| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
|
|
danpmss
Joined: 30 May 2015
Posts: 777
|
 Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 11:52 pm
|
 |
|
|
Eh, Marvel movies are the "serious" kind of cartoony compared to their comic book inspiration, and they get very creative with their cartoony stuff in the movies. It really comes to how well they can execute a scene properly animated in CGI.
For a goofy kind of cartoony, we had the Mask, as dated as it became in terms of technology, it holds up to this day as an amazing cartoony live-action of a very cartoony source material (which was vastly different from the wholesome comedy we got, but still lol).
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
SpiritSmoocher
Joined: 06 Mar 2021
Posts: 182
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:15 am
|
|
|
|
The only people i have seen remotely defend these awful netflix adaptations are anitubers like trash taste and mother's basement; they are just shilling since netflix and anime companies sponsor them. The hypocrisy in saying acclaimed shows from disney sucks yet they are defending these netflix adaptations? Literally everyone i have seen from critics, fans, general audiences and regular tubers thought the netflix adaptations sucked. The upcoming last airbender one is so unlike the original, the creators said they had nothing to do with it.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
danpmss
Joined: 30 May 2015
Posts: 777
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:51 am
|
|
|
| SpiritSmoocher wrote: | | The only people i have seen remotely defend these awful netflix adaptations are anitubers like trash taste and mother's basement; they are just shilling since netflix and anime companies sponsor them. The hypocrisy in saying acclaimed shows from disney sucks yet they are defending these netflix adaptations? Literally everyone i have seen from critics, fans, general audiences and regular tubers thought the netflix adaptations sucked. The upcoming last airbender one is so unlike the original, the creators said they had nothing to do with it. |
Which make me all the more interested for the One Piece one, Oda not only endorsed it, he is also acting as an executive producer for it and helping out with it every step of the way, and constantly hyping it up in his magazine commentaries for years now. I may not trust Netflix with live actions, but I do trust Oda. That's not to mention the entire production staff are big One Piece fans. The worse I can personally see happening would be the CGI not being well made tbh, which is not difficult to happen. Good CGI is [expletive] expensive, and One Piece would require SO MUCH.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
SHD
Joined: 05 Apr 2015
Posts: 1757
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:37 am
|
|
|
| Spawn29 wrote: | | It's dumb that to say that we don't need any more live action adaptions of anime and manga because of those when they made many great ones. I take it that you never seen Oldboy, Lone Wolf & Cub, Ichi the Killer, Lady Snowblood, Blue Spring, City Hunter, Riki Oh, and 20th Century Boys. |
I've never read the originals for Oldboy and Ichi, so I can't tell how they fare as adaptations (which is the point here), but Blue Spring is not only a great film, it's also a great adaptation. Generally, movie adaptations of manga tend to be better when the manga itself is already a more or less down to earth story.
| livin_large wrote: | | I would say Japan has a much better track record for live-action adaptions than America does. In Japan, if a live-action adaption is bad, it's usually because of technical, budgetary, or format reasons. In America, adaptions are usually bad because of intentional changes and blatant disregard for the source material and people not even pretending to care. |
I see you didn't read all those words I wrote about Japanese adaptations making intentional changes, blatantly disregarding the source material, and people not even pretending to care about creating an adaptation vs just using the basic concepts as a springboard/inspiration for doing their own thing...
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
livin_large
Joined: 10 Nov 2021
Posts: 107
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 9:35 am
|
|
|
| SHD wrote: | | I see you didn't read all those words I wrote about Japanese adaptations making intentional changes, blatantly disregarding the source material, and people not even pretending to care about creating an adaptation vs just using the basic concepts as a springboard/inspiration for doing their own thing... |
I read it, but I completely disagree with the notion that Nobunaga Concerto was in anyway as bad as you trying to say it was. A few plot points were changed, yes, but to compare that to stuff like Dragonball Evolution, Cowboy Bebop, or Death Note where they directly spit in the face of the original just makes no sense. The overall story, costume design, and set pieces were spot on. It's an especially odd example because I remember so many people saying to just watch the live-action series for Nobunaga Concerto back when the awful looking 3DCG anime came out. I mean, maybe there are Japanese live-actions like that that out there that I've never seen, but I've seen a lot of live-action adaptions and none of them really come close to acting like they're embarrassed by their source material like most American adaptions are where usually the first thing you hear about an adaption is the director is "updating it for a modern audience".
