Forum - View topicFiller episodes?
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r-18
 Posts: 62 Location: northren oregon |
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I have been watching anime for a very long time and only recently began to read about it on forums. What i don't understand is the animosity directed at " filler " episodes. I don't read manga I've tried but just don't find i enjoy what looks like an storyboard. why do anime fans feel that an anime must slavishly fallow the anime that is it's inspiration, if the episode is entertaining and keeps close to character for the other episodes then what else do you want from an anime? This whole thing came from all the hate poured on the bount arc of bleach. I saw the whole arc and found it at least as entertaining as the rescue rukia arc. I also notice while dislikeing
" filler " most fans fall all over themselves for movies based on anime like memories of nobody which are " filler " ( note: i don't read manga so i can't really say it was filler as it may have been in the manga. ) So in short filler why the hate? [EDIT: No need for all caps in thread title.~Zalis] |
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Killtheshrew
 Posts: 118 |
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I've never really understood the hate, I find that these episodes are where the character is developed, where you learn if you love or hate them.
I've always considered the Tessa (OAV) from FMP:SR to have all the qualities a filler episode would have but it's excellent. It's a shame if they drag and don't go anywhere but the sign of a good show to me is if I can happily watch an obvious "filler" episode and not become bored. |
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Boomerang Flash
 Posts: 1021 |
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The hate isn't difficult to understand. The people of whom you speak generally work from the following postulate: If the structure of a series is non-episodic, then contributing meaningfully to the rest of the series is a requirement for any episodes or arcs to be considered good. If you accept this as the basis of your assessment, then you are forced to give a grade to filler arcs. Although there are exceptions, most filler arcs are self-contained and can be removed from the continuity with either no edits or minor edits. Therefore, they do not contribute meaningfully to the plot. Therefore, by the filler haters' assumption, then, the episodes or arcs are not good.
This applies particularly well to the filler arcs of the type you are describing. In most cases where filler arcs are inserted into long running anime series that are based on the manga, the animators intend to resume following the manga once sufficient material has been published to allow for any substance. Since they intend to rejoin the manga, the filler arcs should not make any significant changes to the characters and settings, or it will be difficult to rejoin the manga. Thus, the fillers you are describing will generally be considered no good if you start from the postulate I stated at the beginning. |
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HitokiriShadow
 Posts: 6251 |
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Filler gets a lot of hate because it generally ranges from sub-par to utterly awful. This doesn't mean it can't be good (I'm actually enjoying the current Bleach filler arc more than most of the 20 episodes that preceded it) but it usually is, at the very least, not as good as the canon material.
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x-tengentoppa-x
 Posts: 25 Location: I go where the wind blows |
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it's really just a waste of an episode if it's completely pointless and really stupid
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musk.stick
Posts: 42 |
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Filler is better than those "clip shows" some series are so fond of.
I really don't mind a bit of filler every now and again, but I can understand how it can be annoying - especially if there's more filler episodes than those that actually contribute to the plot. That being said, I think filler episodes need to have their own charm - whether it be humour, a more in depth look at a character etc. - for them to be tolerable. |
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TheTheory
 Posts: 1029 Location: Central PA |
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There are some fans who are against filler solely because it deviates from the manga. However, I think most people are against it simply because most of the time it signifies a significant drop in quality. When you can point out a filler episode (or series of episodes) without having read the manga or knowing in advance... then you know the quality is just not there. And that drop in quality, more than the deviation from the original source, is what is loathsome about filler.
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Aura Ichadora
 Posts: 2302 Location: In front of my computer |
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Meh, I don't see a problem with filler. I like the fillers with Naruto; I think they are awesome. Some are more amusing than others (curry of life is my favorite so far), but still amusing all the same. And I think (from what I've heard) Naruto: Shippuuden is in fillers right now, and I haven't heard much complaints about those.
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Eruanna
 Posts: 451 Location: Canada |
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I dont really watch a lot of series that run long enough to HAVE "filler episodes", since I generally stick with the typical 24-26 episode long series. The shorter the better actually, because I like having the feel of knowing the entire story so I can look back on it in its completness. I avoid long running series, anything over 30 episodes, like the plague (Thats a GENERAL rule.. there are some exceptions)
Lately I have been watching Shugo Chara! which is a longer series then I am accostumed to.... so I have been experiancing "filler" episodes. I must say I dont really mind them... I hear people talking about them all like "Meh, its just another stupid filler episode"..... and to be honest I probably wouldnt even have noticed that they were "filler" if someone hadnt pointed it out. I find them just as charming as the series as a whole. BUT, I can understand the dislike, because fillers dont tend to advance the plot in any meaningfull way. People get impatient because they want to know what would happen next and then theyve waited all week to see the next episode and instead of going after the bad guys they spend a whole episode baking a cake! Rawr! Like I said, I personally dont mind it. Fluff is charming in its own way. But I can understand why some people get annoyed with it. |
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zawa113
 Posts: 7358 |
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I seem to have a love-hate thing going on with fillers too.
