×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
NEWS: Viz to Review Portfolios at Comic-Con International


Goto page 1, 2  Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
minakichan





PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 9:33 am Reply with quote
OH MY GOD FOR SERIOUS!?

Is Viz going into OEL?!?! *crosses fingers for NO*

Aaaah I still hope they have folio reviews at other cons.
Back to top
R.G.



Joined: 16 Nov 2003
Posts: 687
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 10:46 am Reply with quote
What else do you expect them to publish?


Superhero comics?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
samuelp
Industry Insider


Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 2249
Location: San Antonio, USA
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:12 am Reply with quote
R.G. wrote:
What else do you expect them to publish?


Superhero comics?

To be honest, they might be searching for talent on behalf of the Japanese companies as well. Kodansha has the upper-hand when it comes to getting talent from the west for its domestic Manga market, so maybe shougakugan and/or shueisha actually are looking for some good super-hero comics to re-invigorate the Japanese market.
Although it's probably more of a "see what's out there" thing than they are looking for something specific.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
mdo7



Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 6410
Location: Katy, Texas, USA
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:25 am Reply with quote
Geez, what's up with you first two about Viz probably going to do OEL Manga. I don't mind, I kind of like the OEL manga market today. We already see OEL manga from Tokyopop and Del-Rey Manga. It wouldn't hurt for Viz to do a OEL manga. Viz already have Stan Lee and Shaman King creator, Hiroyuki Takei to work on something. I don't see anything wrong with it. Geez, would you stop the hating and give it more loving for Viz Media.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website My Anime My Manga
The Xenos



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 1519
Location: Boston
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:38 am Reply with quote
Ah, Hey again, mdo7. I keep telling you. There is no OEL market. There's just the publishing market. No need to ghettoize graphic novels even further into an artificial 'OEL manga' niche. It's bad enough getting America to recognize graphic novels (including manga) without having to slap a foreign name on a domestic product.

OEL is just a cliche that certain companies use to make themselves seem better than anyone else publishing comics in the US. I'm not being a 'hater' as you kept calling me in the other thread. I worry about these books and creators. I think this 'OEL manga' label hurts themselves and the domestic industry much more than it helps. It's a crutch we keep using and I don't think it's strong enough. We need to learn to walk on our own and not rely on some Japanese word to keep our own work standing.

OEL manga is not an art style, genre, or publishing format. It's a buzzword and it pigeon holes creators. How about you just make whatever art style and story you like and don't worry about calling it 'manga' or if it fits those stereotypes? I keep saying, if these OEL books are manga, why don't they look like.. say Crying Freeman or Uzumaki? Why are they mostly generic Naruto shonen clones and maybe some shojo clones? What makes Naruto's art so much better than someone like Neil Adams or Mike Mignola?

If Viz does get into original American content, I find it disturbing that people would prefer to work for a foreign publisher instead of a domestic one. Geez. What ever happened to having some pride in your country and its workforce?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
samuelp
Industry Insider


Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 2249
Location: San Antonio, USA
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:57 am Reply with quote
The Xenos wrote:
Ah, Hey again, mdo7. I keep telling you. There is no OEL market. There's just the publishing market. No need to ghettoize graphic novels even further into an artificial 'OEL manga' niche. It's bad enough getting America to recognize graphic novels (including manga) without having to slap a foreign name on a domestic product.

OEL is just a cliche that certain companies use to make themselves seem better than anyone else publishing comics in the US. I'm not being a 'hater' as you kept calling me in the other thread. I worry about these books and creators. I think this 'OEL manga' label hurts themselves and the domestic industry much more than it helps. It's a crutch we keep using and I don't think it's strong enough. We need to learn to walk on our own and not rely on some Japanese word to keep our own work standing.

