Forum - View topicINTEREST: Ken Akamatsu Comments on Casting POC Voice Actors in American Cartoons, Japanese Anime
|
Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 Note: this is the discussion thread for this article |
| Author | Message | ||
|---|---|---|---|
MarshalBanana
 Posts: 5417 |
|
||
|
Having more black people in the industry would only be a positive, and I'm not here to a argue otherwise. I do want to add some points to this.
Anime is cheap to dub, especially in Texas where a lot of it is done nowadays. So it seems reasonable that an aspiring black/white VA, unless they really like Anime, is going to avoid or move out of it asap. And as it seems that more black actors would go to LA rather than stay in Texas, where dubbing is not as big as it once was. While black VAs voicing black characters would be nice. What would be better is to normalise having black characters be able to play anyway as it's just a voice not a physical appearance, the only barrier being the talent to do so. Why not have a black actress voice a blonde haired, white skinned 8 year old boy with green eyes. Providing she sounds convincing in the role, the same way an actress like Mona Marshall does it won't be a problem. I bring this up as counter to just having more of them, in just to fill out a relatively small amount of black characters. |
|||
|
|||
P€|\||§_|\/|ast@
 Posts: 3498 Location: IN your nightmares |
|
||
|
|||
|
|||
|
nargun
Posts: 926 |
|
||
|
To reiterate:
a. everybody is biased b. in most cases these biases are in favour of people like them c. in most cases these biases are very small d. small uniformly-distributed biases cancel out e. because bias has an expotential effect, non-uniform biases (from say an unrepresentative group of decision-makers, see b.) will have a significant effect in complex areas: for practical purposes no matter how small the bias actually is f. because decision-makers also decide who the decision makers will be and because of point e., unrepresentative groups of decision makers don't fix themselves ("decision makers are representative" is an unstable equilibrium) The conclusion: there needs to be a framework to ensure that decision makers remain acceptably representative. Our current social setup allows us the possibility of running this framework through social norms and informal pressure, which is what people right now are arguing against. If you're opposed to social-pressure-to-ensure-representation and -- presumably -- you're against criminal sanctions to the same end, then... as I said, represdntation is dynamically unstable, "do nothing to keep it upright" means "let it fall down". Does anyone opposed to quotas of some sort or another have a better proposa l? Does anyone opposed to quotas of some sort or another even have a proposa l at all? "We should all try hard to be less racist" does not and will not work, as I've just set out at length. If you disagree rightly you'll be able to find my mistakes, but bluntly you won't be able to because there are no mistakes to find. |
|||
|
|||
strawberry_milk
 Posts: 88 |
|
||
|
Seems it also needs to be said that giving jobs to minorities isn't about taking jobs away from white people, or encouraging segregation, or is itself racism. This is about correcting an imbalance from which white people have been benefiting.
And if you think the ethnicity of voice actors doesn't matter, or this is just a symbolic gesture with no real meaning, then it logically doesn't make any difference to you that minorities get more work, so it might as well happen. |
|||
|
|||
Megiddo
 Posts: 8360 Location: IL |
|
||
|
I'm just saying, I want more Hamilton than anything. That showed just how powerful casting can be if you go beyond simply "what race is the character" when.assigning roles. Give me more of that please. Mix it up, I'm all for more diversity in acting and voice acting, but I'm not for pigeonholing and typecasting.
|
|||
|
|||
|
nargun
Posts: 926 |
|
||
Sure. The only way out is through, though: to get to where you want to be you need a plan and a route, and if you want to get to lots-more-hamilton city you need to pass through affirmative-action-ville. If you want to cross a valley you need to build a bridge. Exactly the form affirmative action takes is not vastly important: straight-out quotas are actually less disruptive in most senses (a broader impact is a softer impact), but a lot of people don't like that and "x rolls for x people" is often an easier sell. (go and read a centaur's worries, it's all about this shit) |
|||
|
|||
Narutofreak1412
 Posts: 338 |
|
||
|
I don't think it has anything to do with discrimination when a white person voices a black character. Voices for projects shouldn't be chosen after skin color but after their talents and how well the voice fits the character. There are pretty talented black voice actors in the industry too that voice white characters simply because they fit well. There was even an article here on ANN showing some of them in the american dubbing industry.
