more than those who visit anime websites or spend loads of money collecting the boxsets.. wether from online/shop or imported.. if you ask someone who is ignorant to anything outside 4Kids or whats shown on TV, and they will not give you those reasons, but they will enjoy the series no less than you if you so happen to see it uncut.. |
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LydiaDianne
Posts: 5634 Location: Southern California |
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Excellent point. We don't like 4kids because We know where and what to look for outside the "Fox Box"  . So we know that there are better and uncut versions out there.
The little kids who don't have the internet access like We do, don't know that it is edited and probably think that what they see it just so cool  .
What Zalis says below, I also agree with. Last edited by LydiaDianne on Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:39 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Zalis116
Moderator
 Posts: 6897 Location: Kazune City |
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It's pretty simple--they don't cater to the hardcore anime fans, they cater to mass audiences of young kids and their parents who don't want their kids seeing objectionable content. They know that they can make more money producing edited, kid-friendly TV shows than they can by making faithful dubs and uncut DVDs for the types of anime that they acquire. It's unfortunate, but that's economic reality for you. The "butchering" of One Piece, etc. is another sad fact, but on some level, I don't blame them for it.
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Bleach12
Posts: 13 |
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so that means they are not going to show origianl formated anime anymore
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LydiaDianne
Posts: 5634 Location: Southern California |
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I'm not a watcher of One Piece but I don't think an unedited version has been seen on TV here in the States. Fansubs maybe, but not on TV. I could be wrong so if I am someone will correct me in my assumtions. |
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Cetus-kun
 Posts: 139 |
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It wouldn't be as much of a problem if they didn't make so many unnecessary cuts and edits. What purpose does it serve to do things like replace every instance of the word Marine with Navy and to remove English text off character’s shirts? So far they’ve managed to merge and/or skip over thirty episodes. If they did what Viz did with Naruto and only edited what they had to they would have attracted the older audience while at the same time not making it too rough for the younger kids (they probably should have had it air on CN from the start). And for the people who still aren't satisfied Viz is relasing uncut subtitled boxsets. The way things look now One Piece has little hope of getting those.
Even if they didn't hire better voice actors it would be an improvement if they could get them to not sound like they were reading their lines. That's one thing I can't stand about their dubs. Btw I don't think all of their voice actors are bad. Personally I like Zoro's dub voice actor. It's probably more the fault of the people doing the voice direction and script writing than anyone else.
Didn't the president of Funimation once admit the only reason they did this prior to when they became a better anime company was because they got royalties whenever their stuff was played? Because I don't think music played off a synthesizer appeals anymore to western audiences more than the original stuff (in One Piece's case the original music doesn't even sound very Japanese). Many of their dubs recycle music from their other shows too.
Not everyone has easy access to the fansubs, myself included. Because of my slow Internet connection I've only been able to see minimal amounts of the original version. But I do really enjoy the manga and exposure to the dub has hurt my enjoyment of it. Whenever I'm reading the manga I have a tendency to associate the characters with the dub voices regardless of how hard I try not to. |
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darkhunter
 Posts: 2992 Location: Los Angelas |
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Series sells better if left uncut? Do you have any evidence to back that up? Pokemon and Yugioh sold a hell of a lot more than any other uncut anime series to be release. But let's be honest, there is no proof that unedit dvd will sell more than edit anime dvd on a consistent basis. But if an anime is shown on network TV, the chances of it selling increase ten fold. I think you are really misinform about what 4kids reallly do. They are not regular anime companies that license and distrube the series on DVD like Geneon or ADV. They license anime that are aim at children and edit them to fit the guideline of what is consider approciate for young children. The cheesy dialog and music were made specially to target these kids. Trust me kids, don't care if it's edit and such, as long as they get to watch it and enjoy it is all that matter to them. They probably not aware that the show is even anime. Once you get to a certain stage in your life where you have a better understanding, then things like uncut or good voice acting matter. One thing I don't get is why is everyone so misinform about what 4kids really is about? It's not that hard to understand. |
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Malintex Terek
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It's all about turning a profit. Since 4Kids' core demographic (7-11) isn't internet savvy, they lack the ability to compare Dub Piece to the original version; as such, there' no reason to suggest anything is wrong with the show. Of all the Japanese Anime that is popular as of 2006, One Piece looks to most western, and thus suffers from the dread "demographic-dillema"; it's a show that has a high number of dichotomous elements, namely, a child-like atmosphere, absurd villans, silly fights, ect. combined with mature themes, blood & gore, ciagarettes, alcohol, death...The "Itchy and Scratchy" shorts for The Simpsons are a parody of this connundrum. Frankly, even if kids could compare dubs, I doubt many of the 7-11 year olds would be interested in the unedited show. Many of the criticisms I have heard from elementary school kids regarding the Naruto dub is that characters primarily "stand around and talk"; the action is intense, but short and sparse, with periods of "downtime" where no music occurs. 4Kids isn't lying when they say "we know what kids like"; they understand how a child's mind works, and they fashion their shows as a key to unlock a child's interest. Older fans are disgusted by Dub Piece for the very features 4Kids uses to attract a younger audience. The sad situation is, though, that despite "hardcore" fans yearning for an uncut DVD release, the rising profile of both OP and Bobobo on Toonami are indicative of the show's appeal, making such a release less per showing; it wasn't a poor dub that turned off viewers since OP's premiere in 2004, but the slot time of FOX BOX/4Kids TV. Assuredly, we won't be seeing high ratings like during the Saban-Fox TV era, but the overall market for Saturday Morning cartoons has fallen for all respective broadcast stations, not just in the case for 4Kids. |
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