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Answerman - Why Are Big Hollywood Studios Buying Anime Distributors?


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Manga Producer J.M.



Joined: 12 Aug 2018
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Location: Longwood, FL, United States
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:55 am Reply with quote
ultimatehaki wrote:
War. War never changes.


Just logging in really.
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Manga Producer J.M.



Joined: 12 Aug 2018
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:43 am Reply with quote
Doesn't the reverse have to happen first? Twisted Evil
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Agent355



Joined: 12 Dec 2008
Posts: 5113
Location: Crackberry in hand, thumbs at the ready...
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 1:22 pm Reply with quote
macattack wrote:
TheAnimeRevolutionizer wrote:
Do they not know that their originating medium gave way to their beloved cash cows? And that their medium helped make sequential art an actual thing? Do they not have an ounce of creativity and fighting drive to make a statement in this world?

I know they have a deal in China and they are big in Japan, but what they are doing is suicide, and as you've stated, it appears they want to do it.

Pitiful and pathetic.


Disney is farming out limited Marvel rights to indie publisher IDW in the coming months. If that isn't a sign of what is coming, I don't know what is.

Look at it this way, they're doing that to target the middle grade market, which some analysts think is the fastest growing market in book publishing in general, and graphic novels in particular. If we want their comics to do well in comic form, they have to reach kids, and if IDW has the authors to cater to kids, this is a brilliant business move.

The *bad* business move is to keep pretending it's the '80s and continue to focus primarily on adults via Diamond distributed floppies in specialty comic book shop. That has been an outdated business practice for decades now!
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Jose Cruz



Joined: 20 Nov 2012
Posts: 1796
Location: South America
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:11 pm Reply with quote
I_Drive_DSM wrote:
I haven't had cable television for going on SEVEN years now. Seven. It was difficult at first but then all the major stations in the US on air went digital. My city gets nearly 80 air channels just using an antenna (Mohu Leaf, which was well worth the purchase). There's really no reason to have 700 channels and me not even watch 695 of them.

Plus like you state most all smart TVs nowadays have apps or can cast from your phone.
All of my TVs can cast or have apps. When you have free streaming services like YouTube at your disposal for free that you can watch on a 4K TV it's kind of hard to justify cable. Networks like CBS and the like push free channels on TV apps and Roku as well.

I do pay for Crunchyroll (it's a pretty good service despite any of the 'normie' memes people want to post) and I pay for a free other services. However combined they're drastically less than even most basic cable packages, and that's with near unlimited content that's not held down by cable TV slots.


I don't have cable since 2010, that's over 8 years now. There is no reason to have cable specially now that a much higher variety of stuff is available in streaming.

DeTroyes wrote:
Jose Cruz wrote:
In a decade companies like Netflix and Amazon will eventually wipe out the likes of Disney/Paramount/20th century Fox/Columbia Pictures.


Someone still has to make the content to feed the ravenous hordes. I agree the movie companies are likely to be moving away from motion pictures, but they're still well positioned to produce original content.


Netflix is already investing in the production of more content than any Hollywood studio:

https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/03/11/netflixs-8-billion-content-budget-to-fund-700-tv-s.aspx

So in number of hours of film produced Netflix is already bigger than all major Hollywood studios combined.

And in a few years Netflix's original stuff will be more popular than the combined properties of all Hollywood studios. Hell, it already is: people talk way more about Stranger Things than they talk about the latest crappy cliche-packed Hollywood special effects movie.

Hollywood studios are a slowly dying. They survive currently on producing 200 million dollars braindead special effects movies for teenagers because that's the only thing that still works better in cinema screens mostly thanks to their sound systems and sometimes 3D stuff, essentially it's the last corner of the entertainment market that they control.

But in a few years the multiseason netflix shows will have the same special effects quality so their industry will become fully obsolete. By that point in time I expect these companies to either evolve radically which they are already doing into being essentially a different kind of company than they were a decade ago or just do bankrupt, anyway it's the same outcome.