It reminds me of a certain few companies that hire women simply to fulfill a quota and show off that they support feminism rather than simply choosing the most skilled people regardless of gender and paying them the same which would be true gender equality. |
|||
|
|||
Alan45
 Village Elder Posts: 9880 Location: Virginia |
|
||
|
The vast generalizations about race in the US seen in this thread are all well and good but tend to miss some practical considerations. We are talking about dubbing anime, right? Anime in the US has always been and remains a niche industry. In any given year, there are only five to seven companies dubbing anime shows. Currently one company (Funimation) probably does more than half the dubbing. In a whole year, there are likely less than a dozen people making the casting decisions.
On the plus side, you don't have to claim the hearts and minds of the whole country, just those of a handful of people. On the negative side, is the fact that anime voice acting does not pay well enough for most people to use that as a full time job. As a consequence, it is not practical for people to travel long distances to audition or take work as a voice actor in an anime show. More diversity, would exacerbate this by spreading the same money across more people. Both Funimation and Sentai are located in Texas and draw from the limited talent pool of the metropolitan areas of that state and not from the nation as a whole. That is unlikely to change. People have complained for years that the same people are employed over and over to the point that they are tired of hearing the same voices. Getting more diversity in anime dubbing may be easier to attempt and harder to achieve than the discussion credits. |
|||
|
|||
Covnam
 Posts: 3731 |
|
||
I think that's a symptom of it's origins though. A lot of cartoons had a small stable of VAs to voice all their characters when they were starting out. Why pay for 12 people when 1 person can do the job? If you have 12 characters voiced by the same person (regardless of the characters race), you've got 11 people whose job you could say was "taken away". I think it was just that you had talented people and a desire to save money, so why even hire another VA? |
|||
|
|||
Chiibi
 Posts: 4829 |
|
||
|
I definitely feel like casting only POC to play POC characters in animation...especially anime is just a little impractical. Like others said, anime is niche as it is; are there even large groups of POC actors who want to be voice actors?
I have nothing against it of course...but from what I understand, there are only a handful of people to even choose from anyway? Or is that wrong? American animation no doubt has a bigger inventory of such people.
IT DOESN'T!? D: I didn't know this....ugh....that is depressing to read.... 
|
|||
|
|||
|
Alan45
Village Elder Posts: 9880 Location: Virginia |
|
||
|
@Chiibi
According to prior Answerman columns and other reports here on ANN, there simply isn't enough money in just Anime voice acting. I'm not suggesting that the studios don't pay fairly, but it is contract work. If they are not working on a show, they aren't being paid. Texas is a right to work state, so no unions. This is why some voice actors are such prolific guests at anime conventions. They also do other forms of voice acting such as games. Some get into the directing side of dubbing. Basically gig work. Others have full time jobs. |
|||
|
|||
|
Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
|
||
OH!! Right...that only makes sense. xD I feel better about it now...I thought you meant the companies don't pay high salaries...yeah...thanks for explaining. :3 |
|||
|
|||
|
Alan45
Village Elder Posts: 9880 Location: Virginia |
|
||
|
@Chiibi
I've no idea what they pay in a dollar amount. What constitutes high or low probably depends on your point of view.  In California where acting unions are strong, it will be higher (and alternative work is more available). In Texas, where the bulk of anime dubbing is done, it will be less as no union involvement. However, it is contract work so voice actors know what the rate is going in. What I meant is we have not heard evidence of people being cheated or working long hours unpaid.
We are a bit off topic here. |
|||
|
|||
Deven
 Posts: 2 Location: Mississauga |
|
||
Yes. ABSOLUTELY YES. We're in a era where more and more people who grew up watching anime are now looking to work in that field. A whooole lot of black people love anime and find themselves contending with a notion that black people don't like anime. With anime especially, it's not a new discussion in the professional community that black actors are often limited to only getting to try out for the black roles, while everyone else gets to audition for everything. As a direct result, black actors have had less of an opportunity to build up experience and make industry connections. Countless white, Asian and Latinx anime voice actors have been very united on this being a problem and have been trying to help resolve it. A commonly agreed-upon stance is this: Since so many in this one group were only being invited to do this one rare character type, which they often lost out on anyway to the bigger names, why don't we just let them keep it for a while AND let them try out for the many things everyone else was already getting to do? They deserve a little something back to help them get in after how they were treated for so long, and the rest of us can live without it. It wasn't fair to begin with, but as the industry evolves to be more inclusive, hopefully in time we can reach a place where everyone is getting to audition for everything. That's the ideal I'd like to see. |
|||
|
|||
 |
All times are GMT - 5 Hours |
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group