OEL manga is not an art style, genre, or publishing format. It's a buzzword and it pigeon holes creators. How about you just make whatever art style and story you like and don't worry about calling it 'manga' or if it fits those stereotypes? I keep saying, if these OEL books are manga, why don't they look like.. say Crying Freeman or Uzumaki? Why are they mostly generic Naruto shonen clones and maybe some shojo clones? What makes Naruto's art so much better than someone like Neil Adams or Mike Mignola?

If Viz does get into original American content, I find it disturbing that people would prefer to work for a foreign publisher instead of a domestic one. Geez. What ever happened to having some pride in your country and its workforce?

Are you seriously suggesting that an artist trying to get their work out there TURN DOWN an offer from a publisher because they aren't from the US?
Maybe for an established artist that has no trouble finding work but for someone up and coming beggars can't be choosers. As long as the contract is fair (hint hint) you should't pass up getting published if given a chance, that'd just be foolish.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
testorschoice



Joined: 28 Apr 2007
Posts: 468
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:17 pm Reply with quote
The Xenos wrote:
If Viz does get into original American content, I find it disturbing that people would prefer to work for a foreign publisher instead of a domestic one. Geez. What ever happened to having some pride in your country and its workforce?


Uh, by this unusual line of thinking, should British creators Neil Gaiman, Alan Moore, and Warren Ellis should refuse work from DC and Marvel because those companies aren't British? Should American creators R. Crumb and Adrian Tomine refuse work from Drawn & Quarterly because it's (gasp) Canadian? Why is it really cool for Felipe Smith to publish in Japan with a Japanese company, but somehow "disturbing" for him or another American creator to publish with a "foreign" company like Viz?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
BellosTheMighty



Joined: 27 Nov 2007
Posts: 767
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 1:01 pm Reply with quote
testorschoice wrote:
The Xenos wrote:
If Viz does get into original American content, I find it disturbing that people would prefer to work for a foreign publisher instead of a domestic one. Geez. What ever happened to having some pride in your country and its workforce?


Uh, by this unusual line of thinking, should British creators Neil Gaiman, Alan Moore, and Warren Ellis should refuse work from DC and Marvel because those companies aren't British? Should American creators R. Crumb and Adrian Tomine refuse work from Drawn & Quarterly because it's (gasp) Canadian? Why is it really cool for Felipe Smith to publish in Japan with a Japanese company, but somehow "disturbing" for him or another American creator to publish with a "foreign" company like Viz?


It goes back even further than that- Samuel Beckett, in a situation that could fit in one of his plays, was born in Ireland, raised mainly in England, Lived in France, and wrote his plays in French (also translated them to English himself, but that's another story). He is claimed by all three nations as one of their great writers. T.S. Eliot was born American, but moved to England and renounced his citizenship over the United States' handling of World War I.

But getting back to the matter at hand- it makes perfect sense that Viz would want to develop stateside talents. The publishers can't rely on Japanese works forever- all it really takes to translate a manga is a guy to do the translation and some other guys to sell it- it won't be long before Japanese publishers decide that they could do it themselves and cut out the middleman. They need to diversify into properties they can own in full. This is a very wise move for Viz, just like it was a wise move for TokyoPop. TP wrecked it with horrible mismanagement- they handled PR badly and focused on developing intellectual properties rather than stories. Viz, however, have shown themselves to have business saavy and a respect for good storytelling, so I suspect they'll do better. I just hope they don't affix the OEL label to any of it- there's nothing wrong with labelling it manga, it's just not practical. The story and art remains the same as if you had called it a graphic novel, but your sales are hurt because of the idiots in cyberspace yell about how you're a poseur or a rip-off artist.

In any event- yeah, bring your portfolios to ComicCon, see what happens.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Xenos



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 1519
Location: Boston
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 1:42 pm Reply with quote
I agree. Graphic novels are the proper English nomenclature for what they're selling. Japanese words aren't needed. As I've always said, I thought we called manga by that native name out of respect to the creators.
samuelp wrote:
Are you seriously suggesting that an artist trying to get their work out there TURN DOWN an offer from a publisher because they aren't from the US?
Maybe for an established artist that has no trouble finding work but for someone up and coming beggars can't be choosers. As long as the contract is fair (hint hint) you should't pass up getting published if given a chance, that'd just be foolish.

