Forum - View topicBest Supporting Character Tournament: Post-Mortem
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Dorcas_Aurelia
 Posts: 5344 Location: Philly |
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Group A-29
Maes Hughes, Fullmetal Alchemist franchise vs. Lt. Yamamoto The Irresponsible Captain Tylor Voting for: Lt. Yamamoto Because: Hughes is a great character, certainly, but I don't think he's good enough to warrant a complete shut-out here. I believe that Yamamoto playing the by-the-book foil to Tylor's casual authority deserves at least one vote. Group B-Semifinal Balalaika, Black Lagoon vs. Winry Rockbell, Fullmetal Alchemist franchise vs. Letopanyu Spoor, Crest/Banner of the Stars franchise Voting for: Letopanyu Spoor Because: I'd voted for Spoor of Winry last time, so, for me, there was no question on that count. Thus, the choice comes down to two similar characters, calculating female leaders who dominate whatever scene they appear in. The deciding factor for me was that Spoor manages to make everything so playful while remaining focused on the importance of the task at hand. |
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Ggultra2764
 Subscriber Posts: 3966 Location: New York state. |
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And being a well known crime boss in Roanapour gives her enough connections where she can get what she needs taken care of, even if there are obstacles. She takes them out with brutal efficiency regardless, which still gives off the impression to me that she's too perfect.
It works here because you actually get to see the ordeals and fleshing out of Yukio and Roberta onscreen giving you enough sense of how they got in their present predicaments while what has been detailed about Balalaika is mostly implied from the flashbacks shown of her during the Washimine arc. There isn't any fleshing out on what led Balalaika to make the decisions she did like joining the Soviet military and forming Hotel Moscow while the viewer was able to witness the tragic pitfall of Yukio's character in the Washimine arc from her decisions and Roberta's struggle to retain the normalcy she came to accept with the Lovelace family following her disillusionment with being a FARC guerilla soldier. |
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bahumut75
 Posts: 65 Location: Rochester, NY |
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Group A Final
Maes Hughes, Fullmetal Alchemist franchise vs. Lt. Yamamoto The Irresponsible Captain Tylor Unfortunately, I haven't much to say about Yamamoto having not seen his series, but given the responses so far I don't feel too bad about it... Hughes just plays such an important role in both FMA series that he has to get my support. He is truly a multi-faceted character, sometimes proving comic relief, sometimes showing us a loving father, husband, and friend amidst the dark backdrop of the series, and sometimes he shows stunning intelligence as he hits on the most important secrets in the series before anyone else. He obviously plays a big role in the development of basically all of the main characters, but I will always remember spoiler[ the first time we find out Mustang's goals, and how Hughes has decided to support him. This was one of my favorite scenes from the first series, and it really made me aware of how serious Hughes's character can be] Group A Final: Maes Hughes Group B Final Balalaika, Black Lagoon vs. Winry Rockbell, Fullmetal Alchemist franchise vs. Letopanyu Spoor, Crest/Banner of the Stars franchise Sadly, I have also not seen Black Lagoon, I'm sorry! 
I've always been a big Winry fan, so my comments here are probably jaded, but here it goes. Even though I have to agree with the comments that Winry is by far the most passive character of these three, I'm not sure that really prevents her from being a a good supporting character. She was always there to act as a family and a connection to reality for the Elric brothers, and particularly in Brotherhood I think she actually plays some role in advancing the story. She also gets involved with Scar, and the spoiler[ kidnapping event at Briggs, even though it was staged, certainly played a role in pushing the story forward at that point.] I just finished Crest/Banner of the Stars like... yesterday. I liked Spoor's character quite a bit, she is refreshingly different from most of the other Abh, and she definitely commands the screen when she's on it. However, I just don't think that she makes enough contact with the main characters to really count as a supporting character for me. She undoubtedly pushes the series forward, spoiler[her ridiculous pushes forward during the Phantom Flame operation certainly set the tone for that whole part of the war, ] but its direct effects on Jinto and Lafiel are questionable, I think. Her spoiler[nearly suicidal defense in Banner II ] is probably what I remember most, but for me she just doesn't stand out as much as Winry did. Group B Final: Winry Rockbell It really seems that this particular match-up was tough on nearly everyone, even between just Spoor and Winry I was really torn, so hopefully my voting for Winry just because I like her more doesn't rub anyone the wrong way 
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abunai
Old Regular
 Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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In this matchup, the contestants are all worthy, and any vote is a right vote. I wouldn't worry about it. - abunai |
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bahumut75
Posts: 65 Location: Rochester, NY |
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That's certainly the impression I've been getting, its just that at this point in the tournament I feel like I'm not doing the characters justice unless I've seen their series. Fortunately, that problem will be mostly gone after this round though. If Balalaika wins I'll just have to power through Black Lagoon, its been sitting in my backlog forever anyway
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar  Posts: 16963 |
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Very true. All 3 honestly are top contenders and have been round after round so no one can say any of them are not worthy at this point. Plus this tournament, and the others, are supposed to be about having a bit of fun and enjoyment so vote for whoever you feel you should. But if are of a mind to change your vote before midnight tonight Balalaika is always happy to have another conscript...I mean supporter. 
