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theotheranimeman
Joined: 19 Nov 2022
Posts: 74
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 Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 4:30 am
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| Quote: | | The organization intends to convene a panel of experts to determine which materials to gather for the archive. |
Then what's even the point? If you just archive the "worthy" manga, it doesn't make much of a difference. All the famous great manga aren't the ones that are threatened to disappear, it's the less popular ones. I don't think archiving should just be about preserving "the good ones".
Last edited by theotheranimeman on Sun Aug 27, 2023 4:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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KlarkKentThe3rd
Joined: 21 Dec 2010
Posts: 108
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Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 4:53 am
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Well put. Proves once again that the best archivists are the independent ones. Like that 1 man from Italy who has been scanning at high resolution, then colour correcting and touching up old Pokemon art (a lot of it in watercolour).
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Kicksville
Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 1249
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Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 8:52 am
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| theotheranimeman wrote: | | Then what's even the point? If you just archive the "worthy" manga, it doesn't make much of a difference. All the famous great manga aren't the ones that are threatened to disappear, it's the less popular ones. I don't think archiving should just be about preserving "the good ones". |
I feel like that's a severe overreaction. Since they don't have unlimited time and resources, of course they've got to pick what to prioritize. Even fan archivists have to pick and choose what they go for.
On that note, that is of course why fan archivists are important: less constraint allows for preservation of material that can otherwise end up stuck in rare limbo.
But I would imagine - at least, I would hope - an organization like this may be able to access materials fans would not be able to. Such as, like they mention here, original artwork and stuff from production.
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Joe Mello
Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 2310
Location: Online Terminal
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Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 9:14 am
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I just find it laudable that there is a part of the commercial entertainment industry that understands the need for preservation and archival study of the works it puts out.
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Hoppy800
Joined: 09 Aug 2013
Posts: 3331
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Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 10:43 am
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Finally, manga needed a dedicated preservation group badly as lots of them are endanger of being lost. Anime needs this next.
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MarshalBanana
Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Posts: 5511
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Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 11:12 am
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| Hoppy800 wrote: | | Finally, manga needed a dedicated preservation group badly as lots of them are endanger of being lost. Anime needs this next. |
I've heard the industry has been infamous for not taking care of its Film prints of old Anime.
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Cutiebunny
Joined: 18 Apr 2010
Posts: 1767
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Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2023 10:39 pm
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| MarshalBanana wrote: | | I've heard the industry has been infamous for not taking care of its Film prints of old Anime. |
As far as production material goes (like cels and the sketches used to make anime), yes, this is very much true. Which is why it's laughable that the Japanese Government takes interest in obtaining this artwork every few years and building a museum for it. Not sure how they think they're going to pry it from (mostly) foreign collector's hands. Then again, the possession of goods seems to work differently in Japan - I recall that, many years ago, I had to provide my name, address, and ID to buy some artwork being sold at an anime convention. They wanted to go a step further by wanting to get a document signed that the artwork will never be resold, but the convention staff informed them that this was not legal in the US.
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Alan45
 Village Elder
Joined: 25 Aug 2010
Posts: 10026
Location: Virginia
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Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2023 7:00 am
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| theotheranimeman wrote: |
| Quote: | | The organization intends to convene a panel of experts to determine which materials to gather for the archive. |
Then what's even the point? If you just archive the "worthy" manga, it doesn't make much of a difference. All the famous great manga aren't the ones that are threatened to disappear, it's the less popular ones. I don't think archiving should just be about preserving "the good ones". |
I don't read that as saying experts would choose which manga series were collectible but rather what of the artists various steps are to be collected. Apparently there are several steps back and forth with the editor before the artist provides the final version for publication.
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theotheranimeman
Joined: 19 Nov 2022
Posts: 74
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Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2023 7:22 am
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| Kicksville wrote: |
| theotheranimeman wrote: | | Then what's even the point? If you just archive the "worthy" manga, it doesn't make much of a difference. All the famous great manga aren't the ones that are threatened to disappear, it's the less popular ones. I don't think archiving should just be about preserving "the good ones". |
I feel like that's a severe overreaction. Since they don't have unlimited time and resources, of course they've got to pick what to prioritize. Even fan archivists have to pick and choose what they go for.
On that note, that is of course why fan archivists are important: less constraint allows for preservation of material that can otherwise end up stuck in rare limbo.
But I would imagine - at least, I would hope - an organization like this may be able to access materials fans would not be able to. Such as, like they mention here, original artwork and stuff from production. |
Of course they have to prioritize something, but we both know they'll just prioritize the stuff you can find on every corner anyway, which makes the whole thing pretty useless.
Look at the National Film Registry in the United States, for example. There's only 850 films there and most of that are films like 2001: A Space Odyssey, Apocalypse Now, Bambi, The Big Lebowski, Blade Runner, Citizen Kane, The Rocky Horror Picture Show etc. etc. We both know there's pretty much a 0% chance that those films are going to ever disappear, so what's the point of prioritizing them?
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L-S-M-F-T
Joined: 21 Dec 2017
Posts: 10
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Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2023 12:07 am
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| Quote: | | Look at the National Film Registry in the United States, for example. There's only 850 films there and most of that are films like 2001: A Space Odyssey, Apocalypse Now, Bambi, The Big Lebowski, Blade Runner, Citizen Kane, The Rocky Horror Picture Show etc. etc. We both know there's pretty much a 0% chance that those films are going to ever disappear, so what's the point of prioritizing them?
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I used to think the United States Library of Congress and the National Film Registry only saved popular movies too; But after attending a discussion panel with the current Librarian of Congress, Carla Hayden, back in February, I found out they preserve so much more stuff than that! Check out this film of a sneeze from 1894 - https://www.loc.gov/item/00694192 She talked about that film specifically and others that she herself was surprised were in the Registry. This is the oldest film she's added to the Registry in her tenure - https://nationalzoo.si.edu/object/yt_Wubt3-lrO0I
And they don't just preserve the films themselves, but also the equipment necessary to play the films! There's also the restoration process that is sometimes required for films that have not been stored properly. The Librarian said her favorite part of the film preservation process is seeing the films after they've been restored; She talked about seeing some films arrive so deteriorated that she doubted they could be saved at all. Then she gets to watch those same films that came in all messed up hahaha!
People's concerns about bias towards popular works are justified. From reading this article, I'm not sure if the Manga Archive Organization is a public or private entity. The U.S. Library of Congress is funded by taxpayer dollars and the federal government has to approve it's budget periodically; That's gives voters a say in determining it's importance. The Librarian of Congress is nominated by the President and then has to be approved by the Senate. The Librarian is the one that convenes the board that recommends films to be added to the Registry. On top of that, the public can nominate movies to be added to the registry! - https://www.research.net/r/national-film-registry-2017 In the end, the Librarian makes the final decision as to what's added each year. If the Manga Archive Organization becomes mostly funded by private companies with no public oversight, that would be a huge bummer because I think they should try to preserve as much as they can, including the tools and equipment used to make manga. Caring for the actual artistic instruments and printing machines is gonna be so important, especially since we're moving towards a paperless, digital world and publishing companies themselves might not have an interest in holding onto stuff that isn't making them money.
I also agree that archiving shouldn't just be about preserving "the good ones"; Each work is a part of the overall history of a medium. I think the idea that all of us, as fans, just doing what we do and building our own individual libraries is so cool! The real fun isn't going to be in the similarities of everyone's collections, but the differences. With anime and manga not just being important to the residents of Japan, but to fans across the world, I'm really hoping they building a diverse and robust archive.
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