I guess I am. I'm thinking of the bigger economic picture. I'm thinking generations down the road. Build up the American industry. Does no one else think it's really bad for us to rely on a foreign companies for our comics? Why can't Americans produce own own books? That we need a giant foreign company to create books for us is a terrible sign. Our economy's bad enough and relying on foreign companies and resources in various fields is a major problem. I don't want to see it happen to the American book industry too.
testorschoice wrote:
Uh, by this unusual line of thinking, should British creators Neil Gaiman, Alan Moore, and Warren Ellis should refuse work from DC and Marvel because those companies aren't British? Should American creators R. Crumb and Adrian Tomine refuse work from Drawn & Quarterly because it's (gasp) Canadian? Why is it really cool for Felipe Smith to publish in Japan with a Japanese company, but somehow "disturbing" for him or another American creator to publish with a "foreign" company like Viz?

Well, that's their personal choice as would these creators choosing from Viz. Actually, isn't Neil and American now? Or maybe he married into it. I know he's somewhere in the mid-west now.

Plus from what I've heard, England's comic market has been standing on its own legs. Right now, the American market is simply dominated by Japanese companies. What is it? 2/3 of call comics sold are manga?

I don't want to sound.. well.. xenophobic, but I do worry about America's economy and specifically the comic book market.

Meanwhile as I type this I have a small bookshelf full of manga that's almost as tall as I am sitting down.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
enurtsol



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 14889
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 2:04 pm Reply with quote
According to the ICV2 interview:

Are you looking for manga-style properties?

If by "manga" you mean what is generally considered manga in the United States (fantasy and romance aimed at teenagers), then no. If by "manga" you mean what is meant by manga in Japan (a broad range of comics that emphasize serial storytelling, cliffhangers, reader feedback, a supportive editorial process, and a rich creator voice), then yes we are.

Do you believe that there is American material that would sell well in Japan?

Certainly. Both countries have their own rich, indigenous graphic-storytelling cultures. There are bridges yet to be built.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
testorschoice



Joined: 28 Apr 2007
Posts: 468
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 2:20 pm Reply with quote
The Xenos wrote:
I agree. Graphic novels are the proper English nomenclature for what they're selling. Japanese words aren't needed. As I've always said, I thought we called manga by that native name out of respect to the creators.


As has been pointed out repeatedly, this is a misconception. No one is giving more "respect" to the Japanese creators by choosing to call Japanese works only "manga" or only "comics." That's because Japanese creators call Japanese works either comics or manga. Plus, Japanese creators call non-Japanese sequential art comics or manga, too. It's a non-issue for the Japanese creators, despite the overseas misconception.

Quote:
I guess I am. I'm thinking of the bigger economic picture. I'm thinking generations down the road. Build up the American industry. Does no one else think it's really bad for us to rely on a foreign companies for our comics?


No more so than for Canada or Australia to "rely" American companies for comics. Why has few raised the issue when other countries "relied" (strange use of that word for non-essential entertainment) on American companies for comics for decades, but not cool for Japanese comic companies to make inroads in America?

Quote:
Why can't Americans produce own own books?


Americans can. Having some American creators choose to go to Viz won't change that.

Quote:
That we need a giant foreign company to create books for us is a terrible sign. Our economy's bad enough and relying on foreign companies and resources in various fields is a major problem. I don't want to see it happen to the American book industry too.


It's already been happening for decades. Look up who owns Del Rey/Random House (Bertelsmann AG), Tor Books (Georg von Holtzbrinck), HarperCollins (News Corporation), Harlequin (Canada-based), and many others. The main difference here is the company is Japanese, not German, Australian, or Canadian.