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nightjuan
 Posts: 1473 |
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Group A Final
Maes Hughes, Fullmetal Alchemist franchise vs. Lt. Yamamoto The Irresponsible Captain Tylor Voting for:Maes Hughes This is the end of the line for good old Lt. Yamamoto and I can't, in all honesty, justify voting for him at this late stage of the game anymore. I'm a bit sad about having to withdraw my support for him here but...I just can't reach a different conclusion. Maes Hughes is more memorable, for one thing, tends to be admittedly easier to like and manages to effectively cover a wider range of emotional expressions in spite of the fact that both characters play comedic and serious roles alike (although, without question, Hughes ends up being the superior pick in this last area as well, thanks to the dramatic nature of the plot elements involved). Yamamoto does play an important role in his own series, for reasons I've pointed out before, and has one of his better clips this time around but it's still not nearly enough for him to move on past the opposition. Group B Final Balalaika, Black Lagoon vs. Winry Rockbell, Fullmetal Alchemist franchise vs. Letopanyu Spoor, Crest/Banner of the Stars franchise Voting for: Winry Rockbell Let's see...in terms of character type alone it would be easy for me to dismiss Winry and spent the rest of my time deciding whether or not I should vote for Spoor or Balalaika (which would be quite tough, given my earlier support for both), but that's not the way things are going to be. I'm actually going to vote based on what could be called "by the book" criteria and leave all other considerations out of it. The biggest weakness that both Spoor and Balalaika share is their relatively limited amount of screen time but, just as well, this also highlights one of their biggest strengths since they're perfectly capable of stealing the entire show on short notice. Nevertheless, they ultimately lack character development and, while we do get some interesting bits of background information from time to time, this isn't really enough to make up for it from a purely objective perspective. Now...for all of her comparative passivity, Winry was an effective supporting character on a more consistent basis. She had a greater amount of involvement throughout the story of Fullmetal Alchemist, more interactions with the main characters and more scenes were dedicated to developing her as a character, even if she wasn't necessarily going to be actively involved in some of the more hectic scenarios. Does that limitation make her irrelevant then? I don't think so, not all forms of influence are meant to be created equal, and this means I'm in the awkward position of voting for a character whose role, at least on paper, isn't really my cup of tea but, nevertheless, deserves some critical recognition due to its effective execution. |
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Key
Moderator
 Posts: 18458 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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Round 5 Groups A and B Finals is now closed.
. . . And with 20 votes in we have yet another tie in Group B. Results: Group A: Maes Hughes crushes Lt. Yamamoto 18-2 to claim the first Final Four spot. Group B: Balalaika and Winry Rockbell duel to a tie, while Admiral Spoor gets eliminated, 9-9-2. So it looks like we'll be having a Final Five (at least!) again, as we did in the Best Duos tournament. I have to wonder if Spoor didn't pull just enough votes from Balalaika to prevent her outright win, as both of Spoor's supporters seemed to be choosing between Balalaika and Spoor. Winry won't have that advantage in the semifinals, though; in fact, the advantage next round could go to Balalaika due to the FMA support splitting and the roles of Maes and Winry somewhat overlapping. But that's for next week; we still have a couple of tough-to-call matches for this week, likely coming up within the hour. EDIT It has been brought to my attention that a certain person who shall remain nameless but did vote this round changed his(?) vote for a second time on Sunday without making a new-post announcement that he was changing his vote, which means that I missed it, and it is a change that affects the outcome of Group B. Although the new post announcing the change has long been expected, it is actually not explicitly required by current tournament rules, so I have to allow it. When I post the new round, though, I will amend the tourney rules so that this does not happen again. In the future, vote changes will not be counted if they are not done on the original vote post and accompanied by a new post announcing that there has been a change. That means that Balalaika actually wins Group B 10-8-2, so there will not be a Final Five unless we have a later tie. |
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Key
Moderator
Posts: 18458 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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Round 5 Groups C and D Finals are now closed.