Top Gun wrote:
This is such a bizarre viewpoint. Unless you are absurdly rich and have a huge amount of interior space, there's no universe in which even a higher-end home-theater setup can duplicate the scale and power of a theater screening, and the majority of us out there don't even have anything resembling an actual "home theater." Likewise, CDs to this day remain by far the most convenient means of getting the highest-quality audio in DRM-free format, content that doesn't vanish when a subscription runs out. (Not that that seems to stop people from willingly choosing inferior quality: the fact that people are willing to sit through a movie viewed on a 4-inch screen utterly blows my mind.)


I personally find a typical current LED TV to be better than typical movie theater screens. Anyway, digital movie screens often have the same resolution and to be the image looks worse. Frankly, I don't understand this obsession with movie theaters: it's just a big room for a large group of people to watch a big TV screen together whose image has lower quality than a 200 dollar LED TV.
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Lord Oink



Joined: 06 Jul 2016
Posts: 876
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:54 pm Reply with quote
Agent355 wrote:
Look at it this way, they're doing that to target the middle grade market, which some analysts think is the fastest growing market in book publishing in general, and graphic novels in particular. If we want their comics to do well in comic form, they have to reach kids, and if IDW has the authors to cater to kids, this is a brilliant business move.

The *bad* business move is to keep pretending it's the '80s and continue to focus primarily on adults via Diamond distributed floppies in specialty comic book shop. That has been an outdated business practice for decades now!


You act as if they haven't already tried that. They've hired tons of people who don't write comics to write comics over the past decade because they want other audiences to flock to comics, like YA authors and bloggers. But they never do. They always end up making the lowest selling Marvel books out there because those people don't read comics.

If comic book shops die, comics die. Marvel farming licenses out to IDW can not be interpreted as anything positive. IDW is a floundering company. Why would Marvel go to them if they wanted a bigger audience? Various people, the head CEO included, have been jumping ship from IDW for the past few months, and their profits are in the toilet.
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leafy sea dragon



Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Posts: 7163
Location: Another Kingdom
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:18 pm Reply with quote
Lord Oink wrote:
If comic book shops die, comics die. Marvel farming licenses out to IDW can not be interpreted as anything positive. IDW is a floundering company. Why would Marvel go to them if they wanted a bigger audience? Various people, the head CEO included, have been jumping ship from IDW for the past few months, and their profits are in the toilet.


After a quick look, I can't find anything about IDW's financial status. All I can really find are sales numbers and a list of acquisitions that IDW has had (which can be inferred by walking into a comic book shop...or, in my case, the Frank & Son Collectible Show).

Archie Comics does not do the standard distribution for their central lines though, so if comic book shops go, people will continue to see Archie on shelves at supermarkets and convenience stores and such. If comic book shops go, though, I'm certain the publishers will find alternate means to sell them. Pinball's still going, for instance, even though arcades are very hard to come by nowadays.

Jose Cruz wrote:
I personally find a typical current LED TV to be better than typical movie theater screens. Anyway, digital movie screens often have the same resolution and to be the image looks worse. Frankly, I don't understand this obsession with movie theaters: it's just a big room for a large group of people to watch a big TV screen together whose image has lower quality than a 200 dollar LED TV.


Because you can't fit 250 people into your room.

Also, the screen is enormous! The experience is definitely very different when it comes to movie theaters versus home entertainment systems (and costs a lot less to buy tickets than the buy all the appliances and living room space). It's not about the resolution. It's about getting a larger-than-life experience. The Avengers: Infinity War just isn't the same on a private TV screen as it is on a screen 20 meters wide. That is, people aren't going to a movie theater for any sense of a higher resolution--heck, the most-used TV in my house has broken HDMI, so I watch everything on it in standard 480. They want the pictures to be big, the sound to be booming, and so they can spill their popcorn and not have to clean it up afterwards. (But please don't do that on purpose. People who work in movie theaters are rushed and pressured enough as they are.)