Quote:
testorschoice wrote:
Uh, by this unusual line of thinking, should British creators Neil Gaiman, Alan Moore, and Warren Ellis should refuse work from DC and Marvel because those companies aren't British? Should American creators R. Crumb and Adrian Tomine refuse work from Drawn & Quarterly because it's (gasp) Canadian? Why is it really cool for Felipe Smith to publish in Japan with a Japanese company, but somehow "disturbing" for him or another American creator to publish with a "foreign" company like Viz?

Well, that's their personal choice as would these creators choosing from Viz. Actually, isn't Neil and American now? Or maybe he married into it. I know he's somewhere in the mid-west now.


That's the point. Some creators will choose Viz Media, just like Alan Moore chose American companies so many years ago. Neil Gaiman chose to immigrate to America and often prefers to work for an American publisher instead of an British one, just as Felipe Smith chooses to immigrate to Japan and prefers to work for a Japanese publisher instead of an American one. There is nothing wrong or "disturbing" about any of these trends.

Quote:
Plus from what I've heard, England's comic market has been standing on its own legs. Right now, the American market is simply dominated by Japanese companies. What is it? 2/3 of call comics sold are manga?

I don't want to sound.. well.. xenophobic, but I do worry about America's economy and specifically the comic book market.


The people complaining about Japanese comics making inroads into the American comic market would carry more weight and earn less skepticism if they had also complained that American comics were "dominating" England's comic market during those decades.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tasogarenootome



Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 593
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 4:06 pm Reply with quote
enurtsol wrote:
According to the ICV2 interview:
[i]
Are you looking for manga-style properties?

If by "manga" you mean what is generally considered manga in the United States (fantasy and romance aimed at teenagers), then no. If by "manga" you mean what is meant by manga in Japan (a broad range of comics that emphasize serial storytelling, cliffhangers, reader feedback, a supportive editorial process, and a rich creator voice), then yes we are.


Thank you for posting this for clarification of Viz's intentions. I really, really hate that it explodes into this big debate over "OMG They're calling it manga/OEL/whatever!" everytime some news about this appears. Those names are for the marketing people, let them have at them. If something looks interesting, read it. And I really hope talented potential artists will not be deterred and will take their portfolios to events like this.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hon'ya-chan



Joined: 31 Jul 2007
Posts: 973
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 7:05 pm Reply with quote
tasogarenootome wrote:
And I really hope talented potential artists will not be deterred and will take their portfolios to events like this.


Other than Fred Gallagher and Adam Warren, the rest of the group have been talentless and completely insipid. Look at most of TOKYOPOP's OEL line. Alot either try to emulate the Manga style, or have artwork extremely bizzarre, one has to wonder if they read alot of Heavy Metal magazine.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tasogarenootome



Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 593
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 7:42 pm Reply with quote
Hon'ya-chan wrote:

Other than Fred Gallagher and Adam Warren, the rest of the group have been talentless and completely insipid. Look at most of TOKYOPOP's OEL line. Alot either try to emulate the Manga style, or have artwork extremely bizzarre, one has to wonder if they read alot of Heavy Metal magazine.

I'll agree with you there. I've really been disappointed with a lot of the "OEL" offerings thus far, I was really hoping for more.

My point is that I hope future artists won't be afraid to take that chance and offer up their portfolios instead of being turned off by this idea that OEL is some horrible wanna-be manga market that only posers submit work to. The only way it will improve is with new artists not afraid to work in their own style causing it to grow.

I really feel that OEL does have the potential to target markets that manga seems to hit, but that have been left behind by American companies such as DC and Marvel.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
musashi1600



Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 198
Location: Hawaii
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:07 pm Reply with quote
If Viz wants to try to find some original artists they can publish, that's their call and I have no problem with that. As a buyer of these prospective works, I only hope that Sturgeon's Law is kind to them. Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group