Results can be found here. Please note that there has been a change to the final posting for Groups A and B since it was originally posted. Double-check it if the EDIT note wasn't there when you first looked at it. The remaining two (assuming there are no more ties  ) spots in the Final Four are now up for grabs! We have what could be two very tight matches here; can Wakaba continue her success after nipping by Rakushun last round, or has she finally met her match in Kisuke? It is certainly a match of vastly contrasting characters. In the second bout, a character who defines supporting role faces off against a character many credit with elevating the quality of her series. I look forward to the arguments.
And to give people a teaser for future events, I may have finally figured out a way to satisfy both the people who desperately want a Biggest Bad-Ass tournament and those who are against it because it isn't broad or inclusive enough. But that will have to wait for a month or so down the road, as we still have three weeks of this tournament left, including this one. Group C Final Kisuke Urahara, Bleach vs. Wakaba Tsukishima, Cross Game Group D Final Tanda, Moribito – Guardian of the Spirit vs. Ami Kawashima, Toradora! Last edited by Key on Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:28 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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RHachicho
 Posts: 897 Location: Essex, UK |
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Eeeer yeah sorry the guy who changed his vote etc etc was probably me.
 I would usually post a new vote but I figured with everyone dithering you would check all the votes from scratch before tallying Won't happen again. And yes I am a he.
Kinda wish I had stuck with Winry now a five way would have been exciting. /sigh what can ya do tho
Group C Final Kisuke Urahara, Bleach vs. Wakaba Tsukishima, Cross Game Voting for Wakaba Tsukishima. Kisuke is out of his league here in my opinion. Although the degree of support he provides his cast with is profound. When considered proportianally it is nowhere near Wakaba's. Wakaba also has a deeper personality. Kisuke wins in terms of cool factor imo it is not enough to counterbalance Wakaba's merits. Group D Final Tanda, Moribito – Guardian of the Spirit vs. Ami Kawashima, Toradora! Voting for Tanda Again another no brainer for me. Though Ami is deeper than I at first gave her credit for she can't win against Tanda in my reckoning. I believe at this point I have more than made my case as to why I back Tanda. So I won't bore everyone with a repeat
Personally I can't see myself changing my mind this round. These matches are not close in my estimation
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Ggultra2764
Subscriber Posts: 3966 Location: New York state. |
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Group C Final: Wakaba Tsukishima (Cross Game)
My reasoning is mostly similar to RHachicho's. While a unique character in a shounen anime series, I also found that Kisuke seemed to be around only to maintain status of cool in Bleach for the most part after lending his help to Ichigo in the Soul Society arc. Wakaba is more deep in personality as her influence on the major characters in her show is consistently felt throughout her series, despite her shocking death in the show's first episode. Group D Final: Tanda (Moribito: Guardian of the Spirit) Quite the easy decision for me to make here. Tanda doesn't fall as deeply into a character archetype as Ami does in Toradora nor does he get too much screen time to take attention away from the lead character. While Ami contributes more to advance Toradora's plot, Tanda has a more unique personality and does provide major support to Balsa's quest when it's needed while she helps Chagum. |
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LydiaDianne
 Posts: 5634 Location: Southern California |
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Group C Final
Kisuke Urahara, Bleach No, Wakaba has no chance here against the master of manipulation. Kisuke, while being a supporting character, he plays such a greater role than some dead girl who's claim to fame is just the memory of her. He's the cause and effect of a major story line and is always there lending a hand, be it a "helping" one or a shove in the back! Group D Final Tanda, Moribito – Guardian of the Spirit Ami is an interesting character but she is nothing against the quiet strength that is Tanda. He is one of those characters that quietly slips under your skin and after you finish watching, you keep remembering things that happened, and he's there. Helping. Quietly. Supporting. |
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TheTheory
 Posts: 1029 Location: Central PA |
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I'm pretty apathetic about this round. The first match-up is between two characters I want to see advance, so it is a win-win either way. The second match-up are characters I *don't* want to see advance, so it is lose-lose etiher way.