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
a_Bear_in_Bearcave
Joined: 14 Jan 2019
Posts: 537
Location: Poland
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 10:04 am
|
|
|
| SHD wrote: |
| Spawn29 wrote: | | It's dumb that to say that we don't need any more live action adaptions of anime and manga because of those when they made many great ones. I take it that you never seen Oldboy, Lone Wolf & Cub, Ichi the Killer, Lady Snowblood, Blue Spring, City Hunter, Riki Oh, and 20th Century Boys. |
I've never read the originals for Oldboy and Ichi, so I can't tell how they fare as adaptations (which is the point here), but Blue Spring is not only a great film, it's also a great adaptation. Generally, movie adaptations of manga tend to be better when the manga itself is already a more or less down to earth story.
|
I think adaptations of manga are more likely to be well-considered and based on whether the manga would make sense translated into TV language, much like book adaptations, while many of the anime-to-live-action adaptations seem to be based mainly on popularity of the source material. Besides, live adaptation of manga or novel can be at least said to add the possibility of experiencing the source material as an complete audiovisual spectacle, much like anime adaptation does, while adapting anime to live-action or vice-versa doesn't really add that much, because both media are somewhat similar, at least relatively to manga/comics or books. I'm more likely to question the quality and need for live adaptation of anime, especially one that is already good, than adaptation of light novel or manga.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Spawn29
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
Posts: 554
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:19 pm
|
|
|
|
If American comic book movies can be over the top and goofy, why can't a live action adaption of an anime and manga? Scott Pilgrim was not grounded at all, and it became a cult classic with the over the top flashy action sequences.They are the same medium by the end of the day.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
SHD
Joined: 05 Apr 2015
Posts: 1757
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:58 pm
|
|
|
| livin_large wrote: | | I read it, but I completely disagree with the notion that Nobunaga Concerto was in anyway as bad as you trying to say it was. A few plot points were changed, yes, but to compare that to stuff like Dragonball Evolution, Cowboy Bebop, or Death Note where they directly spit in the face of the original just makes no sense. |
"A few plot points were changed"? The entire plot was different, and what's more important, entire characters have lost their characterization and were given completely new personalities and roles! That show had nothing to do with Nobunaga Concerto aside of the very basic premise of "dude timeslipping, taking over Oda Nobunaga's role". And frankly I can't think of anything more true to the definition of directly spitting in the face of the original that a character whose core personality trait is his devotion and loyalty to another character being turned into a petty jealous villain scheming against that character, just because some TV writer thought that worked better for the show they wanted to create...
| livin_large wrote: | | [The overall story, costume design, and set pieces were spot on. |
Again: maybe it worked as a show on its own, but as an adaptation it was an absolute travesty. I mean, wow, costume design and set pieces were spot on, cool - the characters, their dynamics and relationships were completely unrecognizable, and a lot of stupid original material was forced into the story just because they're there in every TV drama ever, but hey, at least it all looked pretty!  Yay? What do you want from an adaptation, to be true to the original's spirit and message, or to have nice costume design and set pieces?
| livin_large wrote: | | It's an especially odd example because I remember so many people saying to just watch the live-action series for Nobunaga Concerto back when the awful looking 3DCG anime came out. |
Nah, the live action came out after the anime. Also, the anime was a really good show on its own - say what you want about the animation but it worked really well, also it had stellar voice acting (last good acting I've heard from Miyano Mamoru), great music, and really good writing. But also it was a really good adaptation as well: yes, it also changed many things about the manga, but it didn't destroy the characters, in fact it even elevated them at points. (As for the animation bothered me for about two episodes, after that I grew to really appreciate it. The faces never quite ended up working, but otherwise the way the rotoscoping allowed the animation to convey body language, movements, etc. so it didn't look all the same as in all other anime, was really good.)
