Forum - View topicINTEREST: Guilty Gear Strive Developer: Bridget Identifies as a Woman
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Cardcaptor Takato
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ThePatmann
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Sure, but, read my post and see why I think it's unfair to label all people who are no longer fans because of this direction in Bridget's story transphobes. The opposite of people getting into GG because of Bridget being trans is fans who lost interest after they kinda 180'd the direction of Bridget and went towards a conclusion that felt completely opposite of what her story was up to that point. Not people who hate trans people and therefore hate Bridget.
Why though? It's legitimately a term used to describe effiminate men, I actually know several guys who identify as femboys. Including that ex-trans friend of mine. It is a thing and shouldn't be subject to the kind of ridicule you're giving it. That said, outside of r/egg_irl (the redditors there can be lowkey kinda bad about the whole gender thing, so I think it's fair to see them as an outlier group), very few people actually believe femboys are just a "phase". |
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Ryo_rkgk
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This is inaccurate, the term femboy came specifically from Thailand, it is a social class of men, who do infact take hormone or engage in some type of female gender representation, not to be confused as crossdressers. This term came from thailand and is now used in the US to describe twinks and crossdressers alike. This is also a hefty mis understanding of the character everyone is ip in arms about, also a profound mis translation over the decades by localizers. 1st bridget wasnt “raised a girl,” she was told to be a girl, bridget knew this and wasnt being groomed or anything similar. 2 this entire character background was based on the Bruce Lee family curse where Lee was given a feminine name early in life since his brother died. 3 at no point does she equate her own outward appearance as lady boy, femboy or otherwise, she infact likes teasing people with the crossdressing, it would seem as the game’s progressed, bridget she became more into it. 4 after she finished her mission and had no direction she decided she liked herself better that way and just decided female was the way to go. This does happen in lgbt spaces, its not rare within the community. The term “otokonoko,” can just he broken down to Male Daughter. The only proper localization for otokonoko would actually be transvestist, literally, because its her family religious/cultural significance. With all that out of the way. The rage from people who are soooooo mad about bridget is laughable, they have Testament now. Like literally, a gender fluid hottie with a pretty face. Its funny how a bunch of “fighting game” lovers get so mad when they… lose a match… against its creator.. |
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Ryo_rkgk
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Im glad bridget came out. Nowwww Testament on the other hand… smoke show.
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ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 3027 Location: Email for assistance only |
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Hey-yo, intentionally misgendering trans people and characters isn't acceptable here.
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Ryo_rkgk
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ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
Posts: 3027 Location: Email for assistance only |
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It's a response to a post that was after yours and then deleted.
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SHD
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The thing is, I'd bet a large sum of money that most of the people whining about this - have never cared about the game in the first place. Chances are, most of them haven't even been aware of its existence before this. It's just the latest vehicle for them to bring out their usual racist/homophobic/transphobic/misogynist talking points. They're like migratory birds, traveling from one franchise to another, nesting in them, and screeching about the woke agenda and betrayal of fans and ruining the franchise and whatnot. They make a huge noise and mess, then when they get wind of another franchise doing something they don't like they migrate over there to do the same thing. Had the news headlines about Bridget not used the word "trans" (or "gender") it probably would have slipped right under their radar. (Disclaimer: no, of course I'm not saying that everyone being triggered over Bridget's identity is like that. I'm sure there are plenty of Guilty Gear fans whining about it. But you really can't help noticing this trend...) |
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Ryo_rkgk
Posts: 26 |
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My apologies but now youve got me interested, what did they say, my posts on this topic have been educational regarding the games history and international queer terms. Id love to know how that was weaponized by a troll. They always amaze me. |
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Ryo_rkgk
Posts: 26 |
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Actually, i think you are onto something here. Its like people arguing that bridgets story is somehow integral to the over arching narrative…. Which is, umm, noone actually understands whats happening in guilty gear. My guess is they are trolls trying to spin up lgbt hate, unfortunately they barked up Arc’s tree and Daisuke created multiple queer coded characters. So it begs the question, were they even paying even a little attention to the game and its creator or are they just trolls. |
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ChirashiD
 Posts: 186 Location: WA |
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Heres my hopefully helpful attempt at clarifiying some posts in this thread that suggest a misunderstanding of what an otokonoko is. The literal English translation "male daughter" doesn't really provide much insight how it relates to words like transvestite, femboy or even transwoman because its really none of those. Its better to think of the 3 terms I just mentioned as referring to people in real life. Otokonoko on the other hand exists almost entirely within the realm of fiction particularly tied to Japanese pop culture (manga, games, anime). Otokonoko existed before that dreaded T word but the fact that it also had fictional origins (Star Wars), is really testament to how its the closest meaningful translation of otokonoko that exists.
