Forum - View topicWhy Doesn't Stroker and Hoop Classify as Anime?
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shirokiryuu
Posts: 714 Location: Northern California (SF Bay Area) |
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Digital Dreamer
Posts: 287 Location: Sydney, Australia |
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Look at ADV Films some time. They are doing FarScape and Andromeda just to name a few. *BTW, FarScape is actaully a very watchable show after you get passed the teething problems of the first half of season 1. I just hope that ADV never does the FarScape Cartoon which they have been talking about |
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Nagisa
Moderator
Posts: 6128 Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh |
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So, you're saying one of the criteria for a show to be anime is that it "must" have an ongoing storyline? So, you're saying that Lupin III, Gigantor, You're Under Arrest, Golden Boy, and other series that are pretty clearly anime (and even undeniable milestones of the medium, at that), aren't anime at all?
"As it was meant to be viewed?" Dude, it's just cartoons. It's not like anime are some deep, impactful manifestos on the sanctity and development of the human psyche and relative culture. They're cartoons from Japan, each one produced largely with the intent of providing a half-hour-ish of idle enjoyment every week (some including a slightly heavier theme than others, but those still being in the minority). In that way, the vast majority of anime and Stroker & Hoop are a lot alike. There is no "grasping its fullness," because most of it is meant to be taken as mindless diversion, just as Stroker & Hoop is. There's a dfferent visual style, yes, but anime isn't on some "holier than thou" pedestal above other cartoons, but merely cartoons themselves of a different national origin. |
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PantsGoblin
Subscriber
Encyclopedia Editor Posts: 2969 Location: L.A. |
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Ok, I'm just going to get to the point since arguing your incorrect logic doesn't really matter to me. I thought I already made it clear but... WHETHER AN ANIMATION IS AN ANIME OR NOT IS NOT A MATTER OF OPINION. Yes, it is a fact whether or not an animation is an anime, with the fact being that it has to be made in Japan. You can describe the usual characteristics of anime but the characteristics alone do not make it one. Here's ANN's lexicon definition of anime. It specifically refers to anime being "animation of Japanese origins". So, no more opinions on what makes something an anime or not, ok? You can't argue a fact. |
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Tetsujin
Posts: 216 |
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Ask any native Japanese person if Stroker and Hoop qualifies as anime, and he or she will say yes-- by definition of anime used by the Japanese, any animated work is considered to be anime. From the Japanese point of view, Stroker and Hoop qualifies as anime. It seems as if the non-Japanese won't label Stroker and Hoop "anime"-- if it's good enough for the Japanese, why isn't it good enough for us? As Isaaru said much earlier in this thread:
Maybe we should refer to anime from Japan as "Japanese Anime" and use "anime" for all other animated work (from the States, India, Estonia, France, etc.). Alternately, we could reserve the unmodified word "anime" for those animates works which come from Japan and use geographical/national adjectives to describe anime from every other nation. Bottom line: Ask a Japanese person if Stroker and Hoop is anime, that person will say yes. Ask a non-Japanese person the same question, the answer will be no. Last edited by Tetsujin on Sat Jan 14, 2006 9:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Kouji
Posts: 978 |
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[quote="Tetsujin"]
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Samurai-with-glasses
Posts: 628 |
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Actually, the commonly held ground is that the definition of the literal word "anime" is different on the two sides of the Ocean, much like the word "otaku." In Japan, it is common knowledge that the Japanese use of "anime" refers to all animation. However, in the United States, and practically everywhere else in the world, the common usage of "anime" refers to Japanese animation.
There are few doubts, thus, that for a cartoon to be considered an anime outside Japan it has to be Japanese animation. The true problem, though, relies on the definition of "Japanese." What is it? The Japanese state? The Japanese people? The Japanese culture? Where does the line end? There must be a line after all! I, personally, left these questions unanswered -- some aren't meant to be definitively answered at all, and would immediately be inherently wrong if happens to be the case -- and use what they called "common sense" to differentiate anime. |
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The Frankman
Posts: 1160 Location: Binary Culture HQ |
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Because many Americans and other people around the world have latched onto the idea that Japanese anime is this world-changing style of animation not to be "cheapened" by comparing it to other forms of animation. It's all good and bad, so to 2Real, I simply type this for seemingly the 50th time here . . .
Viva la animation!!! EDIT: I remember back in 2000 when I was threatened verbally by a couple of people online because I said "Japanimation". That's when I first realized this also: "Being a Japanese anime fan is a self-defeating proposal . . ." |
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Ohoni
Posts: 3421 |
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Because words mean different things in different languages. The Japanese word "anime" has a different meaning than the American-English word "anime". They also have different meanings for "sushi", "kamikaze", and "war crimes". Countries are different.
