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NEWS: Kakegurui Writer Homura Kawamoto's Isekai Revenge Manga Canceled After 1 Chapter


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ThatMoonGuy



Joined: 13 Oct 2017
Posts: 364
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 12:33 pm Reply with quote
glafrun wrote:
Yea, sarcasm,parody, dark humor etc.... Don't work in Japan at all. Walking on eggshells trying any of that out there. Maybe like 5% of the population understand that type of thing, but the rest will force you out.


It's really funny to hear this when Chainsawman is, right now, one of the biggest successes in the biggest manga magazine in Japan. A magazine that has published many parodic series and is publishing one right now (me & robocco). Oh, and doujinshi are a thing, you know?

It's probably just a matter of copyright protection. Companies in Japan can be pretty protective even when works are pretty much love letters (see High-Score Girl).
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Hal14



Joined: 01 Apr 2018
Posts: 693
Location: Heart of africa
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 12:56 pm Reply with quote
Shay Guy wrote:
Quote:
The story begins when one of the people Lute admires, Louis Crawford, appears.


This was the one character from that image floating around online where I didn't get the reference. The others were mostly obvious even without the handy pictures of their counterparts underneath:



Apparently, Louis Crawford is an expy of the protagonist of Magi's grandson, Shin:
Shin Walford - God's Messenger
Louis Crawford - God's Mistake

I might not have like Magi's grandson but making an expy of Shin that is also a rapist and murderer is a bit much. And that for me is one of two main issues with this work.
1) Making edgy expys of inoffensive protagonists like Bakarina or Shijou comes across as really mean-spirited. That said, most of these expies come across like the author is envious of more popular works.

2) Isekai already get accused of being edgy, especially the revenge ones. This only stands out for how brazen it is. Not because of how edgy it gets, nor is it the first isekai to have expys of other isekai characters (E.g. Ren, Sword hero, from Shield hero is an expy of Kirito) but because of how obvious the expys are. The author clearly wanted to provoke people. They just bit off more than they could chew.


Last edited by Hal14 on Mon Jun 28, 2021 12:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Casval Rem Deikun



Joined: 24 Feb 2021
Posts: 268
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 12:57 pm Reply with quote
What a damn shame. I'm not a huge fan of isekai's at all but I really liked the idea around this.
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glafrun



Joined: 26 May 2021
Posts: 21
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:04 pm Reply with quote
mrsatan wrote:
glafrun wrote:
Yea, sarcasm, parody, dark humor etc.... Don't work in Japan at all. Walking on eggshells trying any of that out there. Maybe like 5% of the population understand that type of thing, but the rest will force you out.


(Formerly) Super sarcastic guy that once lived in Japan here that can confirm.
They took everything I said at face value and it made my life very difficult. Because I'm a big dummy on the spectrum, it took me too long to realize what I was doing to myself.

To this day, I still avoid saying sarcastic or dark humor.


Same... Have to bite my tongue all the time when I'm staying there. It's hell for me... Majority of my thought process is sarcasm.
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Ermat_46



Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 731
Location: Philippines
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:08 pm Reply with quote
Shay Guy wrote:


「ルーパー」ホンダ・ユウヤ
"Looper" Honda Yuuya (Subaru Natsuki)


I lost it at Honda.
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Animeking1108



Joined: 26 Apr 2011
Posts: 1244
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:12 pm Reply with quote
And yet Dragon Ball has an evil version of Super Sentai with the Ginyu Force, One-Punch Man's first villain was a recolored Piccolo, half the jokes in Gintama are references, and Shinji Ikari is basically Amuro Ray if he was mentally unequipped to be a mech pilot.
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KarlFranz



Joined: 17 Jun 2019
Posts: 180
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:19 pm Reply with quote
Animeking1108 wrote:
And yet Dragon Ball has an evil version of Super Sentai with the Ginyu Force, One-Punch Man's first villain was a recolored Piccolo, half the jokes in Gintama are references, and Shinji Ikari is basically Amuro Ray if he was mentally unequipped to be a mech pilot.


Because those are archetype, not full blow copy paste characters. You can't copyright an archetype.
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Sp12er



Joined: 10 Jan 2013
Posts: 12
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:24 pm Reply with quote
HAL14 wrote:
Shay Guy wrote:
Quote:
The story begins when one of the people Lute admires, Louis Crawford, appears.


This was the one character from that image floating around online where I didn't get the reference. The others were mostly obvious even without the handy pictures of their counterparts underneath:



Apparently, Louis Crawford is an expy of the protagonist of Magi's grandson, Shin:
Shin Walford - God's Messenger
Louis Crawford - God's Mistake

I might not have like Magi's grandson but making an expy of Shin that is also a rapist and murderer is a bit much. And that for me is one of two main issues with this work.
1) Making edgy expys of inoffensive protagonists like Bakarina or Shijou comes across as really mean-spirited. That said, most of these expies come across like the author is envious of more popular works.