Also, movies are released in theaters first. By the time they're available outside of theaters, they're old news.

What you're saying is analogous to it being pointless to go to amusement parks and theme parks because you can replicate that experience at home playing video games.
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Alan45
Village Elder



Joined: 25 Aug 2010
Posts: 10015
Location: Virginia
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 9:15 pm Reply with quote
@leafy sea dragon

On the subject of home theater vs. Movie Theater, I think it comes down to personal preference. Yes, for some movies the large screen is a good thing, but the mob of people, the excessively loud sound, the overpriced tasteless popcorn, the sticky floor ... These are all things I avoid if at all possible. In any case, I'm not watching the Avengers or anything else Marvel, I'm watching anime and for that my living room is perfectly adequate.

Basically, different strokes for different folks. Cool

In this connection, I should point out that many of the movie screens here are nowhere near that big (lots of little screens). Also they don't show anime in theaters any closer than a four hour drive from here (if traffic is light).
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lumclaw



Joined: 09 Jun 2010
Posts: 47
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:12 pm Reply with quote
Lord Oink wrote:
You act as if they haven't already tried that. They've hired tons of people who don't write comics to write comics over the past decade because they want other audiences to flock to comics, like YA authors and bloggers. But they never do. They always end up making the lowest selling Marvel books out there because those people don't read comics.

If comic book shops die, comics die. Marvel farming licenses out to IDW can not be interpreted as anything positive. IDW is a floundering company. Why would Marvel go to them if they wanted a bigger audience? Various people, the head CEO included, have been jumping ship from IDW for the past few months, and their profits are in the toilet.


Comic shops dying will kill creativity, especially foreign and special interest books.
But at the same time they should embrace the mass exposure other avenues offer. You don't get much more traffic for people who impulse buy anything than Walmart. Laughing
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TheAnimeRevolutionizer



Joined: 03 Nov 2017
Posts: 329
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:11 am Reply with quote
Lord Oink wrote:
Agent355 wrote:
Look at it this way, they're doing that to target the middle grade market, which some analysts think is the fastest growing market in book publishing in general, and graphic novels in particular. If we want their comics to do well in comic form, they have to reach kids, and if IDW has the authors to cater to kids, this is a brilliant business move.

The *bad* business move is to keep pretending it's the '80s and continue to focus primarily on adults via Diamond distributed floppies in specialty comic book shop. That has been an outdated business practice for decades now!


You act as if they haven't already tried that. They've hired tons of people who don't write comics to write comics over the past decade because they want other audiences to flock to comics, like YA authors and bloggers. But they never do. They always end up making the lowest selling Marvel books out there because those people don't read comics.

If comic book shops die, comics die. Marvel farming licenses out to IDW can not be interpreted as anything positive. IDW is a floundering company. Why would Marvel go to them if they wanted a bigger audience? Various people, the head CEO included, have been jumping ship from IDW for the past few months, and their profits are in the toilet.


The same thought keeps ringing in my head as I shake it in disappointment: "Don't they study or want to truly understand what makes manga truly what it is, and come to a realization within themselves?"

Honestly, as much flak and garbage I gave the Marvel Mangaverse, I gave it harsh criticism because it could have worked. There were dozens upon dozens of anime series and even video games to study up on and realize why the anime craze was as crazy awesome as it was, and they could have done that to their own series to make anime and manga adaptations.

And with that answer of how comics still to this day can't grasp it, that just tears it.

Like do they really think that the comics movie gravy train will keep on going into the far future? As the saying goes, "As one declares plans for the future, all of the gods in the heavens, all of the demons in the shadows, and even the mice in the floorboards laugh in jest." It will not last forever. I don't care if Ike Perlmutter sold his sold to Lucifer himself to keep this train on truckin'. Without Marvel being able to garner new talent and creativity, they have no contingency plan when the whole damn thing derails. Ike Perlmutter will most likely walk with the cash from the scene, but at that point Marvel will no longer exist.

