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ChirashiD
Joined: 11 Oct 2006
Posts: 186
Location: WA
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 Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2024 7:12 pm
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The premise and art seems nice but I don't understand why we need a fictional world with those additional mechanisms of sexuality. We could still have a love triangle involving a boy, girl and an NB without those. It just gives the sense that these romantic interactions aren't possible in our reality and that non-binary people don't really exist enough to matter in most people's mental landscape. I think the reviewer hit on a good point about disturbing developments that despite those fictional gender mechanics, its still implied one will never have peace with being non-binary.
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Altorrin
Joined: 24 Dec 2007
Posts: 321
Location: Florida, United States
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Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2024 9:02 pm
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The idea that someone's feelings for someone might cease if that person's gender becomes incompatible with their orientation is not weird or cruel, but actually really common and normal, as most people are not bi.
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AAA-Spear
Joined: 20 Jul 2024
Posts: 1
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Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 9:29 am
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| Altorrin wrote: | | The idea that someone's feelings for someone might cease if that person's gender becomes incompatible with their orientation is not weird or cruel, but actually really common and normal, as most people are not bi. |
I mean it's cruel to confess to someone who they know might end up with a gender they wouldn't want to date. Like at that point they should hold off on confessing to them until they know they're compatible with them.
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R. Kasahara
Joined: 19 Feb 2013
Posts: 703
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Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2024 3:19 pm
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| ChirashiD wrote: | | The premise and art seems nice but I don't understand why we need a fictional world with those additional mechanisms of sexuality. We could still have a love triangle involving a boy, girl and an NB without those. It just gives the sense that these romantic interactions aren't possible in our reality and that non-binary people don't really exist enough to matter in most people's mental landscape. I think the reviewer hit on a good point about disturbing developments that despite those fictional gender mechanics, its still implied one will never have peace with being non-binary. |
Yeah, this. I'm also glad the reviewer brought this up. I'm not comfortable with the idea of the main character having to choose a binary option to fulfill a romance requirement, especially if that choice is something they don't want to do.
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Hellsoldier
Joined: 21 Jun 2013
Posts: 814
Location: Porto,Portugal,Europe,Earth,Sol
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Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 12:03 pm
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Anybody here ever watched Simoun? This more or less reminds me of that anime.
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Nekbone
Joined: 28 Dec 2023
Posts: 42
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Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 12:15 pm
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| Hellsoldier wrote: | | Anybody here ever watched Simoun? This more or less reminds me of that anime. |
Never thought I'd see someone else reference Simoun in 2024.
I've never read this manga but it sounds more 'serious' than Simoun was.
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SHD
Joined: 05 Apr 2015
Posts: 1759
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Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 1:07 pm
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| ChirashiD wrote: | | The premise and art seems nice but I don't understand why we need a fictional world with those additional mechanisms of sexuality. We could still have a love triangle involving a boy, girl and an NB without those. It just gives the sense that these romantic interactions aren't possible in our reality and that non-binary people don't really exist enough to matter in most people's mental landscape. |
It's because not every place in the world is as accustomed and open to discussing sexuality and gender identities as wherever you are, especially teenagers, but even adults. A love triangle involving an openly non-binary person would be unrelatable to most people in my society (which is naturally not something that I, a gender-uninterested person, am happy about, but that aside), because never mind teenagers, even most adults' understanding of non-hetero, non-binary sexuality and gender stops at "gay/lesbian" and "woman/man who wants to be a man/woman", alternatively "gender-switcher" (= trans). Hell, it would have to be shrinkwrapped and not be allowed to be sold to teenagers to begin with, because we have an amazing law that forbids making works featuring "homosexuality for its own sake" and "advertising gender switching" available to people under 18.
Making a story that puts a very small distance between one's world and whatever the writer wants to communicate actually helps some people's understanding, and helps them process the messages... And while it probably wasn't the author's intention (Japan not having miserable laws like my country) it may just help getting some things past censors, while at it.
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xxmsxx
Joined: 06 Sep 2017
Posts: 599
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Posted: Sun Jul 21, 2024 3:54 pm
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| ChirashiD wrote: | | but I don't understand why we need a fictional world with those additional mechanisms of sexuality. We could still have a love triangle involving a boy, girl and an NB without those. |
I agree. But I think if this were to have a real-world setting, then the author will have to do real research about psychology, sociology, how legislation impact people's lives on a day-to-day basis etc, like the rules of the real world. Instead of doing that, just make up you own rules to suit your story and no need to really research anything. Cuts out a lot work.
| Nekbone wrote: |
| Hellsoldier wrote: | | Anybody here ever watched Simoun? This more or less reminds me of that anime. |
Never thought I'd see someone else reference Simoun in 2024. |
So I am not the only one who has watched Simoun and thinks it is kind of similar.
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ChirashiD
Joined: 11 Oct 2006
Posts: 186
Location: WA
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Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2024 11:03 am
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| SHD wrote: | | It's because not every place in the world is as accustomed and open to discussing sexuality and gender identities as wherever you are, especially teenagers, but even adults. A love triangle involving an openly non-binary person would be unrelatable to most people in my society. |
Irregardless of where I am (Thailand ATM), what matters is the Japanese audience from the author's perspective. Which is probably similar to the sex binary, heteronormative ideals of your environment.
| xxmsxx wrote: | | I agree. But I think if this were to have a real-world setting, then the author will have to do real research about psychology, sociology, how legislation impact people's lives on a day-to-day basis etc, like the rules of the real world. |
Yes you are absolutely right the necessities of creative world building are there as a shortcut to doing research on real-life, kind of like what goes on in many isekai shows and manga (which I have no problem with myself).
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FishLion
Joined: 24 Jan 2024
Posts: 209
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Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2024 11:50 am
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We will have to see how the stories and themes develop in this one. I can see how the fantasy aspects may make it seem like nonbinary people are a fantastic existence or that they are forced to choose one of two binary options to achieve peace and normality, I am with the reviewer that (based on how it's described) it could come across as representing the discomfort that such people feel in a society that wants to force a choice. I feel that discomfort all the time, so I really hope it is playing into that idea that and whether, or whichever, sex the main character chooses they still don't neatly fit into the category.
Something interesting I could see happening is they continue to act in ways that would be considered boyish and girlish after the body issue is settled. Like maybe Hinase decides they want to keep the current body but still decides to go out with the dude. The love interest figures they are just warming up to choosing a sex, but says sure they can go out. Then they go out for a long time and the guy realizes that Hinase is just happy that way, that they are not dating him as some way to psych themselves up for being a girl, and that if he loves them, he will have to learn to accept that he is now a man who is partnered with someone who isn't a woman (which some people take as a huge threat to their masculinity) and not hurt Hinase by wanting them to be different.
I would love if that sort of examination is where the series went, here's hoping~
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