Many English speaking otokonoko fans use the two words interchangably, with otokonoko actually being less popular than the still widely used English word (perhaps simply because its an English word). But to understand (not saying anyone needs to appreciate) what an otokonoko is, let's instead appreciate and understand what a transwoman ISN'T. Being able to pass naturally (like otokonoko do) isn't what makes someone trans. The debate about whether transwomen are women centers on the importance of the self-assigned gender identity of transpeople themselves. No one really has control over how effeminate or masculine they naturally look and those who naturally look like the opposite sex will not necessarily be trans. For example, the internal monologue of Wonder Egg Priority's Momoe proves she's not trans but she's still codified as a darlingspoiler[ of the reverse-trap crowd ] and attracts the attention of many female characters. So what does this distinction have to do with Bridget since she confirmed her female identity? Its the reality that she was always trans (despite not having this realization herself for a while) and this is integral to her story, so seeing her as an otokonoko was never an accurate depiction of her character. Other than the blatantly transphobic comments arond the Net, I'd like to suggest the more or less trans-sensitive backlash is likely attributed to all those otokonoko fans with now broken hearts. They'll get over it eventually. |
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GasterTheGreat
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Was it mine? I notice my post is gone. I didn't think I misgendered anyone but if I did I apologize. I don't recall the exact wording I used though but maybe I did it out of habit. It will take time to adjust to calling Bridget a girl now. |
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ChirashiD
Posts: 186 Location: WA |
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Ryo_rkgk
Posts: 26 |
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Im sorry but this, while your post is coming from a good place the historical accuracy is incorrect. The dreaded “t word” predates Otokonoko by decades. We are talking half a century almost. It is a word that explicitly comes from the term crossdresser or Tranvestite. This is how it is used in Otaku communities in Japan. The T word is very old, the first SRS surgery was in 1956 and the first major one was in Soviet Union a few years later. Prior to that there were quite a few words to explain trans experience, the term transgender was not even a word yet and transexual or transvestite were interchangeable. Going forward otokonoko was invented and used in a similar way as crossdresser or female presenting male character. Bridget, as Daisuke has said in multiple interviews, is seen to be an evolving character as her story has been retconned multiple times, introduced as a literal otokonoko, or in his words a unconventional adorable character that happens to be a boy. That was how deep the rabbit hole went, allllll the way up to now. With that said, it would make sense for a crossdresser that is extremely passable to have a revaluation and decide to transition, this happens everyday in Nichome and San Francisco in my experience. Especially in Drag circles. This isnt far-fetched. And the fact that Daisuke has many queer coded characters suggests he is in the community as some length and is learning as he goes, maybe even knows a few trans-women now and realized it would be a deeper than surface level story element that’s actually provoking, so he let the character evolve further. But even so, the term otokonoko is much more modern that the other words and as with the other words, itself has depricated to the point where it is not in Vogue anymore and almost offensive. That said there are quite a few new manga using the term slightly like “i think i turned my friend into a girl,” but goes so far to explicitly describe the main heroine as a queer coded character and not just a run of the mill fetish fantasy. Last edited by Ryo_rkgk on Wed Sep 21, 2022 11:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ryo_rkgk
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Your points ate EXTREMELY valid. I happen to be trans and it took me a while to even refer to myself thay way. After transition I still mess up and do the same exact thing to other trans persons. Im actually very tired of the cancel crap we are seeing from younger queer people who learn queer history through other young queer people on tik tok, basically young people who probably have never been to college nor are old enough to go, they seem to think a youtube video will teach them everything about queer history globally. Which is not the case. I've even had some yell at the top of their lungs in Tokyo for that matter about it being the 2000s and that EVERYONE knows this, similar to the new phrases like Ze/zer I've seen used in San Diego. Know one outside of small communities in the US and a few other places know these terms or use them. People forget rhe population of amwrica is 300,000,000 and only 7% of that is lgbt. Globally its around 2%, there are 8+ billion people on the globe. Japan’s population is 120 mil and the UK’s is 700 mil, thailand is 70 mil. These are are some of the more friendly nations towards lgbt people and lgbt people, at least the ones that are self identifying are tiny percentages of those people. Now out of those percentages, lgbt people dont just download ethics, history, and morals from the lgbt matrix when they come out, grindr is a perfect observation tool. People come out everywhere and take their baggage out of the closet with them, be it rascism, internal bigotry, heck, like the republican celibate lgbt people who think they, themselves has a disorder. So learning comes are different levels, speeds and in a lot of cases mixed directions with different final destinations. Messing up a newly come out queer persons pronouns is GOING TO happen. It happens all the time in larger communities, ESPECIALLY, back home in Shinjuku where a person has transitioned but presents in daily life as their old gender at work or to parents hiding things, maybe wearing a binder, sometimes they show up to nichome in that outfit not having time to change. Most people use fake names in nicho, this is an understood rule. Noone asks Where they work unless they are good friends or are already open to that. So if Takuya comes to nichome a lot from work and only comes rarely as Satomi, people are going to forget, this is cause Satomi is transient, a lit of people who are also knew are trying to remember many other peoples names, identities etc and maybe only met them in passing, its nicho, people are coming and going hourly cause its the main hub in Japan. Life is stressful so everyones usually drinking cause we all have the… mental health problems, due to oppressive society. The internet shaming a person for accidentally misgendering a person is wrong, and a cartoon character…. i mean come on. Sure bridget is a gurl, great ok, she's still a non existent entity. One also has to consider the ramifications of russian psy-ops which rueters has a few pieces on that weaponized social media in a Dugin’s esk way trying to spread discord in the west. The number if political actors on twitter facebook and tiktok is not zero. The washington post just had an artical that the us military is under investigation for doing a psyop on its own people, so one has to consider that many of those nameless accounts or sparse accounts with an anime person as an avatar might actually be neo nazi’s trying to make lgbt people or allies seem insufferable. “See look how mean these people are,” they might say on a different account whilst using a puppet to send hate. I came out in 2012. And non of these problems existed. I have literally watched over a decade of social media enhancement problems just materialize from thin air, people inventing things to be mad about. Places that once battered their lashes towardw lgbt people now being targeted by younger ones demanding respect whilst stepping on others. One has to consider the ramifications of this hyper aggression when educated a person about pronouns. It isnt contusion to learning. |
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