And Hollywood wants anime adaptations to ride on that deathtrap? They want to have a little piece of the pie because all of a sudden now anime is decidedly "profitable?" Even Japan is growing as we speak in getting better at making anime adaptations. Now they come begging not just for anime live action adaptations, but also streaming and licensing rights? I have a better idea: They can do as Steven Tyler said and "stick that grey poupon up [their] @$$" because I exactly know where that train's going.

I know I'm going off of my rocker, but this has ground my gears since the mid 2000s. It's all me, but as much as anime made cash back in that crash landing in the 1990s into the US, it took a lot more than just throwing ideas out into the air and hoping some of them would fly with success. Yeah, Japan is totalitarian and draconian in some ways, but I can at least say that there is still a chance of you being able to get a manga out and that there is not just an industry and a market, but also the community and sociocultural infrastructure to cultivate it. That's inspiring. That's awesome and amazing. That's a hope any can put faith into and work towards. That's what will make you not just money, but respect and integrity.

It's true. It is a path of long, hard work and with the certainty of hardship and pain. But such is of all paths of life. Anime wasn't successful because it was an easy way out. Anime was successful because of people who put their integrity and effort into it regardless of what medium and style it was. They told their stories through it and they decided it to be that way, because that was the path they walked and had to walk forward on everyday, and they pushed it out and kept it that way, adaptation or original work, success or failure. They wanted it to be portrayed via anime and manga, and that kind of dedication is what keeps an industry and culture thriving. It's not something you can fix with talented writers of another medium of art with a good amount of pay alone, and especially neither with merely targeting demographics. It requires spirit and enthusiasm and the individuals who have it, and who will keep on going no matter how rocky and haphazard the path is up ahead. It requires those kinds of people to inspire and open new doors with their experiences and stories and art they communicate with, and not solely for a paycheck.

Comics still have yet to walk this path and rebuild its empire back from square one, and clean up its mess from the mid 1990s. What they are doing now isn't what is demanded of them, nor the example that anyone wants to follow. Anime Hollywood adaptations may be out there, but they have a safety net. Comics don't. And considering how the ugly side of big corporate America wants to control that net, they can back the hell off and get the @#%# out.
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Agent355



Joined: 12 Dec 2008
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Location: Crackberry in hand, thumbs at the ready...
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:29 am Reply with quote
Lord Oink wrote:
You act as if they haven't already tried that. They've hired tons of people who don't write comics to write comics over the past decade because they want other audiences to flock to comics, like YA authors and bloggers. But they never do. They always end up making the lowest selling Marvel books out there because those people don't read comics.

There are a lot of comic writers and artists who specialize in material for kids. And what they write sells well--better than graphic novels for adults.
Lord Oink wrote:

If comic book shops die, comics die. Marvel farming licenses out to IDW can not be interpreted as anything positive. IDW is a floundering company. Why would Marvel go to them if they wanted a bigger audience? Various people, the head CEO included, have been jumping ship from IDW for the past few months, and their profits are in the toilet.

lumclaw wrote:


Comic shops dying will kill creativity, especially foreign and special interest books.
But at the same time they should embrace the mass exposure other avenues offer. You don't get much more traffic for people who impulse buy anything than Walmart. Laughing

leafy sea dragon wrote:

After a quick look, I can't find anything about IDW's financial status. All I can really find are sales numbers and a list of acquisitions that IDW has had (which can be inferred by walking into a comic book shop...or, in my case, the Frank & Son Collectible Show).

Archie Comics does not do the standard distribution for their central lines though, so if comic book shops go, people will continue to see Archie on shelves at supermarkets and convenience stores and such. If comic book shops go, though, I'm certain the publishers will find alternate means to sell them. Pinball's still going, for instance, even though arcades are very hard to come by nowadays.

