×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
NEWS: UK Virtual Child Porn Ban Takes Effect on Tuesday


Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Otaku_X



Joined: 25 Nov 2008
Posts: 298
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:07 am Reply with quote
What's this world coming to?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Shichimi



Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 349
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:14 am Reply with quote
Before people completely freak out, it would be a good idea to go through this PDF.

Consultation on the Possession of Non-Photographic Visual Depictions of Child Sexual Abuse (pg.11) wrote:
It is not our intention to criminalise possession of material which it would be lawful to publish in the UK (material which would not fall foul of the Obscene Publications Act). To that end we envisage the offence having a third element to it, namely that the material caught is of an obscene character. It should be noted that this third element to the offence was not proposed in the consultation paper, but has been included to ensure that the offence catches the intended material.


So there's no need to stop reading Negima! et al just yet! Where US imports of anime and such stand, I'm not too certain. As they won't have been BBFC rated, this could be a bit of a grey area? Confused

Consultation on the Possession of Non-Photographic Visual Depictions of Child Sexual Abuse (pg.10) wrote:
In the case of non-photographic depictions of the sexual abuse of children, the offence will outline a number of specifi c acts in order to provide clarity and precision. To some extent, this threshold will be based on the scale of seriousness in the Court of Appeal Sentencing Guidelines (R v Oliver and others (2003) 2 Cr.App.R(S) 15) and the revised guidance, published by the Sentencing Guidelines Council.6 The offence should criminalise nonphotographic visual images depicting the following:
• An image which focuses excessively on a child’s genitalia
• A person of any age performing an act of intercourse or oral sex with a child
• An act of masturbation by, of or involving a child
• Penetration of the vagina, anus or mouth of a child with a part of the person’s body or
with anything else
• Bestiality involving a child


Anyone surfing teh internets for their hentai fix may be in trouble though. I'm assuming 'child' here refers to any person who appears to be under 18 years of age. If you're going to surf for hentai, be damn selective about what you get.


Last edited by Shichimi on Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:23 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime
Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 4660
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:23 am Reply with quote
Shichimi wrote:
Before people completely freak out, it would be a good idea to go through this PDF.

Consultation on the Possession of Non-Photographic Visual Depictions of Child Sexual Abuse (pg.11) wrote:
It is not our intention to criminalise possession of material which it would be lawful to publish in the UK (material which would not fall foul of the Obscene Publications Act). To that end we envisage the offence having a third element to it, namely that the material caught is of an obscene character. It should be noted that this third element to the offence was not proposed in the consultation paper, but has been included to ensure that the offence catches the intended material.


So there's no need to stop reading Negima! et al just yet! Where US imports of anime and such stand, I'm not too certain. As they won't have been BBFC rated, this could be a bit of a grey area? Confused


The thing I noticed from the excerpt is that the term "obscene" has appeared once again. The ambiguity of what is obscene is what gets people worried.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Shichimi



Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 349
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:28 am Reply with quote
Greed1914 wrote:
The thing I noticed from the excerpt is that the term "obscene" has appeared once again. The ambiguity of what is obscene is what gets people worried.


Consultation on the Possession of Non-Photographic Visual Depictions of Child Sexual Abuse (pg. 10) wrote:
The second threshold would be an objective test for the jury in respect of the content of the image. It was suggested in the consultation paper that the threshold for fantasy images should be different from that of ‘indecent’ which is used for images involving real children.


It's up to a jury, it seems.


Last edited by Shichimi on Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:29 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime
GWOtaku



Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 678
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:28 am Reply with quote
The important detail is that it actually is more specific than just banning "obscenity" as a vague term. The relevant details are here (the link should go to section 62 in chapter 2). The most critical parts to pay attention to are 1, 2, 6 and 7, where the bill specifically defines what a prohibited image would be.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Shichimi



Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 349
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:33 am Reply with quote
@ GWOtaku:

Yup yup. If it's on the bullet list, then you are in trouble, sonny jim. Otherwise, it goes to a jury decision as to whether it can be considered 'obscene'. Really, looking at this, it's no big deal and is obviously aimed at getting rid of loli stuff.

BUT the big concern is with certain art styles that concentrate on characteristics belonging to younger people - big eyes, small build etc. Like I said, if you're gonna get hentai off the net, then certain art styles are out I should think.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime
moritheil



Joined: 07 Apr 2010
Posts: 3
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:38 am Reply with quote
I would say it's a little misleading to call this a "child porn ban" as it defines "child" as anyone under 18. This despite the fact that the age of consent in the UK is 16, leading to the weird situation where anyone could legally have actual sex with someone 16-17 but couldn't draw them nude.

Shichimi wrote:
It's up to a jury, it seems.