Group C Final Kisuke Urahara, Bleach vs. Wakaba Tsukishima, Cross Game Wakaba, only because she's a she, and Kisuke is a he. I value each character pretty evenly at this point, so have no qualms in making my vote based off of such a creepy reason. Group D Final Tanda, Moribito – Guardian of the Spirit vs. Ami Kawashima, Toradora! I know Tanda is going to run away with this, and I hate him. So might as well throw a measly vote to Ami. It shouldn't change the outcome of the voting AND it helps me feel like I just scored a moral victory in the process. Now THAT is the ultimate win-win. |
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Spastic Minnow
 Bargain HunterExempt from Grammar Rules  Posts: 4630 Location: Gainesville, FL |
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Oh boy, I voted against every single one of these guys last time, I sure am excited now! Not that these are not worthy characters, just none that I personally wanted to go through. And then there's the problem I mentioned last week, I personally like the characters Wakaba and Ami more than their opponents and their shows are favorites of mine, should I now support them despite the fact that I feel they technically don't do enough in a support capacity?
Group C Final Kisuke Urahara, Bleach vs. Wakaba Tsukishima, Cross Game voting for: Kisuke Urahara sticking with the principles here. But I'll compromise by just posting briefly this once and letting it go. If you want details of my objections to Wakaba, I provided many in the previous round. Kisuke does a lot, is interesting, stays around and provides a perfect supporting role, I see no reason not to vote for him. Group D Final Tanda, Moribito – Guardian of the Spirit vs. Ami Kawashima, Toradora! voting for: Tanda And my technical arguments against Ami: one and two As for the reasons for supporting Tanda. That's not hard, I finally finished Moribito this past weekend and he really is a very strong contender (I had been forced to stop at 9 episodes on Adult Swim previously). Unwavering support both with his skills and loyalty, unveils important discoveries, gives heart to the show . Last edited by Spastic Minnow on Tue Aug 17, 2010 3:15 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Key
Moderator
Posts: 18458 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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Group C Final
Kisuke Urahara, Bleach vs. Wakaba Tsukishima, Cross Game This is a tough one. Had Rakushun won last round then this would be automatic, but I'm not as sure how well Wakaba matches up here. Wakaba is a charmer and scene-stealer, but so is Kisuke; you always know that something that's either funny or significant is going to happen each time he's on the screen. Wakaba's influence on her series is deep and pervasive, but so is Kisuke's, albeit in usually more subtle ways. Wakaba has extensive involvement with both of her series' leads, but so does Kisuke. Wakaba affects the overall plot of her series in a big way, but so does Kisuke; he has a significant impact on the current plot through his interventions and enabling of characters, while also being a key player in the backstory that is the foundation of the overarching plot. I'm not even sure that the "quality of appearances" argument holds here, as, again, Kisuke always makes an impression whenever he's on the screen. The deciding factor here is, I think, that Kisuke has a broader set of roles that he covers within his series and more active involvement. He is trainer and supplier, subtle manipulator and comic relief, plot device creator, combative support, and even on a couple of occasions a direct combatant. While his influence on his series is not as pervasive as Wakaba's, he actively does more within his series while Wakaba, after a certain point, has a more passive impact. However, if Wakaba ends up winning this one (and she should be very competitive), I won't be heartbroken. Group D Final Tanda, Moribito – Guardian of the Spirit vs. Ami Kawashima, Toradora! The easier pick of the two for me. I love Ami's character, the role she plays within her series, and the way she develops over the course of the series. She adds so much to Toradora! and is, I think without question, one of the big reasons why that series is so much better than others of its type. However, I still consider Tanda to be the archetype for what a supporting character should be. He is a well-developed character who does everything he can to be a support to the lead character, makes his presence known without stealing scenes, and has a distinct impact on the plot progression. Some may find him dull compared to some of the other characters in the tournament, but he's also one of the few in this tournament who genuinely stays within his role. He is what I would call one of the tournament's two or three truest "wind beneath my wings" characters and at least as deserving of making it to the Finals as anyone else left in the field. |
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