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theAnimeBoy
Joined: 28 Sep 2021
Posts: 1
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 Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2021 11:44 pm
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This has given me so much information about lily and yugiri, as a Zombieland Saga fan. can you please tell me when this interview happened and where i can watch it? 
And does this relate to the new concert and season 3/movie???
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Ginka8
Joined: 08 May 2019
Posts: 11
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:18 am
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| theAnimeBoy wrote: | This has given me so much information about lily and yugiri, as a Zombieland Saga fan. can you please tell me when this interview happened and where i can watch it?
And does this relate to the new concert and season 3/movie??? |
It was made by Mipon. The link to the interview is in the article.
https://mipon.org/interview-zombie-land-saga-producer-and-writer/
The interview was held on June 9, 2021.
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Rentwo
Joined: 05 Oct 2019
Posts: 184
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 4:27 am
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In response to Takenaka-san's statement on otokonoko idol characters, PriPara beat them to the punch with Reona in 2014 so Lily isn't the first instance of that idea. I'm sure Reona isn't the first either, but it's the one that immediately came to mind when I read them not being aware if the character archetype had been done before.
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pachy_boy
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1335
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 6:37 am
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After reading the full interview--Nice to know that they were at least considering what Tae's identity would be. I'm aware that there are fans that want her to stay the way she is because that's part of her appeal--but with pretty much all the girls being more than they appear to be and having depth to them, it just doesn't feel fair that Tae continues being relegated as the silent comedy relief character without us knowing anything about her. Hopefully they'll finally explore that in a possible Season 3--which feels like it better happen, with all the intriguing indications they've set up at the end of Season 2.
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Dayraven
Joined: 21 Jul 2021
Posts: 183
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 7:13 am
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| Quote: | | it just doesn't feel fair that Tae continues being relegated as the silent comedy relief character without us knowing anything about her. |
There’s a spinoff manga which gives (presumably canon) details about Tae in life. She was the Legendary Office Lady Warrior and led a group if demon hunters. Though a reveal that she’s as awakened as any of the others and is simply like that would’ve been funny instead.
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Kenshino Kenmura
Joined: 13 Sep 2017
Posts: 7
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 7:28 am
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| Rentwo wrote: | | In response to Takenaka-san's statement on otokonoko idol characters, PriPara beat them to the punch with Reona in 2014 so Lily isn't the first instance of that idea. I'm sure Reona isn't the first either, but it's the one that immediately came to mind when I read them not being aware if the character archetype had been done before. |
Yeah it's nothing new. I just hate that certain people act like it's something ground breaking and "splushing" all over it.
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chuckl
Joined: 07 Feb 2011
Posts: 10
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 7:57 am
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| Kenshino Kenmura wrote: |
| Rentwo wrote: | | In response to Takenaka-san's statement on otokonoko idol characters, PriPara beat them to the punch with Reona in 2014 so Lily isn't the first instance of that idea. I'm sure Reona isn't the first either, but it's the one that immediately came to mind when I read them not being aware if the character archetype had been done before. |
Yeah it's nothing new. I just hate that certain people act like it's something ground breaking and "splushing" all over it. |
I don't think it's the same thing- Reona and Lily are 2 different types of characters.
PriPara doesn't really go into it (as far as I know- I've only seen a little of it). Reona seems to be male, but is a really good crossdresser, helping out his sister. He definitely has fans because of it, but the show doesn't make it a big deal.
Lilly is Trans, definitely female, and a strong character- that's resonated with a lot of people. The characters might not take this as a big deal, but the show definitely has, and Lily has a pretty big following as a result.
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pachy_boy
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1335
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 8:47 am
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| Dayraven wrote: | | There’s a spinoff manga which gives (presumably canon) details about Tae in life. She was the Legendary Office Lady Warrior and led a group if demon hunters. Though a reveal that she’s as awakened as any of the others and is simply like that would’ve been funny instead. |
If Tae was supposedly always this way, wouldn't that indicate she was mentally handicapped to a degree in life? I'm not saying this to be insensitive, but given how Tae behaves wouldn't that be the implication if this was the case?
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Cardcaptor Takato
Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 5162
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 11:50 am
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| Kenshino Kenmura wrote: | |
Yeah it's nothing new. I just hate that certain people act like it's something ground breaking and "splushing" all over it. |
So I see now people have gone from denying Lily is trans to trying to downplay the significance of Lily's character to modern anime fans. What does it matter to you that over people "splush" over seeing themselves represented in a well loved modern mainstream anime?