2) Isekai already get accused of being edgy, especially the revenge ones. This only stands out for how brazen it is. Not because of how edgy it gets, nor is it the first isekai to have expys of other isekai characters (E.g. Ren, Sword hero, from Shield hero is an expy of Kirito) but because of how obvious the expys are. The author clearly wanted to provoke people. They just bit off more than they could chew.

yep a case of real revenge/envy taken too seriously I guess?
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Gina Szanboti



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 11451
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:32 pm Reply with quote
mrsatan wrote:
glafrun wrote:
Yea, sarcasm, parody, dark humor etc.... Don't work in Japan at all.

(Formerly) Super sarcastic guy that once lived in Japan here that can confirm.
They took everything I said at face value and it made my life very difficult.

I won't say this isn't true for interactions with ordinary people (because I don't know), but the venue is manga and anime, and I could give you pages of examples in manga and anime where sarcasm, parody, dark humor, etc. fly just fine. That was my issue with the statement (which also seemed to rely on stereotype and anecdote), not how the general Japanese public responds to such in daily personal interactions. It sounds like the reception is different depending on the circumstances in which it's encountered (media vs real life).
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Electric Wooloo



Joined: 19 Aug 2020
Posts: 311
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 1:49 pm Reply with quote
KarlFranz wrote:
Animeking1108 wrote:
And yet Dragon Ball has an evil version of Super Sentai with the Ginyu Force, One-Punch Man's first villain was a recolored Piccolo, half the jokes in Gintama are references, and Shinji Ikari is basically Amuro Ray if he was mentally unequipped to be a mech pilot.


Because those are archetype, not full blow copy paste characters. You can't copyright an archetype.


Except, y'know, a lot of those are done reverently and aren't literally the entire premise of the show.
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musouka



Joined: 09 Sep 2003
Posts: 711
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 2:04 pm Reply with quote
HAL14 wrote:
1) Making edgy expys of inoffensive protagonists like Bakarina or Shijou comes across as really mean-spirited. That said, most of these expies come across like the author is envious of more popular works.


This is where I fall as someone who doesn't have a lot of love for the original protagonists the manga is "spoofing."

I originally looked into it because I thought the idea of isekai protagonists being seen as the villains could be an interesting meta story from the POV of a regular joe. Unfortunately, the mangaka's way of making these characters into villains was the most hackneyed, ridiculous over the top evil achetypes imaginable. It really did come across as gross and bitter towards series that--again--I personally don't even like that much.
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LastPage 3



Joined: 13 Jun 2010
Posts: 193
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 2:17 pm Reply with quote
musouka wrote:
HAL14 wrote:
1) Making edgy expys of inoffensive protagonists like Bakarina or Shijou comes across as really mean-spirited. That said, most of these expies come across like the author is envious of more popular works.


This is where I fall as someone who doesn't have a lot of love for the original protagonists the manga is "spoofing."

I originally looked into it because I thought the idea of isekai protagonists being seen as the villains could be an interesting meta story from the POV of a regular joe. Unfortunately, the mangaka's way of making these characters into villains was the most hackneyed, ridiculous over the top evil achetypes imaginable. It really did come across as gross and bitter towards series that--again--I personally don't even like that much.


Exactly. There are plenty of mean spirited dark revenge stories coming out of Japan, and there's also no shortage of characters who are one dimensional caricatures only intended for the hero to defeat.

There are even plenty of stories where isekai protags are treated as evil (those are usually web novels though, not that many manga) but this was simply too close to established series and much too mean spirited to boot.
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mangamuscle



Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 2658
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 2:43 pm Reply with quote
I, for one, congratulate the mangaka's efforts. Thanks to him we will not see a similar manga published by any of the big editorials in japan, at least for what is left of this decade.
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Hoppy800



Joined: 09 Aug 2013
Posts: 3331
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 2:46 pm Reply with quote
This is why Japan needs fair use, although a couple of the characters do come too close to copyright violations and would need redesigning, but that's all that should've happened, a recall of the manga to fix the violating designs.
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Nom De Plume De Fanboy
Subscriber
Exempt from Grammar Rules


Joined: 14 Jan 2011
Posts: 614
Location: inland US west, pretty rural
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 2:51 pm Reply with quote
Shay Guy wrote:

This was the one character from that image floating around online where I didn't get the reference. The others were mostly obvious even without the handy pictures of their counterparts underneath:

「異世界レストラン」四条雪子
"Isekai restaurant" Shijou Yukiko (presumably someone from Restaurant to Another World)


From the way hair or something is piled up on their head, this looks to be Aletta the waitress. She has ram's horns on the side of her head. A nice character who had no special abilities, so I don't know what there would be to parody.
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