When I was watching Bleach (havn't seen a new one since the early 150's ep), it annoyed me that nothing new was coming out. I think the worst of those fillers was the one where spoiler[Ikkaku was doing kendo with the high schoolers or something], that just bored me to tears, but the one where they spoiler[ baked a cake for the dead guy, regardless of how similar I thought that was to a Kekkaishi plotline,] at least kept me entertained. But then, I also think good filler can be pretty good. I would call my favorite filler episode ever (as I define filler an episode that doesn't occur in the original source and/or doesn't advance the plot/characters even if it was in the orignal manga) being from DBZ. In between the Freiza and Cell sagas, when they had the Garlic Jr. filler saga, they also had an episode where Chi-chi made Goku and Piccolo attempt to get spoiler[drivers liscences.] I could not stop laughing during this because Goku and Piccolo were just so bad at it, it was funny. Not to mention they didn't actually succeed. But, if the Garlic Jr saga from DBZ and the Bount arc from Bleach were to count as fillers, I don't really have a problem with them. They make an overal cohesive story, they're interesting enough, and they still have battles. Then again, by my previous defintion of filler, I've seen entire shows or read entire manga series that could be defined as filler, namely Mushi-shi and large chunks of Maison Ikkoku. Given that Mushi-shi doesn't even have an overall plot, I viewed everything as really good episodic filler-like material. While some chapter of Maison Ikkoku definatly move the plot, there are also many that don't move the plot or reveal anything new about the characters. I still had a blast reading these anyway. In the end, if a whole show has a lot of fun filler (usually a comedy) or is episodic and feels like filler, then I won't have a problem with it. However, if a fairly long show takes months off from the actual interesting plot at a time (not just one or two eps, which is fine), then that annoys me. The fact that Bleach even introduced a new character for its filler arc made it even more annoying to me (which told me they had this planned pretty well). An interesting and fun divergence is fine by me, but they shouldn't lump a whole bunch of them together. Too bad anime doesn't air in season like TV does in the states. |
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Top Gun
 Posts: 4788 |
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Any definition of "filler" that would include something like Mushi-shi isn't a very good one to begin with. There's a huge difference between a show like that or Cowboy Bebop that's intentionally episodic in nature, and a show like Bleach or Naruto that consists of time-killing original material interspersed between narrative arcs. That's even ignoring the more generally-accepted definition that applies to any content that wasn't in the original manga a series is based on but was created to prevent a series from catching up to its manga source. (Something like Fullmetal Alchemist wouldn't apply here, since its second half was intentionally created as completely divergent from the still-ongoing manga.) The term "filler" is thrown around a lot, but it often becomes difficult to discern exactly what definition the person using it is applying. |
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Veoryn87
 Posts: 808 |
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I would consider the episodes in something like Mushi-shi, Cowboy Bebop, or even some of the episodes of GITS: SAC to be "stand-alone." Top Gun already gives a good description on the differences between that and "filler." To some people filler is anything that's not in the manga. To me filler is an episode or 20 that has no real story or character development and is just made to take up time, which is why I don't consider the second half of Full Metal Alchemist "filler," it actually developed a story, even if it diverged from the manga. With that definition you could even say manga has filler (like the chapter on Negima where spoiler[Asuna thinks she's in love with Negi, but finds out she just ate a piece of chocolate made with love potion])
I really don't watch very many long-running anime so I don't have much of an opinion on filler, but I did always enjoy the light-hearted, funny filler episodes of Inuyasha. They did nothing to develop the characters or story, but they were just fun to watch so I didn't care. Bleach is another one I watched with fillers, but I stopped at the end of the Soul Society arc so I didn't see the filler arc after that.[/spoiler] |
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Eruanna
Posts: 451 Location: Canada |
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I think you nailed it actually. My brother and I watched Cowboy Bebop together, and his complaint with the show was "The entire thing is just filler episodes!" But I have to disagree, because some shows just are not designed to be one long running plot. Its not just anime, its all TV series. Some are episodic in nature, with each episode intended to be a stand alone complete story, whereas other shows are intended to be one long story spanning several episodes. Anime tends to be largely the second form, so fans can easily get used to it and be a bit put off by episodic shows. Personally I watch a lot of Star Trek and Stargate, which are great examples of a show inherently episodic, so Im used to the form and it dosnt bother me. But the point is that you cannot by any means call a show that is MEANT to be episodic "filler", but its different if the show is supposed to be spanning many episodes in one storyline (or various story "arcs") |
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Veoryn87
Posts: 808 |
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Sometimes I wonder if these people watch live-action series, like the ones prevailent in the U.S. They're almost all episodic like the ones you just mentioned (Star Trek: TNG rules by the way), yet no one complains one bit. If an anime does it, uh oh! |
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Jori-Ness
 Posts: 7 Location: Sacramento, California |
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At first I hated filler episodes, but I realized as you did- they're fun and help to develop a character. I watch Fullmetal Alchemist and they have several filler episodes that have absolutely nothing to do with the series, but they're all good episodes that end up meaning something later. I guess it depends on the anime and its manga, and if the filler is really all that neccesary.
I'm okay with fillers. |
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