In practical terms, it's up to whether the cops/prosecutor feels like throwing the book at someone. It's basically a discretionary power.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Ojamajo LimePie



Joined: 09 Nov 2007
Posts: 772
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:01 am Reply with quote
Quote:
• An act of masturbation by, of or involving a child


Goodbye, End of Evangelion. Rolling Eyes
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Shichimi



Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 349
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:06 am Reply with quote
Nope. This stuff does not apply to stuff that can be legally sold in the UK. So if it's cool with the BBFC, it's cool with them.

Please don't freak!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime
CCSYueh



Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 2707
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:14 am Reply with quote
Shichimi wrote:
Nope. This stuff does not apply to stuff that can be legally sold in the UK. So if it's cool with the BBFC, it's cool with them.

Please don't freak!


Have things improved from all those '70's horror movie books in my collection that talk about the extreme censorship in England vs the US & Japan? I recall one of the books had a rather humorous description of an interview with a fan in England after a Hammer Horror where the fan described a very gory scene that never happened (obviously a rich fantasy life) which horrified the film promoters.
The basic premise that movies were released in England pretty tame, More gore added for the US, & bloodfest for Japan.

I'm freaking. God, we go insane every so often, don't we?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
P€|\||§_|\/|ast@



Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 3498
Location: IN your nightmares
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:15 am Reply with quote
Ojamajo LimePie wrote:
Quote:
• An act of masturbation by, of or involving a child


Goodbye, End of Evangelion. Rolling Eyes
So basically, yeah, anyone in the UK owning a copy of End of Evangelion could wind up in prison. What sort of exceptions, applying to anime or the grandfather rule where formerly authorized retail DVDs and books were purchased before the ban, could allow people to avoid this enforcement?
Shichimi wrote:
Nope. This stuff does not apply to stuff that can be legally sold in the UK. So if it's cool with the BBFC, it's cool with them.
But if it falls within the stipulations of the ban, won't stuff previously determined legal (due to a ban not existing) now become illegal (even a commercially released DVD such as End of Eva)?
I mean it kind of opens floodgates for a lot of things.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail My Anime
Shichimi



Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 349
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:20 am Reply with quote
Past wrote:
Ojamajo LimePie wrote:
Quote:
• An act of masturbation by, of or involving a child


Goodbye, End of Evangelion. Rolling Eyes
So basically, yeah, anyone in the UK owning a copy of End of Evangelion could wind up in prison. What sort of exceptions, applying to anime or the grandfather rule where formerly authorized retail DVDs and books were purchased before the ban, could allow people to avoid this enforcement?


Past, please look at the quotations from the documentation I linked to. If the BBFC approve of a show, and it can be bought, then there is no problem.

CCSYueh, that's gonna happen all the time, isn't it? Right now it seems to be anime's turn, a little before that videogames, and so on... Rolling Eyes

EDIT: LOL, Past, I'm editing to reply to your edit! NO, because the BBFC can't suddenly 'change it's mind' as it were. If they're OK with it, they're OK with it, has always been my (limited! Razz ) understanding. This new stuff doesn't affect how the BBFC rates things, it comes into play when applied to something that has not been looked over by the BBFC.

Reading through the PDF, the thrust of this appears to be stamping out anything that could be looked at as lolicon. It talks about how experts have claimed that such material has a strong chance of being found alongside actual child porn.


Last edited by Shichimi on Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:32 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime
GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 15604
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:24 am Reply with quote
More like goodbye anyone in the UK who owns a copy of "The Aristocrats".

Quote:
If the BBFC approve of a show, and it can be bought, then there is no problem.


Yeah, it really worked out when they decided Bruce Lee with nun-chucks is bad, but Meet the Feebles is fine and dandy. Rolling Eyes
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
P€|\||§_|\/|ast@



Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 3498
Location: IN your nightmares
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:30 am Reply with quote
Ok thank you Shichi-san, but I'll still be on the lookout for tiny trickles from those floodgates Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail My Anime
Shichimi



Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 349
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:39 am Reply with quote
Page 11 wrote:
In addition to non-photographic depictions of child sexual abuse, Campaign to End Rape requested that similar depictions of sexual violence against adults be included in legislation; this sentiment was echoed by Nottinghamshire Multi Agency Public Protection Team. The impact of the proposals on other genres of material was an issue frequently discussed, with many individuals predicting that the proposals could cause an inconsistency in respect of other material that could be deemed inappropriate and that this was a well-founded reason to withhold from taking action in this area.


Forgot to post this. As it says, no action taken, but suggested nonetheless. Although the idea of rape is disgusting and reprehensible, I have to say that even prolonged periods of playing Ninja Gaiden 2 does not make me want to slice people up. Confused

The document goes on to suggest that one reason the new legislation went through is that strong links were identified between lolicon and real CP. Not causally, but that both types of material were found together extremely often, and that's enough for them.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Page 1 of 5

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group