There's already a word for "anime that isn't Japanese", it's "Animation", or occasionally "Cartoon".
It's not about that. There are plenty of American cartoons that I enjoy more than most anime, and yet they're still cartoons. Anime is anime, it's a descriptive term, and if we apply it to things that aren't anime then it no longer has a meaning.
Too long. Five sylables. Words over three sylables rarely fall into common use, we're lazy people. |
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shirokiryuu
Posts: 714 Location: Northern California (SF Bay Area) |
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Eventhough "anime" in Japan means all animation, it doesn't mean it means the same thing in the U.S.
It specifically means just "Japanese Animation" Though people may use it to refer to a style used It usually depends on how a word is used, whether it's "correct" or not. |
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shirokiryuu
Posts: 714 Location: Northern California (SF Bay Area) |
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I'm not sure if i'm interpreting you right. Wasn't J-Pop coined by a japanese music station? They're just like sub-genres i guess, because technically it's "pop" or "rock" but it's a specific language. It reminds me of sukiyaki... It's western influenced, but it's still a Japanese food. |
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Isaaru
Posts: 375 Location: the oppressed colonies in outer space |
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Nah your not. And yes your right. That's what foriegn (to japan) anime will be considered- a sub genre, but still reckonized as anime by the masses if good enough to be such. I didn't know where J pop or J rock were coined. But the point is Jrock/pop branched out from a style that was perfected/marketed/orignated elsewhere. To deny calling them pop or rock even though the musical style is there because thier foriegn style and modifications don't meet the original audience standards is just silly. And so is this silly notion that the anime art style must be exclusive to a certain skin color of people living in a certain area. Animation is a series of moving pictures constructed from the human mind. A drawn picture constructed by the human mind is art. I never heard of a person saying a fresco is not a fresco unless a European is involved. As anime becomes more popular we will see an increase in attempts (many of them bad, I will admit) by outside cultures, and we may even see some good. Who knows, we may end up reckonizing different anime style examples someday (owing to the Japanese of course) like German-anime, Spanish-anime, Afro-anime, etc. Many of you will be disgusted, many will accept. And guess what? The matching enviroment will probably influence this foriegn (to Japan) anime to be somewhat different. Sure it may be goofy and not perfectly identical to Japanese standards. But the big eyes, small mouths, speed lines, effects, crazy hair etc will be there, and non "otaku" muggles will point and say it's anime (or looks like it). I hate to put down the possible growth of anime because we cast off this unique style from an outside member of another race as a simple "cartoon" by the very community he, she, or they needs support from. So let's not be snobbish about where good anime MUST come from. (this message not specifically directed at our friend shirokiryuu, but at anyone with an open mind) |
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Isaaru
Posts: 375 Location: the oppressed colonies in outer space |
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What a crazy world we live in! |
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Isaaru
Posts: 375 Location: the oppressed colonies in outer space |
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Than I guess Eminem is not a real rapper than. And this sushi I'm eating is counterfeit (i made it). Sorry, but you totally misinterpreted what they were saying (there is a heck of a lot more to that than what you picked and chosen). Anime is a term we outsiders changed in what we call this crazy wierd cartoon style those wacky Japanese folk brought to us. Anime regardless of what race or culture pulls it off originated in Japan, because the Japanese culture was (and still remains) the supernova for that inspiration. |
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Ohoni
Posts: 3421 |
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I don't think anybody ever brought up skin color, you just have to be Japanese. I don't mean Japanese American either, I mean Japanese. It's a cultural thing, not a racial thing. I imagine that a white or black person, raised in Japan as a full Japanese (Japanese as a first language, full Japanese education, etc.) could produce true anime, just as Eminem, truly immersed in urban culture, can produce true rap. Vanilla Ice, not immersed in urban culture, but a fan of it, cannot. People not truly engaged in Japanese culture (and no, watching a lot of anime, learning Japanese, and going to a bunch of cons does not qualify you) trying to produce anime is like the typical white guys going to a suburban highschool with no actual black people and trying to be street. It clearly doesn't work. And again, IT'S NOT A MEASURE OF QUALITY. There is some EXCELENT anime-esc stuff out there, such as Boondocks and Gold Digger, but regardless of how good it might be, it's not anime, even if it's better than every anime show out there. There's also plenty of bad anime out there, such as Bobobo and Milk Chan, but no matter how bad it might be it doesn't stop being anime. "Anime" is not a qualifier word, you can't earn it through hard work and quality output, and there's no shame in a work not being called anime. Something either IS anime, or it ISN'T.
He is, your suchi isn't (I'm guessing, most sushi produced in the US isn't sushi). |
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