Forum - View topicNEWS: Tokyo Reps: 'Nonexistent Youth' Bill May Still Pass in June
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Mushi-Man
Posts: 1537 Location: KCMO |
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I few thoughts on this bill. First of all this bill is just an awful idea I think. The language of the bill is vague which would allow them to basically pick and choose what will and will not be effected. Also if these are fictional characters then these materials should be protected by freedom of speech.
Also I'm skeptical that this will even get passed in the first place. I just don't see this going over to well with allot of people. |
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sunflower
Posts: 1080 |
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It's all very well of them to say certain popular things would not be affected. The problem is, the language of the law is so vague that they can make whatever they want be affected. If the language is truly broader than what they wish to regulate, the proper response is to narrow the language, not to say "Oh we'll decide in the future when we see something we don't like."
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animalcalls
Posts: 42 |
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Only in the anime world would people be upset that those below the age of 18 can't buy DVDs or manga where 15 year old girls undress.
I think you're all missing the point about the "anti-social acts" as well. I honestly doubt they'll censor rape or incest when used as a story device and not as a sexual turn-on. The bill is about sexualized youths: rape is not a "sexual act" unless turned into a perversion or turn-on, which is what I assume this bill is referring to. Rape-porn, essentially, with minors. I doubt they'll censor shows that use rape as an important, serious plot-point. I am against all forms of censorship, but all the creators battling this just sort of stinks of money-grubbing. "Oh no, 15 year old boys can't buy my 13 year old girl incest manga? There goes my audience!" Creators will obviously battle this because it limits who will buy their stuff if only adults can buy it. The bill doesn't mention censoring the work, just restricting who can buy it. I think a lot of people misinterpret what is overtly sexual and what is not. Rei and Asuka naked in Evangelion is not overtly sexual or exploitative. If you sat down someone who doesn't watch anime and made them watch some episodes of Eva, they wouldn't even consider their nudity as fan-service, or even know what fan-service is. It'd be considered part of the story and part of the characters. It's not overtly sexual. I want to just point out again that I am against all forms of censorship and am for complete and total artistic freedom, but simply moving a DVD a couple of shelves over so a minor doesn't watch an 11 year old girl get rammed by a goblin cock doesn't seem that bad to me. |
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Altare
Posts: 37 |
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So they are not banning the things, just restricting the sale to minors? I can understand that. I do think it's just plain evil to ban lolicon. Don't get me wrong, sure it's creepy and weird, but that doesn't change the fact that it's a freaking drawing.
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jtstellar
Posts: 94 |
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or maybe you're just too simple minded. for people who actually pay attention to politics and know a bit about lawmaking and the economy, they know rules always tend to pile on over the years because of lobbyists and busybody politicians who always have their different personal favorite areas to add a little bit here and there to "steer society in the way they see fit".. once someone starts a route down a path it's almost a guarantee a signal of more follow-ups. having anime/manga as hobby is fine but having uninformed and naive citizens making blank assumptions because of their isolation from real world and corrupt politics and even feeling confident about their naivety concerns me. by the way one corrupt way this type of law can be abused by lobbyists is, let's say, if electronic manga materials market expand some 20 times from what it is now and there is actually a powerful player in that market, he can very well lobby the lawmakers and slip something in that bans some genres to be handed out in print but allows them in electronic form, and he can make a bogus case such as "iphone or whatever other applications will ask users to register their age, so the owners will less likely be underage" or whatever, just like how countless corrupt bills with loopholes have been piled on in the united states have been passed to benefit the largest corporations to crowd out small businesses. maybe you need to understand the nature of some of the political and lobbying tools/their potentials and realize it's often best not to start down that road with sometimes a bill as innocent sounding as merely a bill to clarity of define certain terms. lawmakers write rules in incrementalism because there's no way the society will accept drastic changes at once. it usually always starts with a bill that sometimes "add a little clarification", "define things better", "just to add a label" before things move onto "you cannot advertise it", "you have to pay a certain amount of sin tax on it", then "certain materials cannot be read in public places", and so on. and again every single rule written will affect the economy in some way.. so there are always some winners and some losers, so there is always the money incentive and when a powerful enough player appears, things will suddenly accelerate in the rule pile-ons. just think how this rule already affects some stores.. once it gets passed it will surely encourage the store-owners to get into the lawmaking process next time, and things just pile on. know how rules are gradually written and realize the concerns are well founded.. not everyone sits in a room and read manga all day. Last edited by jtstellar on Sun May 02, 2010 3:47 pm; edited 5 times in total |
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Nemo_N
Posts: 272 |
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I'm not sure how a vague law should not be reason enough to be scared; unless, of course, you assume that politicians will always do the right thing, devoid of pressure from their constituencies, elections and personal biases. Assuming the worst regarding vague laws is hardly unwarranted, since we are talking about the one institution (government) that can legally take away your freedom (some or all of it). There should be no room for optimism.
You haven't read Dan Kanemitsu's articles, have you?:
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animalcalls
Posts: 42 |
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Why should I trust what Dan Kanemitsu says? Last time I checked, he was a translator, not someone well-versed in Japanese politics. It's also funny that anyone who disagrees with him is just led back to his article, as if he is the only and final word on the subject because he has a webpage about it.
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Nemo_N
Posts: 272 |
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I suppose you are more comfortable trusting Japanese politicians? Okay. |
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animalcalls
Posts: 42 |
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Hahaha, I don't even know what to say to that. I don't trust anyone. But I certainly don't trust a translator to properly decipher a legal-mumbo-jumbo filled bill. Would you trust Danielle Steele to give a clear and rational understanding of an American bill? Doubtful. Trust me, buddy, I'm just as disenchanted and fed up with politics as you are, but simply re-posting a link to the same article over and over again won't get much done. |
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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Olivine
Posts: 197 Location: Sol 3 |
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Anyone else find all this sort of laughable? 1) Government: Hello, we're here to parent your children. We encourage you to install this program that allows us to spy on your children, and buy this phone that also allows us to spy on your children. We know how to parent your children better than you do. Parent: Get out of my house. 2)Anything with the harmful material sticker gets 'regulated.' Some kid: Ima buy this. Clerk: it has a harmful sticker on it. Some kid: I'll be right back. Some kid's dad: Ima buy this. Clerk: Ok. 3) Government: Stop having all that child pornography. People: We don't have any. 4)Government: GO FORTH, ARMY OF JAPAN. HEAR OUR PROPAGANDA! THOSE WITH THE COMIC BOOKS THAT YOU REALLY DIDN'T CARE KIDS HAD BEFORE BUT NOW YOU MUST BECAUSE WE SAID SO. STOP WHATEVER YOU ARE DOING AND FULFILL THE PROPHECY! People: Busy, come back later. Even if this gets passed, its going to just be worthless. Also, all this doom and gloom about Tokyo being the epicenter of culture or whatever. All that would happen is they would move to some other city. No more conventions in Tokyo. Oh well. |
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JuicyB
Posts: 278 |
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Pointing out ways that the government can misuse its power hardly constitutes conspiracy theories, Einstein. I'm kinda curious as to why you are so eager to persuade others that this bill is harmless. I also see no reason why you are so optimistic that the TMG will pass "detailed clauses and amendments" that will make rainbows shoot out of everyones' asses. |
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Nemo_N
Posts: 272 |
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Weird. Your first post takes at face value what the politicians say the bill will do, yet you claim not to trust anyone? |
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Nemo_N
Posts: 272 |
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I'm sure you do your best at your job, but making laws assuming that everyone will work the same way is naive. |
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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