The anime was an adaptation (and a good one at that). The live action series wasn't an adaptation, it was a "very loosely inspired by the basic premise of". I haven't seen anyone who liked the manga that enjoyed it.
| livin_large wrote: | | I've seen a lot of live-action adaptions and none of them really come close to acting like they're embarrassed by their source material like most American adaptions are where usually the first thing you hear about an adaption is the director is "updating it for a modern audience". |
Because they're not saying that. Most Japanese adaptations are not based on old stuff that needst o be "updated" anyway. But what they're actually doing is much the same idea: changing the story for a TV audience, turning it into something that they think works better for an audience that regularly watches TV live action but rarely reads manga, if at all. If you've seen a lot of live-action TV adaptations just think about all the tropes that keep repeating, all the typical roles and character types. A lot of the time this is not because the source material is like that - it's because the TV writer is just doing their own thing without any regard to the source material. Currently I'm low-key seething about the Rokuhoudou yotsuiro biyori live action adaptation, which yes, could be worse I suppose, but yet again it just basically applies TV drama tropes and templates on the manga and its characters, twisting their characterization to squeeze them into stereotypes, made-up roles they're not supposed be in, etc.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Swissman
Joined: 11 May 2006
Posts: 788
Location: Switzerland
|
|
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 2:08 pm
|
|
|
| SpiritSmoocher wrote: | | Literally everyone i have seen from critics, fans, general audiences and regular tubers thought the netflix adaptations sucked. |
I've only seen the first episode of the Cowboy Bebop live action adaption, and hey, I kinda liked it. The set designs were neat, the CGI was rather good for a TV series (I've seen way worse), Yôko Kanno's score was excellent as expected and the actors played their part reasonably well. Granted, the tone was different from the anime's first episode, but I knew that before watching the episode. My expectations were rather low initially, but I was rather pleased with what I saw. The only thing which bothered me was the actor who was chosen for Vicious. His looks don't fit anime Vicious at all.
(No, I probably won't watch further than the first episode. There's still a ton of good anime I want to watch first, and the still pictures of live action Ed gave me nightmares).
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
vampiyan
Joined: 25 Oct 2021
Posts: 64
|
|
Posted: Sat Feb 05, 2022 3:41 am
|
|
|
| SHD wrote: | [but hey, at least it all looked pretty! Yay? What do you want from an adaptation, to be true to the original's spirit and message, or to have nice costume design and set pieces? |
To be fair that's already better than the average Hollywood adaption  No people bending over backwards to defend bland MCU and DCCU aesthetic because "accurate costumes would look silly in real life" or something. I never read or watched Nobunaga Concerto, but I've seen a few others. I applause the Jojo and Kakegurui live-actions for going all in on their crazy, wacky aesthetics and anime-isms. Joriku came out in 2020 and despite it not being a good movie, the spirit was there. They didn't shy away from it being based on a sex comedy manga filled with ecchi and sexual content, and even promoted the film with sexy photoshoots of the girls in their gym uniforms. Somehow I doubt the upcoming She-Hulk series is going to embrace the comic's fun and sexual origins and not just make her into another Captain Marvel. And something tells me Nami in this One Piece live-action is going to go through a very similar situation that Faye did.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
SpiritSmoocher
Joined: 06 Mar 2021
Posts: 182
|
|
Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2022 1:35 am
|
|
|
| Swissman wrote: |
| SpiritSmoocher wrote: | | Literally everyone i have seen from critics, fans, general audiences and regular tubers thought the netflix adaptations sucked. |
I've only seen the first episode of the Cowboy Bebop live action adaption, and hey, I kinda liked it. The set designs were neat, the CGI was rather good for a TV series (I've seen way worse), Yôko Kanno's score was excellent as expected and the actors played their part reasonably well. Granted, the tone was different from the anime's first episode, but I knew that before watching the episode. My expectations were rather low initially, but I was rather pleased with what I saw. The only thing which bothered me was the actor who was chosen for Vicious. His looks don't fit anime Vicious at all.
(No, I probably won't watch further than the first episode. There's still a ton of good anime I want to watch first, and the still pictures of live action Ed gave me nightmares). |
Glad you like it, but for me it is more unbearable to watch than the cw. The action and tone just isnt gripping, and the dialogue and one liners feels like it is a bad comedy vs a good drama. How they characterized faye to resemble twitter is like the cherry on top. Once you see hit sci fi shows like the mandalorian or to a lesser extent the mcu ones, you will have new standards and see how underwhelming netflix cowboy bebop is. This is why i said anitubers shilled so hard for this whereas everyone else said it sucked. Anitubers largely do not watch good television outside anime so their standards for live action r low. Plus netflix probably bought them over to promote this.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