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ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 02 May 2011
Posts: 3028
Location: Email for assistance only
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:58 pm
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Otokonoko is a term primarily to describe a fetish/fetish characters. Lily is trans and the distinction is important. I'm hoping this is a case of ignorance and not willfully ignoring the creators' statements.
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Rentwo
Joined: 05 Oct 2019
Posts: 184
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 1:24 pm
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| ANN_Lynzee wrote: | | Otokonoko is a term primarily to describe a fetish/fetish characters. Lily is trans and the distinction is important. I'm hoping this is a case of ignorance and not willfully ignoring the creators' statements. |
I used it because the original Mipon article used it.
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Juno016
Joined: 09 Jan 2012
Posts: 2420
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 1:57 pm
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| ANN_Lynzee wrote: |
Otokonoko is a term primarily to describe a fetish/fetish characters. Lily is trans and the distinction is important. I'm hoping this is a case of ignorance and not willfully ignoring the creators' statements. |
The creators have repeatedly called Lily an "otokonoko", including in this interview. "Otokonoko" is a complicated term in anime(etc.). Japanese people never respectfully refer to real trans people with the term, but in the anime(etc.) community in Japan, characters like Lily are often referred to as such, even when regarded highly by the trans community. It's even used in Hourou Musuko a few times. As a trans person myself, I feel like it's a byproduct of blissful ignorance, not intended to be disrespectful (even if it is). Even in Re:Zero, Ferris in the novels very explicitely tells themself in the mirror, "I'm a pretty girl!" over and over at the start of every day, is deeply relieved with their mother's heredity giving them a feminine figure and no body/facial hair (dysphoria, anyone?), and treats their old name like a dead name, but is still the butt of "Actually I'm a boy" jokes. The aforementioned details are revealed in a chapter in the first EX novel called "Felix Argyle is a Pretty Boy", which itself dead names and potentially misgenders them (if you interpret them as trans). Doesn't necessarily mean Ferris is *actually* trans like Lily here, but it is another likely example of what comes from living in a culture where realistic LGBTQ+ portrayals in media are lacking.
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ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 02 May 2011
Posts: 3028
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 2:01 pm
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I appreciate the explanation and apologies for the previous comment. I'd ever only seen the word used as say, a tag on pixiv for certain kinds of art, and thought it was more closely approximated to cross-dressing enthusiasts instead of someone who is trans.
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Juno016
Joined: 09 Jan 2012
Posts: 2420
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 3:37 pm
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| ANN_Lynzee wrote: | | I appreciate the explanation and apologies for the previous comment. I'd ever only seen the word used as say, a tag on pixiv for certain kinds of art, and thought it was more closely approximated to cross-dressing enthusiasts instead of someone who is trans. |
To be fair and to avoid confusion, you're not wrong about it being disrespectful or fetishistic. From experience, many trans women in Japan don't like being called "otokonoko", much like how most English-speaking trans women consider "trap" a slur. But I definitely think the creators themselves are unaware of this (they talked about needing to be careful and respectful in their portrayal of the character) and used the word blissfully ignorant of its misleading connotations. If you're a trans person in Japan who never sees good representation in domestic media, Lily's portrayal is ultimately a win, so hearing the creators refer to her as an "otokonoko" is probably worth a mildly frustrated sigh and a shrug. I wouldn't fault anyone for its usage unless they meant it deliberately to deny one's identity.
My Ferris example was simply to illustrate that this blissful ignorance is common in a lot of well-meaning and even well-written media portrayals, so I don't think it's done in malice. Hourou Musuko is a spectacular trans-positive and trans-focused work, but it's writer, while LGBTQ+, is not trans herself, so hervusage of the word is similarly problematic. Even classics like "Stop! Hibari-kun!", which avoid using their well-written trans women as a joke most of the time, still fall into the same trap now and then.
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Ginka8
Joined: 08 May 2019
Posts: 11
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Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:12 pm
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| Juno016 wrote: |
| ANN_Lynzee wrote: |
Otokonoko is a term primarily to describe a fetish/fetish characters. Lily is trans and the distinction is important. I'm hoping this is a case of ignorance and not willfully ignoring the creators' statements. |
The creators have repeatedly called Lily an "otokonoko", including in this interview. |
Would you please be so kind as to give me links to those interviews? I am very curious about it.
Also, I am rather sure that it is Mipon's side that says ''Otokonoko'' in their questions. Not the authors referring to it directly.
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