Why are none of you considering Barnes & Noble as a place where people (especially families with children) get comics?
Barnes & Noble expanded their graphic novel and manga shelf space in 2015, citing strong sales (source: www.barnesandnobleinc.com/press-release/7_8_15_expanded_graphic_novels_manga/). They recently announced a new section just for graphic novels aimed at kids aged 7-12. (Source: https://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/by-topic/childrens/childrens-industry-news/article/77358-b-n-to-create-kids-graphic-novel-sections-in-all-its-stores.html) I don't know about IDW's business practices, but if they can get Marvel characters in that section of Barnes & Noble stores, they stand to make money (on another note, I have never seen any hard evidence that Marvel comics aimed at teens are poor sellers, at least not in their graphic novel paperback and digital formats.)
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leafy sea dragon



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:54 am Reply with quote
Yeah, you're absolutely right. I suppose the reason I wasn't thinking about Barnes & Noble is because I live in what was formerly Borders territory, and when Borders went out of business, nothing really came by to take its place. I still go to Barnes & Noble, as well as independent bookstores, and honestly, I buy most of my comic books from them, not counting the used market (albeit in graphic novel form, which is how I prefer to get them).
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Agent355



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:06 pm Reply with quote
^Not you specifically, but when most old school comic fans think of "comics" they think of floppies at comic shops, despite trade paperback collections, graphic novels, and digital selling better than floppies for at least 20 years. It doesn't help that, as far as I know, Marvel and DC never seem to release their Comixology numbers, and the other sales indicators for trade paperbacks, like Bookscan, being incomplete because they don't cover all sales data. But trade paperbacks sell better than floppies, and fans and the industry ignore that for reasons I can not fathom--do they want comics to go extinct?
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yuna49



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 4:36 pm Reply with quote
Jose Cruz wrote:
There is no reason to have cable specially now that a much higher variety of stuff is available in streaming.

Please stop making sweeping statements like that. That's your experience, but it's not everyone's. It's pretty difficult if not impossible to watch live sports unless you have cable or a cable-like substitute like Playstation Vue. Sometimes you can buy a package that lets you watch out-of-market games via streaming, but that doesn't help if you live in the same market as the teams you are following. I follow the Red Sox, the Celtics, and the LPGA on a regular basis and need NESN, NBCSports Boston, and The Golf Channel to watch them live.
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Jose Cruz



Joined: 20 Nov 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:22 pm Reply with quote
yuna49 wrote:
Jose Cruz wrote:
There is no reason to have cable specially now that a much higher variety of stuff is available in streaming.

Please stop making sweeping statements like that. That's your experience, but it's not everyone's. It's pretty difficult if not impossible to watch live sports unless you have cable or a cable-like substitute like Playstation Vue. Sometimes you can buy a package that lets you watch out-of-market games via streaming, but that doesn't help if you live in the same market as the teams you are following. I follow the Red Sox, the Celtics, and the LPGA on a regular basis and need NESN, NBCSports Boston, and The Golf Channel to watch them live.


I follow my Brazilian soccer team even though I live in North America through streaming services. Without streaming I wouldn't be even able to follow the Brazilian soccer league since I don't know any cable service that airs all matches of the Brazilian soccer league in North America.
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matt78



Joined: 25 Jul 2015
Posts: 262
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:29 am Reply with quote
Jose Cruz wrote:
I follow my Brazilian soccer team even though I live in North America through streaming services. Without streaming I wouldn't be even able to follow the Brazilian soccer league since I don't know any cable service that airs all matches of the Brazilian soccer league in North America.



That is different though. You are watching something that no one owns TV rights for. Cable companies pay billions of dollars for the TV rights to pro and collegiate sports. They want you to watch on their TV stations so that they can recoup their costs through advertising dollars. Even if they would allow streaming you would most likely be required to have cable to be able to view the games.
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